Badass II Questions

scootron · #1 11-19-2011, 01:57 PM

Recently bought a used BAII, and it turns out that three of the saddles have adjustment screws which are frozen (or at least will not move).

I've been using an allen wrench which fits properly. I have tried lubricants and anti-corrosives. One of the allen wrench slots has rounded out.

Not being able to adjust these three screws renders the bridge useless. Does anyone have any good ideas for removing or extracting these adjustment screws (really just short pieces of all-thread)? Soak them in something?

Another question...does anyone know the dimensions for the saddle bolts on the BAII? They are pretty long, and the head is pretty small to fit into the slot at the back of the bridge.

Any help on either or both topics would be greatly appreciated.

georgestrings · #2 11-19-2011, 04:36 PM

Spray them with either PB Blaster or Kroil - those are the best penetrants that I know of... Give that a couple of days to work it's magic, then you *should* be able to turn them out, unless the previous owner used red locktite or something similar on them - in that case, only heat will break them free, which will mess up the chrome...

For the "rounded" one - sometimes, you can go to the next larger size in either metric or standard, and make it work well enough to remove it - other-wise, it'll have to be drilled out, which won't be an easy task by any means - and then a screw extractor used on it... That would be a job for a machine shop, more than likely - given the small size of what you're dealing with, and the fact that those are actually hardened set screws, and not merely "all-thread"...

Good luck,

- georgestrings

GM60466 · #3 11-19-2011, 04:54 PM

a little heat will do the trick

scootron · #4 11-19-2011, 05:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GM60466

a little heat will do the trick

Thanks for the tips. I'll try the penetrant first, then the heat if necessary.

How much are we talking about when we say "a little" heat? Are we talking about a heat shrink gun, or something hotter? Is this just to break the bond of the loctite? Obviously, it would be hard to work on it while it is really hot.

Edit: I don't have any PB Blaster or Kroil, but I have the parts soaking in some CorrosionX, which has a good reputation so far as I can tell.

All of the allen slots seem to be rounded out now, as my .05 wrench doesn't get any traction. And absolutely correct on those being hardened set screws instead of allthread...just about impossible to drill into.

scootron · #5 11-22-2011, 07:40 PM

No dice. Nothing worked. I did get one screw out because one end was sticking out far enough to grab with a pair of vise grips, but the others are still unusable.

Anymore ideas before I make a charm bracelet out of these last five saddles?

spaz21387 · #6 11-22-2011, 07:45 PM

Badass Bridge II - Leo Quan buy replacement saddles for 50$???

scootron · #7 11-22-2011, 09:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spaz21387

Badass Bridge II - Leo Quan buy replacement saddles for 50$???

Not available yet at bestbassgear.com, but I have my name on the waiting list.

bassmeknik · #8 11-22-2011, 09:54 PM

absolutely PB blaster, (or) Kroil, Heat, and Patience. (or) Drill and tap*... they will come out

*Drill press vise required

davegr8house · #9 11-24-2011, 05:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bassmeknik

*Drill press vise required

I work in Tool and Die. This is a job to be very carefull with. If your unsure...STOP! They have what "I" call "Easyouts" where you drill a hole in the rounded out bolt head and then tap lightly the correct easyout into the drilled out hole. The Easyout has teeth that will bite into the steel so now you can take a wrench/Adjustable or what have you and then unscrew the damaged bolt for replacement. A retap may or may not be needed if your carefull but understand that if bolt hole is damaged that it will need to be drilled and tapped which means larger bolt hole and larger screws that could affect how the saddle will work paired with the other correct screw. May or may not be a biggie. Man if your unsure ask around and find someone. It would be very easy to damage the bridge and/or yourself...trust me

. Little things like a loose shirt sleeve or wearing those gloves that you think are safe can cause injury while using any kind of Drill or Press..just saying. Good luck.

Dave

..sorry I`m in management and had to chim in

georgestrings · #10 11-24-2011, 08:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by davegr8house

I work in Tool and Die. This is a job to be very carefull with. If your unsure...STOP! They have what "I" call "Easyouts" where you drill a hole in the rounded out bolt head and then tap lightly the correct easyout into the drilled out hole. The Easyout has teeth that will bite into the steel so now you can take a wrench/Adjustable or what have you and then unscrew the damaged bolt for replacement. A retap may or may not be needed if your carefull but understand that if bolt hole is damaged that it will need to be drilled and tapped which means larger bolt hole and larger screws that could affect how the saddle will work paired with the other correct screw. May or may not be a biggie. Man if your unsure ask around and find someone. It would be very easy to damage the bridge and/or yourself...trust me

. Little things like a loose shirt sleeve or wearing those gloves that you think are safe can cause injury while using any kind of Drill or Press..just saying. Good luck.

Dave

..sorry I`m in management and had to chim in

Solid post, Dave... I would follow this advice if I were you, OP...

- georgestrings

davegr8house · #11 11-24-2011, 03:22 PM

Thanks George,
I remember years ago I was using a Drill Press and was wearing gloves to prevent metal shavings from getting in my fingers...wellll seconds later my glove was ripped " when a Drill Bit grabs fabric it dont let go folks and you`ll be scratching like a cat to get loose", and I was looking for a Bandage

Thats one of those things you only do once...lol. All jokes aside I got real lucky.

georgestrings · #12 11-24-2011, 08:50 PM

Yeah, I'm no stranger to machine shops, Dave - and that's why one of my recommendations was for the OP to take his bridge to one... It's starting to look like he's in over his head - and IMO, it would be better to toss the local machine shop a few bucks to get him bailed out of this - than it would to take a total loss on the bridge by screwing it up, besides the risk of injuring himslef in the process...

I have a few of those bridges, and without actually pulling one(and messing up a good setup), I'm guessing those are 6-32x1/2" set screws - so, they won't be very easy to coax out, being so small - especially if some bonehead used red locktite on them - which it's starting to sound like...

- georgestrings

davegr8house · #13 11-24-2011, 09:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by georgestrings

especially if some bonehead used red locktite on them - which it's starting to sound like...

- georgestrings

LOL!! That would be Bad. I am kinda thinking of upgrading my Bridge on my Jazz Bass. I recently got me a sweet Jazz Bass but I`m not sure I want to mess with it but I need to get another set-up after I choose my Strings. The action on it now is very low and with my attack I`m buzzing as if I were at a Pink Floyd concert. Are you pleased with yours? I understand the holes will line up so no drilling or am I way off on that? Would you do it again I guess I should ask. Thank you for your kind words and take care.

Dave

georgestrings · #14 11-25-2011, 05:38 AM

Hey, Dave - although they're nice bridges, I wouldn't spend that kind of money on one - I didn't buy any of mine new... I do thnk there are several options that are quite an improvement over the typical stock bridge - the Gotoh 210 is one... I'm going to try one of these on my frankenjazz, it looks like a nice, cost effective upgrade:

Fender Classic Vibe '50s Precision Bass Bridge

- georgestrings

davegr8house · #15 11-25-2011, 08:30 AM

Thank you

scootron · #16 11-25-2011, 10:07 PM

Thanks, all, for the sage advice. I've been out of the loop for the Holiday, just not getting back to check the thread.

I'm thinking the machine shop may be the best idea. I liked Dave's idea about drilling into the set screw and then using the easy-out, but I haven't had much luck with drilling into these set screws. They are plenty tough.

Any idea what a machine shop might charge? I don't want to waste these saddles, but it is hard to spend $100 fixing something you can buy for $50. I'm not saying I've never done it, but it was hard.

Growly Lytes · #17 11-26-2011, 12:04 AM

There are people that glue them in place sometimes.So maybe heat.

davegr8house · #18 11-26-2011, 07:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by scootron

Any idea what a machine shop might charge? I don't want to waste these saddles, but it is hard to spend $100 fixing something you can buy for $50. I'm not saying I've never done it, but it was hard.

Thats hard to say. I work at a Injection Molding Facility that of course has their own Tooling Department. If you ask around you might find a Good O`l Boy that does something similar and can hook you up on the side for lunch or a six pack just saying. As far as what a Tooling shop would charge I cant say...but...A new one is $50...used worth say $30...damaged say $20....take a chance for repair and cost. I hate to say it but this might be one of those "Man this really sucks" moments I really do hope not. Ask around and see if someone knows a guy that works in a Tool Shop before you walk in the Front Door. Tooling guy are pretty nice and love to do side projects on their own. I know a guy that made Custom Harley parts on the CNC and would send them off for chrome. He dont work there anymore. He bought his own CNC and is making custom Bike parts and doing well. All that to say Tool Guys love quirky Projects to show off their Skills. Give it a shot but I got a feeling this may be just a lesson learned. Good Luck..

Dave

fhm555 · #19 11-27-2011, 08:48 PM

Any job shop worthy of the name can get those screws out for you no problem. All it really takes is a good quality drill bit that will fit down in the rounded out hex. Drill carefully and slowly all the way through the screw, use plenty of lube and pull the bit up often to clear the chips. Once you get drilled, take a fine punch and collapse the screw into the hole you just drilled.

If you mung up any threads, get a thread chaser or a bottoming tap and run it through the hole to clean them up.

If you need heat, get a pointy tip for your soldering iron, turn it all the way up and put the pointy end down in the ruined hex for a minute or so. This will break red locktite and most corrosion. If there is CA on it, get some debonder and let it soak for a while.

ChasBass · #20 11-27-2011, 09:56 PM

I recently had the same problem after shimming the neck. Don't bother trying classic saddles on this bridge - they sit way too high. I ended up switching the saddles around to get close to the string heights i needed. Some are slightly tilted and on one I had to slip in a small metal shim. This is a BAII installed around 1978.

Good luck.