Battery eater....

AuG · #1 07-25-2006, 02:25 PM

I had a Warwick rockbass that I sold to a buddy of mine, and it's having problems keeping a battery for more than a couple days. Literally, the battery dies after only a few practices and a gig. Is there anything I can do?

guy n. cognito · #2 07-25-2006, 02:49 PM

Is he leaving his instrument cable plugged into the bass all the time? If so, he is essentially leaving the battery on all the time.

EADG mx · #3 07-25-2006, 04:44 PM

Could be that, also try a different kind of battery.

AuG · #4 07-25-2006, 10:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by guy n. cognito

Is he leaving his instrument cable plugged into the bass all the time? If so, he is essentially leaving the battery on all the time.

Nope. I let him know it was active electronics and it's essentially "turned on" if he leaves the cable in.
I've tried Energizer, Duracell, and some Alkaline Enercell batteries from Radio Shack. Could I use a lithium battery? What about rechargeable 9 volts? Copper shielding? I'm open to any ideas.

Thanks guys.

emils · #5 07-25-2006, 10:38 PM

There could be a short somewhere in there and regardless of cable being pluged or not the battery can "see" a closed circuit. Look for stray soldering or wires touching.

pkr2 · #6 07-25-2006, 11:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by emils

There could be a short somewhere in there and regardless of cable being pluged or not the battery can "see" a closed circuit. Look for stray soldering or wires touching.

Except for the fact that it does work with a fresh battery. I suppose it's not written in stone but a battery with a short across it would last only a matter of minutes, generally. Plus the bass shouldn't work at all with a short circuit across the battery.

An electronics tech can check to see if the battery has a current draw with the cord unplugged, using a multimeter, in just a few minutes. If the preamp is still drawing current with the cable unplugged, the preamp will have to be diagnosed to find out why.

I've actually seen a couple of cases where a noob thought that if he unplugged the cord at the amp rather than the bass that he was turning off the preamp.

emils · #7 07-26-2006, 12:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pkr2

Except for the fact that it does work with a fresh battery. I suppose it's not written in stone but a battery with a short across it would last only a matter of minutes, generally. Plus the bass shouldn't work at all with a short circuit across the battery.

An electronics tech can check to see if the battery has a current draw with the cord unplugged, using a multimeter, in just a few minutes. If the preamp is still drawing current with the cable unplugged, the preamp will have to be diagnosed to find out why.

I've actually seen a couple of cases where a noob thought that if he unplugged the cord at the amp rather than the bass that he was turning off the preamp.

When i said "short" I didn't mean that the battery is shorted but the jack could be faulty, where regardles of the cable being plugged the pre-amp is still in the circuit and drawing current.

pkr2 · #8 07-26-2006, 12:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by emils

When i said "short" I didn't mean that the battery is shorted but the jack could be faulty, where regardles of the cable being plugged the pre-amp is still in the circuit and drawing current.

You are right, of course. I wasn't disagreeing with what you said. More like "in addition to" rather than "instead of". It's really nearly impossible to diagnose electronics without the circuit right in front of you. About all that can be done is to suggest possibilities.

On that same note, Wasn't it Ibanez that had a production run where the jack was miswired from the factory and the symptoms were the same as the OP describes?

By the way, Emil, Kudos on your posts here in the forum. They always seem to be well thought out before you throw them out. You are an asset to the forum.

emils · #9 07-26-2006, 01:10 AM

Oh, thank you for that! I try to help if I can, mind you, english is not my first language and sometimes what I'm trying to say doesn't come accross as I intended it to.

And to go back to the question here, I'd check the jack myself first and if there's nothing obvious, wires touching or something, maybe get someone else to check it for you.

Cheers!

AuG · #10 07-26-2006, 01:15 AM

So the best possible option is to take the bass to a luthier or electronics tech and they can diagnose and (presumably) fix the problem?
I've got to get this bass in front of me to check the jack and the soldering before I can justify taking it into a tech and spending the cash. Thanks for the help guys, I appreciate it.

pkr2 · #11 07-26-2006, 07:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by emils

Oh, thank you for that! I try to help if I can, mind you, english is not my first language and sometimes what I'm trying to say doesn't come accross as I intended it to.

And to go back to the question here, I'd check the jack myself first and if there's nothing obvious, wires touching or something, maybe get someone else to check it for you.

Cheers!

I agree with that totally. It's always best to check the simpler possibilities first,

Please don't apologize for your English. I have no problem understanding anything that you've said. English is my first language and I still have plenty of problems making my posts understood. LOL

pkr2 · #12 07-26-2006, 08:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AuG

So the best possible option is to take the bass to a luthier or electronics tech and they can diagnose and (presumably) fix the problem?
I've got to get this bass in front of me to check the jack and the soldering before I can justify taking it into a tech and spending the cash. Thanks for the help guys, I appreciate it.

"So the best possible option is to take the bass to a luthier or electronics tech and they can diagnose and (presumably) fix the problem?"

That would be my suggestion, AuG.
If you don't already have a multimeter, I strongly recommend that you pick one up. You can get one of the el cheapo meters for less than $10.00 at most hardware stores and they will work great for your purposes. If you've never used one, you'll wonder how you ever got along without it.

good luck with your prob. I'm sure you'll get it sorted out OK.

AuG · #13 07-26-2006, 03:49 PM

Chanks guys.

triggerfish · #14 07-31-2006, 09:16 PM

Hello PKR2,
I believe you wrote that Ibanez had a production run where their jacks were mis-wired. Do you have any further info on this? -I'm dealing with that right now. As a matter of course, here is the posting I just left in the "luthier's" division.
Thanks for the help,
Trigger fish
Hello,
I bought a five string ATK new from a shop in Maui probably about 1999. While tone and playability were respectable, an unfortunate issue with the instrument had the battery dead about every week to two weeks without it being plugged in (short in the system that local luthiers could not trace, believing it to be in the motherboard).
As I went out of town for about one month before I discovered this, and as the owner of the shop and I had a mildly adversarial relationship at the time, my short sighted solution was to change the battery, or expect to every time I would plan on playing the instrument. My alternative solution was to leave the majority of the bass playing to my regular bass player.
As careful as I was with it, a band mate pulled the connector off the wires (which was of course an unavoidable eventuality) just before I left Maui last year. The instrument has remained in the closet while I have tracked the bulk of a new CD. Having come from radio shack with new connectors and a soldering gun, I was taken aback to discover the wires disappearing into the motherboard with no immediately obvious place to solder. -with that in mind, i carefully stripped the insulation off the new connector wires, and began that same process on the existing wires (thinking I would twist the pairings) when disaster occured in the form of the negative wire falling/breaking off at the juncture of the motherboard with only the barest nub left (visable only through a jeweler's loop).
Now I don't know what to do. Of course, I was getting this bass together as I need to record some bass tracks to finish a CD, and I have moved from Maui where I left my bass player (I'm a guitarist at heart, and usually leave the thicker strings to fingers dedicated to that playfield).
I do realize that a better solution would be to find the short in the system which probably resides in the mother board, and therein allow me to properly fix the battery connection too.
Any help, -connections to Ibanez, ideas.... would be gratefully received.
Triggerfish

pkr2 · #15 08-01-2006, 07:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by triggerfish

Hello PKR2,
I believe you wrote that Ibanez had a production run where their jacks were mis-wired. Do you have any further info on this? -I'm dealing with that right now. As a matter of course, here is the posting I just left in the "luthier's" division.
Thanks for the help,
Trigger fish
Hello,
I bought a five string ATK new from a shop in Maui probably about 1999. While tone and playability were respectable, an unfortunate issue with the instrument had the battery dead about every week to two weeks without it being plugged in (short in the system that local luthiers could not trace, believing it to be in the motherboard).
As I went out of town for about one month before I discovered this, and as the owner of the shop and I had a mildly adversarial relationship at the time, my short sighted solution was to change the battery, or expect to every time I would plan on playing the instrument. My alternative solution was to leave the majority of the bass playing to my regular bass player.
As careful as I was with it, a band mate pulled the connector off the wires (which was of course an unavoidable eventuality) just before I left Maui last year. The instrument has remained in the closet while I have tracked the bulk of a new CD. Having come from radio shack with new connectors and a soldering gun, I was taken aback to discover the wires disappearing into the motherboard with no immediately obvious place to solder. -with that in mind, i carefully stripped the insulation off the new connector wires, and began that same process on the existing wires (thinking I would twist the pairings) when disaster occured in the form of the negative wire falling/breaking off at the juncture of the motherboard with only the barest nub left (visable only through a jeweler's loop).
Now I don't know what to do. Of course, I was getting this bass together as I need to record some bass tracks to finish a CD, and I have moved from Maui where I left my bass player (I'm a guitarist at heart, and usually leave the thicker strings to fingers dedicated to that playfield).
I do realize that a better solution would be to find the short in the system which probably resides in the mother board, and therein allow me to properly fix the battery connection too.
Any help, -connections to Ibanez, ideas.... would be gratefully received.
Triggerfish

Triggerfish, I dug back through some notes and found that my memory was faulty. A price we pay for becoming older, I'm sorry to say.

The bass that I was thinking of is the Yamaha RBX. Sorry. I should have checked before even mentioning it.

Without a wiring diagram, you probably are going to have a rough time troubleshooting your bass. My suggestion would be just to bite the bullet and find a good electronics tech and let him deal with it. Even the very best luthiers are usually not very well versed in electronics repair simply because the two fields are so totally removed from each other. Of course there are exceptions but they are rare.

I know that's not much help but the preamp in an instrument is by far the most complicated and hard to fathom part of any active bass and I've seen an awfully lot of cases where the preamp was made unrepairable due to failed attempts at a DIY solution.

Wish I could be of more help.

Zeicron · #16 08-01-2006, 08:13 AM

I had the same problem. My NJ Beast pops those batteries like nuggets. It'd be best if you left your guitar unplugged when you're not playing and had the volume set to low on the guitar and high on the amp. Helped me >_>

vindy500 · #17 08-01-2006, 08:16 AM

i leave my jack in my active bass most the time on its stand, its still going after half a year

Jiggybass · #18 08-01-2006, 10:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vindy500

i leave my jack in my active bass most the time on its stand, its still going after half a year

Ya, same here, weird, I never knew that it did anything to the batteries, and it's been over 6 months, and I have never had to change my battery...hmm

triggerfish · #19 08-01-2006, 04:19 PM

Many thanks for the replies.
I agree with your notion that an electronics guy is the way to go. I really had to restrain myself from trying to modify after I pulled the board last night, but no harm was done.
Triggerfish

Herman · #20 08-01-2006, 05:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jiggyjazz24bass

Ya, same here, weird, I never knew that it did anything to the batteries, and it's been over 6 months, and I have never had to change my battery...hmm

Same here. My L2K's active circuit will only draw about 2 microamps from the battery with the cable plugged in and no signal to the preamp from the pups. At this rate, it could sit for months (or years) and the battery would still be fine. Don't know about Warwicks specifically but I don't see why they'd be that different - it'd be a poor design to have a large amount of standby current drawn from the battery with no input signal to the preamp.