Can dead spots be fixed?

[kevteop]

I've got two '90s basses here with dead spots in the same place (7th fret, G string), one's a neck-through Warwick Thumb, the other a Stingray fretless. The Thumb's not too bad but it's noticeable especially with octave effects, the Stingray is really dead there.

Can anything be done to improve them?

Hmm... Just thought: I always string both with the same strings (66 Rotos) - could it just be the strings that are the issue?

Any advice much appreciated. The thumb needs to go in for some fretwork soon anyway so I could potentially get this sorted out at the same time if anything can be done.

[Trevorus]

I have heard properly seated frets can make a big difference in the tone of a guitar/bass. May go there with the refret.

[Parabolic Box]

No real way to fix dead spots. Some would say something like a Groove Tubes Fat Finger... I have one stuck onto my bass right now. Guess how effective it is.

[kevteop]

Originally Posted by Trevorus

I have heard properly seated frets can make a big difference in the tone of a guitar/bass. May go there with the refret.

Agh... The one that's really suffering is fretless.

Originally Posted by Parabolic Box

No real way to fix dead spots. Some would say something like a Groove Tubes Fat Finger... I have one stuck onto my bass right now. Guess how effective it is.

It's a shame - this 'ray is the nicest fretless I've played but for this one flaw.

So is it more to do with the wood used than the construction, then? I've just got a duff chunk of pau ferro or maple in there somewhere? I've never really understood why dead spots happen.

[EagleMoon]

I've heard that it can sometimes be caused by the trussrod pressing against the fingerboard. You might want to try loosening it a little bit and see if that helps.

[invisaman75]

I was told adding more mass makes it less dead. I don't notice it as much on my P bass with the Badass Bridge but the one without it is really dead in the same place you described.

[kevteop]

OK well some ideas at least. I suppose I'll have to bring it up with my local luthier and see if he can improve things.

Thanks guys.

[Parabolic Box]

Originally Posted by kevteop

It's a shame - this 'ray is the nicest fretless I've played but for this one flaw.

So is it more to do with the wood used than the construction, then? I've just got a duff chunk of pau ferro or maple in there somewhere? I've never really understood why dead spots happen.

Wood resonance in the neck soaking up some frequencies. It seems to be a bigger problem in bolt-ons than other types of construction. If you do a search, there's a few topics about dead spots, and how they're basically unavoidable in Fenders and MMs. You can only get rid of it if you replace the neck with a graphite neck, a laminated neck, or something like that.

[jrfrond]

In a word, no. Well, not REALLY. You can make it BETTER, but the typical dead-zone on a 34" scale bolt-on bass, from the 4th fret to the 8th on the G string, is just an anomaly of the instrument.

I recently had a customer with an MIA '75 RI Jazz Bass (under warranty) come to my shop because he was SUPER unhappy. Fender had replaced the neck under warranty at another (very reputable) NYC shop, to no avail, so he came to our shop looking for help. After speaking to the guitar tech at Fender, I convinced them to let ME call the shots and do what I have done before, which is to switch to a bridge with more mass AND go up one gauge in strings. So, I installed a BadAss II and 50-105 strings, plus performed a careful setup to get the neck to play dead-flat for the easiest handling with the thicker strings. The dead spot was REDUCED a great deal, but did not go away totally. Customer was happy, so was Fender, and so was I. BUT.....it still is an anomaly that is here to stay. I've also seen it on graphite-reinforced necks too.

[MysticMichael]

Originally Posted by jrfrond

In a word, no. Well, not REALLY. You can make it BETTER, but the typical dead-zone on a 34" scale bolt-on bass, from the 4th fret to the 8th on the G string, is just an anomaly of the instrument.

I recently had a customer with an MIA '75 RI Jazz Bass (under warranty) come to my shop because he was SUPER unhappy. Fender had replaced the neck under warranty at another (very reputable) NYC shop, to no avail, so he came to our shop looking for help. After speaking to the guitar tech at Fender, I convinced them to let ME call the shots and do what I have done before, which is to switch to a bridge with more mass AND go up one gauge in strings. So, I installed a BadAss II and 50-105 strings, plus performed a careful setup to get the neck to play dead-flat for the easiest handling with the thicker strings. The dead spot was REDUCED a great deal, but did not go away totally. Customer was happy, so was Fender, and so was I. BUT.....it still is an anomaly that is here to stay. I've also seen it on graphite-reinforced necks too.

John is correct. There are things you can do to ameliorate the effect of dead spots on your bass guitar. But they're nearly impossible to eliminate entirely.

My two main instruments are late-model Carvin LB70 four-strings - one fretted, the other fretless. In addition to having BadAss II bridges installed, I've been using a Groove Tubes FatFinger on each one. The FatFinger has helped enliven the dead spots on each instrument significantly, especially the fretted bass, but noticeably on the fretless as well. I'll soon transition to using heavier gauge strings on the G string and D string, from .040 and .060, to .045 and .065, respectively. Not just to address the dead spots, but also because the G string in particular had been sounding a bit thin and wimpy.

I've heard that laminated necks tend to reduce the prevalence of dead spots as well (supposedly because they provide multiple frequency resonance points, hence a compensating effect), although I can't speak to that from experience. All my basses have single-wood neck-throughs (my two fretted basses being maple, and my fretless being walnut). Perhaps on my next purchases, I'll get maple neck-throughs with walnut strips, and see how lively they are by comparison...

MM

[kevteop]

Damn.

Well I'm going to have to do something. It's a shame because this neck is such a nice player.

[ga_edwards]

As others have suggested, try a Fat Finger, I had one on one of my cheapies that did the trick, and it doesn't require you to make any irreversible modifications to the instrument either.

However, it's not just simply attached and 'viola'. You need to spend some time 'tuning' it in to find the sweet spot on the headstock, just like those clips on tuners. Some spots on the headstock resonate more and differently to others.

[remo]

there has been some type of dead spot on EVERY bass I have ever played EXCEPT a Modulus VJ with a graphite neck.. but I have even heard of the venerable Modulus graphite neck basses having them.

[fuNKmaster83]

so many urban myths... lets take it to the myth busters

in my short repair/service time i have found that most basses have them!!! some less some more... but when you start extending that scale length more than 36' then things get different in a good way... dead spots are virtually eliminated at 38'+

the wood resonance is a big factor but even with a multi laminate neck there are only less or even more dead spots than in one piece necks!!! only graphite necks don't have dead spots as far as i know!!! i don't know about other non wood necks but status basses don't have dead spots!!! of course a good fret job and setup is always good!!!

[BassmanDk]

Several things to do to reduce the problem, not fix just reduce.
1. fat fingers. Sometimes it works!
2. good vibrations. No not the Beach boys but by a pro luthier. Inspired by Mr. Tobias and Mr. Turner I devoloped together with a luthierbuddy of mine a table that could vibrate basses and guitars to simulate an old instruments' many years of playing. It works!
And sometimes we can move dead spots out of the normal 440hz scale. As in in between notes!

[fuNKmaster83]

does ultra resonance really help dead spots???
i know it can put dirt out of jewelery but dead spots... i have old and very played instruments, have some old and played pieces come and go out of my shop but all have dead spots... even those insanely expensive sadowsky basses!!! but i do know that this method that you are describing brings good or better sound to new instruments (wooden instruments)... its just like that one has to play the instrument to sound good and play it a lot!!!
i know people have good vibes with fodera but there is no way that they are gonna convince me that an extended peg makes a string more stiff or increase tension

like i say these are things for myth busters

[remo]

until they can make a bass with strings that don't vibrate there will never be a dead spot free wood neck bass.

[Frankjohnson]

I have been told, but not tried it yet, that if you intonate the instrument instead of open and 12th fret, at the 5th and 17th fret, it may be a little less noticable. reputable tech friend, who's instruments play fantastic, and is well respected. Hwe also says that it really depends on the instrument.

I had the issue on my new AM Deluxe P bass, and really wanted it set up with flats. I tried two sets, and it wouldn't quite go away. I am using heavy nickle rounds now, and it sounds really good.

The sound isn't what I was after at all, but is really nice. I imagine sometimes, no matter how hard you want the apple pie to taste good, you can't keep putting garlic in it and expecting it to work! Wrong flavor for THAT food item!

[Kirkowitz]

I've been able to move dead spots by adding the fat finger to the headstock. You could experiment with a well padded pair of vice grips on the headstock to see what happens to the dead spot. It may move to a worse location. Somewhere I remember seeing large brass plates that attach to the back of the headstock. I think the tuning machines held it on....never tried one of those....

[BassmanDk]

Originally Posted by Frankjohnson

I imagine sometimes, no matter how hard you want the apple pie to taste good, you can't keep putting garlic in it and expecting it to work!

"Dinner at your house tonight" you say?

Hmmm i've got other plans!!!