changing the truss rod nut, how to? tips?

[therex]

well the title explains it very well, i am going to replace the truss rod nut
reason: i stripped my truss rod nut long ago and i guy installed a new one, that he made himself, this nut used a bigger key than usual and it cant be adjusted much so my neck has 1mm of relief.
bass: squier VM p bass 2007
new truss rod nut:
http://www.guitarcenter.com/Fender-B...49-i1133855.gc

but i just realised i have no idea on how to do this, or atleast i dont have enough info
also i want to know tips on making things the right way, and what could be the reason for the actual nut to be too hard to adjust after some point(its impossible to turn anymore after this point. i have waited days and even so. also it was easier at the first 1/4s of turns, wich i gave one every 2 days)

extra info: a pro luthier is not really an option around here. or even far away. also how hard can it be?
PS sorry for my english

[62bass]

They're usually easy to remove. Just use the correct sized truss rod wrench and back it off counter clockwise until it comes off the threaded truss rod. To put the new one on you basically do the reverse--put the new nut on the rod and using the coorrect sized wrench for that nut, turn it clockwise. Be careful when starting the new nut that it doesn't get cross threaded.

Your truss rod may be hard to turn because you've bottomed out the nut and you don't have enough room inside to turn it any more. Don't force it beyond this point or you could damage the nut or, worse still, the threaded rod. If the nut has bottomed out, there is a fairly easy fix that can be done to give the nut more "purchase" or room for turning and thereby more tension. It involves putting a few small washers onto the rod before installing the new nut. I've done it myself on several old instruments and it's always worked. But, if you aren't comfortable doing it you should get some help. Somewhere on the internet there might be a pictorial explanation of this method that is easy to follow, but I don't know of one. A guitar repair tech showed the trick to me back in the 70s. The hardest part has been finding small washers that will fit inside the hole for the truss rod nut, but a good search through hardware stores will usually find something.

Make sure you slack off the strings so they aren't putting tension on your neck when adjusting.

[therex]

Originally Posted by 62bass

They're usually easy to remove. Just use the correct sized truss rod wrench and back it off counter clockwise until it comes off the threaded truss rod. To put the new one on you basically do the reverse--put the new nut on the rod and using the coorrect sized wrench for that nut, turn it clockwise. Be careful when starting the new nut that it doesn't get cross threaded.

Your truss rod may be hard to turn because you've bottomed out the nut and you don't have enough room inside to turn it any more. Don't force it beyond this point or you could damage the nut or, worse still, the threaded rod. If the nut has bottomed out, there is a fairly easy fix that can be done to give the nut more "purchase" or room for turning and thereby more tension. It involves putting a few small washers onto the rod before installing the new nut. I've done it myself on several old instruments and it's always worked. But, if you aren't comfortable doing it you should get some help. Somewhere on the internet there might be a pictorial explanation of this method that is easy to follow, but I don't know of one. A guitar repair tech showed the trick to me back in the 70s. The hardest part has been finding small washers that will fit inside the hole for the truss rod nut, but a good search through hardware stores will usually find something.

Make sure you slack off the strings so they aren't putting tension on your neck when adjusting.

what kind of washers? metal washers like this?
http://www.smoothdrag.com/pic/3.jpg
or soft ones like the the ones in strapbuttons?
also, any pic would be very helpfull on how the washer shoul look compared to the truss rod nut
thanks!

[62bass]

Originally Posted by therex

what kind of washers? metal washers like this?
http://www.smoothdrag.com/pic/3.jpg
or soft ones like the the ones in strapbuttons?
also, any pic would be very helpfull on how the washer shoul look compared to the truss rod nut
thanks!

Yes, like the ones in the link. The problem is finding them with a small enough outside diameter, but they're out there. Usually 3 are enough to do it although a couple times I used 4.

[therex]

what about the inside diameter(thas the hole in the washers), does it matters? since i dont have idea of how the truss rod nut and the truss rod itself work together.

[62bass]

Originally Posted by therex

what about the inside diameter(thas the hole in the washers), does it matters? since i dont have idea of how the truss rod nut and the truss rod itself work together.

The inside diameter just has to be large enough to fit over the threaded rod. Once you get the nut off you can see.

Bring the nut with you when you look for washers. Get a washer the same outside diameter as the nut. The important things are that the washers fit in the hole and the inside diameter will fit over the truss rod.

[therex]

i just noticed something. to take the truss rod nut i have to loose it right? but it ist bad for the neck to take more than 1/4 a day?, the same when i put it back, can i give it just 2 turns like that?
also whould i remove the nut with strings on or off?

[62bass]

Originally Posted by therex

i just noticed something. to take the truss rod nut i have to loose it right? but it ist bad for the neck to take more than 1/4 a day?, the same when i put it back, can i give it just 2 turns like that?
also whould i remove the nut with strings on or off?

No it isn't bad for the neck. Otherwise a tech couldn't do proper setups without having to wait 2 weeks to slowly slacken off the neck. When you put it back on tighten the truss rod until it starts to give you resistance. Then tune the strings up to pitch and after it stays in tune for a short while, check to see if there is too much or not enough relief in the neck. Then adjust the truss rod accordingly. Sometimes it takes a day or so for the neck to stabilize and that's probably where that 1/4 turn a day nonsense came from.

There is a lot of false or only partly true information that gets passed along on the internet and by word of mouth. It gets altered by someone who doesn't understand it and then passed along, to be altered again. Get a good book or video from Stewart McDonald on setting up instruments and you'll usually get the facts and slowly start understanding all this stuff. It's always good if you can properly maintain your instrument.

If you don't know what "relief" is or any other terms, then you really do need to get some of that info from the Stew Mac site. It eventually all makes sense.

[therex]

i do understand most fo what you say
i know what relief is, i have lots of it in my bass
also what could be the cause that the actual nut is bottomed? maybe the nut was too short? because it was a nut that a luthier made himself, or atleast he told me so

[GlennW]

The probable cause is that the rod wasn't threaded enough to allow for squished wood. The nut turns on the threads. When it gets to the end of the threads it stops turning because there are no more threads. At this point some people don't realize what's happening so they take the King Kong approach and keep trying to force it to turn, and screw it up.

It's likely that it was ok at first, but over time the nut squished the wood it seats on, so it goes further than intended. This is where the washers come in; they effectively fill the space where the wood was squished and then the nut will bottom out on the washers and not run out of threads.

[therex]

that help me alot in undertanding the truss rod
thanks dude
lucky me, i am too weak to damage the rod

[therex]

guys i am having another trouble. i cant loose the truss rod, i loose it around 1/8 of turn but now is imposible to turn it anymor, and yes i am sure i am doing it in the right direction, HELP!! guys!! i dont want to have to sell this bass!!

[62bass]

Originally Posted by therex

guys i am having another trouble. i cant loose the truss rod, i loose it around 1/8 of turn but now is imposible to turn it anymor, and yes i am sure i am doing it in the right direction, HELP!! guys!! i dont want to have to sell this bass!!

If you're turning it counterclockwise it should loosen and come right off.

I've never had that problem with a truss rod nut.

I think you should take it to someone with some experience with it and get some help. I suppose it is possible the threads are completely wrecked near the end but I doubt it. After all, it got threaded on okay.

[therex]

what could be the problem guys?
if may have to sell this bass and just buy another one if i dont solve this

[62bass]

If I had the bass in front of me I could find out what's going on, but I don't, which is why I suggest you get someone who knows how take a look at it.

It's possible that the nut is just stuck against the wood in the neck, but I can't look at it and check to see.

Maybe someone else here has a bright idea.

You can't sell a bass with a screwed truss rod and expect to get any money, not if you're honest with the buyer. Replacing a truss rod is too expensive. A new neck, if it's a bolt on, is usually cheaper.

[therex]

i am definetly saying why i am selling the bass, maybe i will just sell the body to a luthier in training, besides this bass is kind of expensive here(400$) and i buyed it for 250$ so dont see a big loss in selling here, but i rather keep this one
also how do i know id the nut is "just stuck against the wood in the neck"?
i know you cant tell me what the problem is, but can you tell me some possible problems that can be solved by any decent luthier or byself? sorry if i am annoying with that many post and grammar mistakes but i love this bass and you are the only one that is helping here

[GlennW]

Don't know; first, make sure you're using the correct size tool, almost or "as close as I have" won't cut it; then go as far as you can ccw and try to lightly force it a little; back off, turn ot cw just to make sure it moves; turn ccw again and try to go a little further...keep doing that, it might unhang itself.

Maybe the nut got buggered on the end by being over tightened and running out of threads. The ccw and cw repetitions might work.

[therex]

Originally Posted by GlennW

Don't know; first, make sure you're using the correct size tool, almost or "as close as I have" won't cut it; then go as far as you can ccw and try to lightly force it a little; back off, turn ot cw just to make sure it moves; turn ccw again and try to go a little further...keep doing that, it might unhang itself.

Maybe the nut got buggered on the end by being over tightened and running out of threads. The ccw and cw repetitions might work.

yes i am using the correct tool,
more details here
the truss rod was loosed about 1/8 of turn and then become realy hard to keep moving, now i tighet 1/8 of turn and becomes hard again so i try to get back to loose 1/8 and i got the same problem

[BillyRay]

I have a bass that did the exact same thing: previous owner tightened the nut way too much and it got stuck. It would only tighten more (probably because it was out of threads and only spun there on the rod) with a lot of effort.

What I did was to take the largest hex key available, I rammed that into the hole using a mallet and then muscled it out of there. It was a very bad idea altough it worked. Take it to a luthier or maybe even to a mechanic who is handy with frozen nuts. There's not a lot you can do yourself unless you're ready to trash the bass (I know I was).

PS: Another remedy I've read about is to apply A LOT of heat to the nut via something like a heat gun: the nut will expand while the rod will stay relatively cool making it easier to remove.

[therex]

i am done with this bass guys , unless someone gots any idea of what could the problem be and maybe knows a way i can repair it, a pro is not really an option, if i found one i will just take my bass to him/her
i am going to see how much money i can get from selling it, the hardware parts are quite expensive here so i could sell them to diferent people, or just sell the full bass, also i am sure this bass can be repaired but i really preffer having an all new instrument(wich could be the same or a MIM p bass)