Does low action automatically mean looser strings?

[terribilino]

I got a fair price on a used Highway One Fender Precision, but the action seemed way too high in the shop. I told them I'd take it if they put flats on it (the rounds on it weren't in the best shape, and I wanted flats) and took the action down. The guy I talked to said lowering the action would be no problem at all, but when I took the bass home, it seemed as if his colleague (the owner) had just slapped on new strings without touching the action.

I remember another one of the guy's colleagues had told me, when I complained that the strings on my bass (another bass) seemed a tad floppy, that lowering the action was always going to do that, and that it was a trade-off. He also said that the floppier strings were actually considered a good thing, which made me think that he was talking about guitars, not basses.

Is this a common problem, that guitar techs don't know much about setting up a bass? I freely admit it could be my own ignorance - I've only been playing bass about a year and a half - but it seems to me that low action with tight strings (flats, for chrissake!) shouldn't be beyond modern technology.

I'm thinking of going back tomorrow and asking them to lower the action as much a they can - they'd do it, I don't think they're complete jerks, just a bit lazy. But what if they hand me the same 'trade-off' line? Is it true? Can I only have lower action at the cost of floppier strings?

Thanks!

[kreider204]

Do yourself a favor - buy some alan wrenches and lower the action yourself. Do not waste your time and money on these guys.

[JackANSI]

No, lowering the action has no effect on open string tension (if the strings are in tune before and after the lowering).

After lowering you will also want to recheck the intonation.

[BobaFret]

No, that is not necessarily true. Strings have different tensions. DR Low-Riders for example are specifically made to be set to lower action. They have a higher tension so they don't flop. What's best for you is based entirely based on how you play and what you like the 'feel' to be.

[MysticMichael]

Originally Posted by terribilino

I remember another one of the guy's colleagues had told me, when I complained that the strings on my bass (another bass) seemed a tad floppy, that lowering the action was always going to do that, and that it was a trade-off. He also said that the floppier strings were actually considered a good thing, which made me think that he was talking about guitars, not basses.

Sounds like a load of jive to me...

Originally Posted by terribilino

Is this a common problem, that guitar techs don't know much about setting up a bass?

No. It's a common problem among douchebags who don't want to be bothered to do a good job for a customer. The guitar and the bass guitar are structurally similar enough so that a tech who is competent on one should also be competent on the other. The principles are the same, the difference is in the size and scale...

MM

[P. Bass]

Originally Posted by terribilino

I got a fair price on a used Highway One Fender Precision, but the action seemed way too high in the shop. I told them I'd take it if they put flats on it (the rounds on it weren't in the best shape, and I wanted flats) and took the action down. The guy I talked to said lowering the action would be no problem at all, but when I took the bass home, it seemed as if his colleague (the owner) had just slapped on new strings without touching the action.

I remember another one of the guy's colleagues had told me, when I complained that the strings on my bass (another bass) seemed a tad floppy, that lowering the action was always going to do that, and that it was a trade-off. He also said that the floppier strings were actually considered a good thing, which made me think that he was talking about guitars, not basses.

Is this a common problem, that guitar techs don't know much about setting up a bass? I freely admit it could be my own ignorance - I've only been playing bass about a year and a half - but it seems to me that low action with tight strings (flats, for chrissake!) shouldn't be beyond modern technology.

I'm thinking of going back tomorrow and asking them to lower the action as much a they can - they'd do it, I don't think they're complete jerks, just a bit lazy. But what if they hand me the same 'trade-off' line? Is it true? Can I only have lower action at the cost of floppier strings?

Thanks!

When you lower the action the strings have less distance to fret contact & therefore require less force to get them there. This basically means it FEELS like less string tension because the string's tension increases as it gets closer to the fret as you fret a note. It's like sharpening the string's pitch w/ the string's tuner.(the sting gets "tighter")

[MysticMichael]

Originally Posted by BobaFret

No, that is not necessarily true. Strings have different tensions. DR Low-Riders for example are specifically made to be set to lower action. They have a higher tension so they don't flop. What's best for you is based entirely based on how you play and what you like the 'feel' to be.

This isn't the point. The point is that changing the action does not change the string tension - one way or the other.

The fact that Lo-Riders are made to be used at low action is irrelevant. They would have the same tension set at any other action...

MM

[Pilgrim]

Setup and string height have NOTHING to do with string tension. The tension required to attain a specific note depends on the length of the scale and the strings you use; the tension required to tune them is completely unrelated to the action and setup.

[Rune Bivrin]

Originally Posted by Pilgrim

Setup and string height have NOTHING to do with string tension. The tension required to attain a specific note depends on the length of the scale and the strings you use; the tension required to tune them is completely unrelated to the action and setup.

Absolutely true, but there's still the small matter of perception. If you have to apply more force to fret cleanly the left hand will very likely percieve the string as less floppy. It won't matter to the right hand, but unless you're clear on how this works the composite effect might wind up floppy.
It's also not unreasonable to percieve the strings as floppier if they rattle against the frets. Once again physics might not neccesarily agree with perception, but then again what, exactly, does "floppy" mean? It's not the most precise term in the science of vibrating bodies.

[BobaFret]

Originally Posted by MysticMichael

This isn't the point. The point is that changing the action does not change the string tension - one way or the other.

The fact that Lo-Riders are made to be used at low action is irrelevant. They would have the same tension set at any other action...

MM

My point was that if he wants really low action they are a good string to use. Bass setup is really not that difficult so I'd skip paying for it anyway.

[conqr]

Originally Posted by P. Bass

When you lower the action the strings have less distance to fret contact & therefore require less force to get them there. This basically means it FEELS like less string tension because the string's tension increases as it gets closer to the fret as you fret a note. It's like sharpening the string's pitch w/ the string's tuner.(the sting gets "tighter")

+1 yup, uh -huh - even a minute reduction in string to fret distance can make a world of difference. Nut slot depth is key in this as well.

[ehque]

Originally Posted by kreider204

Do yourself a favor - buy some alan wrenches and lower the action yourself. Do not waste your time and money on these guys.

+1.