Double thump set up

StuntBacon · #1 02-04-2010, 10:34 PM

Hi there, I'm a bass player who's having a little problem in terms of set up. With my current set up, I cannot double thump on my bass guitar: the strings simply offer too much resistance and it will not go through either way.

I've ruled out that it's (solely) a problem with my technique, because at a Victor Wooten clinic a few months back Victor let me play my bass (this left me understandably flabbergasted, as he just offered when I asked him a question about his bridge. I certainly would not let some 17 year old play my bass if I in his position). I was able to utilize the technique perfectly fine. I asked him what was it about his bass which made it so easy to play, at the same time sounding awesome. He replied that he didn't know, explaining that he had been playing the same bass for the last two decades.

So. I watch his instructional videos, visit websites including his own, and finally ask the frickin' master of the double thumb himself, and HE doesn't know! Not that I wouldn't highly recommend a Wooten clinic, as I presume has been said around 5 trillion times on this forum, he is incredibly inspirational.

...The question I'm laboriously trying to get to is, do any of you know what kind of set-up I should use so I can use this technique, as well as make my overall sound a bit "funkier"?

I play a 5 string Lakland skyline series bass, with Lakland strings, if that's any help.

seamus bass · #2 02-05-2010, 12:40 PM

ive also noticed some of my basses are easier to dbl thumb on, pick-up placement is one obstacle, a jazz bass/p bass set up seems to be the easiest.it allows more access to the area between the neck and pick-up. humbuckers give a resistance. stingray would probably be the best for learning the technique. i have found however that playing over any pick makes for speedy progress. the size of your thumb is a factor as well. long fingers as well(i should have taken up piano).laklands have wide spacing i presume? try a different bass if you can

millerfreak · #3 02-05-2010, 02:46 PM

okay, since i play abit of up down thumb i think i can give you some suggestions.

i realized the string's tension has to be very light, not to mention the flexibility. the height of the strings.. all these small things allow you to do up down thumb easily.

and the last bit that we all never liked.. practice.

about the sound, of course it cant be too boomy.

okay let me give you an idea, this is a video of me playing my own composition, it has some up down thumb in it (at around 1:20) . Notice that when i switched to slapping i sort of changed the EQ (read the video description) ; and i added compressor also. The updown thumb thing works with stingray-sh sound, so it should be doable with your bass. Might want to cut the bass and crank abit of mid and treble. Compressor isnt necessary but its always good to have that to dampen the dynamics.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SzB2Vt9anqY

StuntBacon · #4 02-05-2010, 06:24 PM

Nice Playing Millerfreak. I notice you seem to have a different style of double thumping/plucking to Wooten... it looks like your thumb hits the strings horizontally in relation to the strings rather than vertically. Your style is a bit easier but I had more in mind the Wooten style.

Also it's not the sound which is the problem, simply because I can't get one out! Though I will keep this in mind once I find out how to get my thumb through these accursed strings.

Anyway, the problem seems to be mostly rooted in the strings... I presume they have to be thinner? I think mine are pretty thick. Also how do you make the strings more flexible? Are there any strings any one can recommend me to fix this problem?

Another thing I noticed is that Wooten has his strings through the end of the bridge rather than through the body like I do... I'm aware I've explained that very poorly but as you probably have guessed I'm not great at the setting up aspect of the bass. If anyone knows what I'm talking about, do they know if this helps?

Also seamus bass, could you explain to me why wide spacing would be a problem? If anything, I thought it would help.

Thanks for the replies so far, Millerfreak and Seamus bass

millerfreak · #5 02-05-2010, 08:49 PM

That is because i dont use double pluck like wooten. I'm more into Marcus Miller than wooten in terms of slapping. Wooten hit strings vertically so that he could double pluck easily. And when i do double pluck, i do the same thing.

They got to be thin. Try 0.40, if you're good enough with it, then go to the standard which is 0.45. To make the strings more flexible is to have a regular light or extra light strings. Thats the gauge (hard, medium, regular)

I use sadowsky black labels. Nickel roundwounds. I dont know if thru body affects the strings, but it shouldn't matter because i did double thumb with a lakkie before and it worked fine. Use your bridge pickup by the way, you need somewhat more round and focused sound.

StuntBacon · #6 02-05-2010, 09:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by millerfreak

That is because i dont use double pluck like wooten. I'm more into Marcus Miller than wooten in terms of slapping. Wooten hit strings vertically so that he could double pluck easily. And when i do double pluck, i do the same thing.

Sorry, could you clarify that? The first and last sentences seemed a bit contradictory. What do you do the same thing as, if you don't double pluck like Wooten?

But thank you for your recommendation of Sadowsky strings, I wasn't even aware they made strings, but they're a reputable company when it comes to basses, so I might experiment. I can't remember what size my strings are, can't remember where we put its packaging. But it's definitely thicker than that. So ok, that's the first step, thanks for confirming that.

Anyone have recommendations about the string attachment to the bridge? Am I also neglecting any other aspects of the set up which made Victor's Fodera so different from other basses I've played apart from other indie basses for sale provided by Thump Music which were freakishly good with a freakish amount of strings and a freakish price tag.

rumblethump · #7 02-05-2010, 10:57 PM

Learn how to do your own set up. See sticky #3 for all the answers. Going to lighter gauge strings will require it.

WalterBush · #8 02-05-2010, 11:03 PM

Vic has his own signature set of strings from Fodera. They helped me get my bass set up when I was having problems learning the technique. I liked 'em so much that they're regulars on one of my basses. They're also not that pricey at all.

Order through juststrings.com or similar dealer. Don't order through Fodera's website, under any circumstance. They're just too busy to handle string orders.

Getting Vic's strings helped me isolate at least one variable, and focus on the rest of my setup and my technique. Once you've got the basic thumb technique down, it's easier to apply to different basses, setups, etc.

millerfreak · #9 02-06-2010, 01:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by StuntBacon

Sorry, could you clarify that? The first and last sentences seemed a bit contradictory. What do you do the same thing as, if you don't double pluck like Wooten?

But thank you for your recommendation of Sadowsky strings, I wasn't even aware they made strings, but they're a reputable company when it comes to basses, so I might experiment. I can't remember what size my strings are, can't remember where we put its packaging. But it's definitely thicker than that. So ok, that's the first step, thanks for confirming that.

Anyone have recommendations about the string attachment to the bridge? Am I also neglecting any other aspects of the set up which made Victor's Fodera so different from other basses I've played apart from other indie basses for sale provided by Thump Music which were freakishly good with a freakish amount of strings and a freakish price tag.

Well sorry, i mean in that video, my style is different compared to wooten because i dont use double pluck. get it? wooten does, and i bet when he slaps like normal (without even thinking to use double pluck) he'll slap the same way like me.

double pluck requires your index finger and middle finger to be vertical, and its very hard to do the usual way, its easy if you're not plucking the same string.

thump music? are you australian? cause i am.

StuntBacon · #10 02-06-2010, 03:32 AM

I didn't know there were Fodera strings either. Sweet! Thanks very much for that recommendation WalterBush.

Yeah I have an idea of what you're talking about millerfreak. And yes I am Australian. Brisbane, to be more precise. You?

Cool, so I've already found a fellow Australian.

millerfreak · #11 02-06-2010, 03:56 AM

I'm in sydney. I'll pm you my msn/ym so that we could chat. wont have computer in the next couple days but able to get on via mobile.

Just Thumpin' · #12 02-06-2010, 06:52 AM

With all due respect, while this used to be the case, it no longer is!! You can order through:

service@fodera.com.

You will get a response and be able to buy your strings within 24 hours (business days). If you don't, email me and one set is on the house!

Regards,

Jason

jdesalvo@fodera.com

Quote:

Originally Posted by WalterBush

Order through juststrings.com or similar dealer. Don't order through Fodera's website, under any circumstance. They're just too busy to handle string orders.

bassramos · #13 02-06-2010, 07:08 AM

yOu need to make sure your neck is straight enough with your strings being the exact height and feel you want. You have to set up you rown bass. With a little judgement and some allen wrenches you should be able to do this. The bass goeds out of wack to often for me to afford taking it to someone to set up. Just carefully set it up your self. YOu shouldnt have to force it much to straighten up the neck. just look down from the headstock and you should be able to get it straight. But not backbowed.

StuntBacon · #14 02-06-2010, 11:11 PM

I know how to change the action on my bass, and I've already tried heightening the action, which I found helped a little with my speed on my fingerstyle and increased the quality of the sound of my slapping. No such luck on the double thump. But trying out these Fodera strings seems like a good idea, I might think of purchasing them in the next week or so.

And whoa, looks like we have some prestigious people on here. Wish I could find a guitar forum anywhere near as good as this one. A representative from Fodera and it looks like Jeff Berlin has been around.

I like this site!

Just Thumpin' · #15 02-07-2010, 03:56 AM

It is the hub of Bass Brotherhood!

Quote:

Originally Posted by StuntBacon

I know how to change the action on my bass, and I've already tried heightening the action, which I found helped a little with my speed on my fingerstyle and increased the quality of the sound of my slapping. No such luck on the double thump. But trying out these Fodera strings seems like a good idea, I might think of purchasing them in the next week or so.

And whoa, looks like we have some prestigious people on here. Wish I could find a guitar forum anywhere near as good as this one. A representative from Fodera and it looks like Jeff Berlin has been around.

I like this site!

StuntBacon · #16 02-07-2010, 11:44 PM

Yes, looks like it is.

Does anyone have any recommendations on how to attach the strings to the bridge?

StuntBacon · #17 02-26-2010, 08:10 PM

Ok, I've gotten some Fodera strings, but I'm still having some problems. It's a step in the right direction, and they're absolutely fantastic for my usual slap technique.

Would it help if I put these strings on a shorter scale bass, like Victor's? Also, can anyone recommend me a string height?

seamus bass · #18 02-27-2010, 04:15 PM

i didnt actually mean wide spacing was a problem,in fact i believe it would actually help it, being theres more room between strings. my only issue is pick-up placement. i have a conklin with twin humbuckers which does give much room other than playing right over the pick-up. this could work to you advantage. i started using the technique over the pick-up after hearing billy sheehan reveal that he plays over the pick-up for his speedy fingers.

StuntBacon · #19 02-27-2010, 05:59 PM

Well, at the moment pickup placement isn't too much of a problem. At the moment it's still getting through the strings. I'll try lowering the action like one person suggested because at the moment the action is quite high. If the pickups do get in the way, it's probably possible to lower them like I have on my guitar.

If worst comes to worst, I'll just put it on our precision-like Vantage bass. The B string can't actually reach the machine head properly on it anyway, so my Lakland only has four strings on it.

seamus bass · #20 02-28-2010, 11:44 AM

also IIRC wootens technique suggests starting on the g string and get comfortable with just the open strings, work your left hand in with muting or something simple. the fretting should come in later. i dont know about the b string and i havent seen vic play dbl thumb on one either, i know when i try on mine it clanks alot.