fender jazz MIM bad nut job, questions

Extrinsic · #1 07-06-2011, 04:46 PM

Hi All,

I replaced the nut on my fender jazz MIM (2004) with a bone nut but I think I did a crappy job. The fretboard was curved and I couldn't sand the nut at the right curvature for it to sit right. I glued it in anyway even tho the edges do not sit tight against the wood. I'm playing a few gigs when I get back home in a few weeks, and I was wondering what your thoughts are. Is a bad nut job likely to crap out on me? If I were to replace it again, how could I get it to sit better?

For reference, I just laid sandpaper down on the table and rubbed the nut against it :/ to get curvature, I put a pen underneath the sandpaper ha. it came too wide and deep, but the string slots were there.

JLS · #2 07-06-2011, 05:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Extrinsic

Hi All,

I replaced the nut on my fender jazz MIM (2004) with a bone nut but I think I did a crappy job. The fretboard was curved and I couldn't sand the nut at the right curvature for it to sit right. I glued it in anyway even tho the edges do not sit tight against the wood. I'm playing a few gigs when I get back home in a few weeks, and I was wondering what your thoughts are. Is a bad nut job likely to crap out on me? If I were to replace it again, how could I get it to sit better?

For reference, I just laid sandpaper down on the table and rubbed the nut against it :/ to get curvature, I put a pen underneath the sandpaper ha. it came too wide and deep, but the string slots were there.

Next time. stick some 80-100 grit sandpaper on the finger board,
and get your bottom radius that way.

Unless you win the nutslots lottery, you'll always have to file the nut slots, to get them right.

JB696 · #3 07-06-2011, 05:30 PM

Yep, on Fenders the radius of the fretboard at the first fret usually matches the bottom of the nut groove. I usually put a layer of masking tape over the neck first to keep any sanding dust from getting down in the grain of the rosewood. With maple it wouldn't matter. Fender replacement nut #004-8649-000 comes in the correct shape and just needs minor work with some #320 paper to adjust the thickness and nut depth. Over the last three years I have replaced all of my brass and bone nuts with this Fender nut, as the tone it produces is superior to any other material. More sustain, crisper harmonics, and a closer sound to that made by the fretted notes. GC probably has them for $6.99. Probably very similar to the one you removed.

Extrinsic · #4 07-06-2011, 05:41 PM

thanks for linking the number. Mine was looking pretty weary so I thought off with it.

I thought most people make the opposite claim, that bone / brass etc is crisper than plastic?

john grey · #5 07-06-2011, 05:47 PM

As this reflects on starting a nut; obtain some quality micro files & begin with high space to get your string spacing correct and SLOWLY work with the unit to achieve optimum. You often have greater height flexibility with a nut properly spaced than many would think.

Do some reading on the methods used to seat and cut guitar nuts and allot a lengthy period to make your setup. DON'T RUSH. Do your best to bring down a slope at the tuner end so you achieve some tight drop from the string. Determine what string gauges you will be using and make your spacing from their thicknesses. Begin high so that you always have room to drop down. many people make their cuts in a "V" rather than a "U" so that there is a variance in gauges with limited stress on bone.

JB696 · #6 07-06-2011, 06:14 PM

Suppose I give you ten recorded solo bass tracks to listen to. You don't know who the bassist is, or what kind of bass he is playing on. All you have to go on is your ears. You may be able to tell me whether it is a P Bass, Jazz Bass, a Rick or a Stingray. You may be able to tell me if he's using fingers or a pick. You may recognize flat or roundwound strings. But can you tell me what the nut is made out of? Good luck. If you spent all afternoon filing and sanding on a bone, brass or tusq nut or paid a luthier to make a custom one for you, you will surely notice a huge "improvement" in tone. It almost always works that way. But can you tell the difference in a recorded before and after A/B test, with the same bass and two different nuts.? If you can, I'm very, very impressed.

walterw · #7 07-06-2011, 09:12 PM

that's an irrelevant test.

play the bass with a badly-done nut for 2 seconds and you'll know it (and hate it).

berwick63 · #8 07-06-2011, 09:19 PM

Well, he didn't say a difference between badly done nut and well done nut. He is referring to people claiming different nuts really effect the tone of the open string, which it may. But listen to a recording of the same piece done with the same bass, but say one with a bone nut, one with brass, one with plastic, one with tusq, or whatever.. You're probably not going to notice a difference.

walterw · #9 07-06-2011, 10:02 PM

yeah, that's true.

as long as it's good enough a material to not interfere with tuning stability, you're not likely to hear much difference, except maybe on the open strings.

berwick63 · #10 07-06-2011, 10:11 PM

While being able to MAYBE hear the difference on open strings, nobody can go "ah, thats a brass nut" or whatever. Just as JB696 said, in a recording you might be able to pick out ah, thats a P bass strung with flats or something, but unless the nut is poorly cut to the point of changing the natural sound its supposed to create, the difference between nut materials really don't matter *to me*. I personally just use Graphtech TusqXL nuts, as they're impregnated with graphite to help the string freely move when tuning.

slaphappychappy · #11 07-07-2011, 12:55 AM

Lol. Its superficial if it makes the tone better . As long as it keeps the strings off the fretboard. But if its not installed properly, as long as the string height is fine for playing, the tension on the strings will no doubt hold it in. I had a pbass and the nut was in place with superglue . It worked. I did fix it eventually, but playability was fine for me.

JLS · #12 07-07-2011, 07:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by slaphappychappy

Lol. Its superficial if it makes the tone better . As long as it keeps the strings off the fretboard. But if its not installed properly, as long as the string height is fine for playing, the tension on the strings will no doubt hold it in. I had a pbass and the nut was in place with superglue . It worked. I did fix it eventually, but playability was fine for me.

What was there to, "fix"? Most professionals use a dot or two of cyanoacrylate to hold nuts in place.

berwick63 · #13 07-07-2011, 08:14 AM

I've used wood glue, plain white elmers glue, and super glue. The key, in my opinion, is juuuuuuuust enough glue to hold the nut in place. Anything more, and you chance tear out when removing an old nut.

slaphappychappy · #14 07-07-2011, 04:00 PM

What was fixed was the Sam problem here where I got the curve wrong and it wouldn't sit flat in the groove. In fact, it was so bad, I had to pack one side with paper to prop it up.
Once the glue set, magic

just like a bought one.

john grey · #15 07-07-2011, 04:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by berwick63

I've used wood glue, plain white elmers glue, and super glue. The key, in my opinion, is juuuuuuuust enough glue to hold the nut in place. Anything more, and you chance tear out when removing an old nut.

+1
Putting too much down can be a nightmare; you could have a serious time trying to get it out without damage to the fret-board if need be.
I once used bone and most likely won't do that again - it cracks fairly easily. Brass (IMO) is worth a go if only that it's strong and doesn't ware. Because it's metal, it also takes bit more to cut so that you don't get a "surprise" from"two strokes being one too many"....

I can't tell the difference between one material and another at all. Some time back folks said brass was supposed to provide some greater "sustain" but I don't think that's really the case.