Fret Rattle on a Maple Board

wafu_vasco · #1 08-08-2010, 01:57 PM

Hi All!
Just looking for some advice - I've got some fret rattle on one fret on the D-String on a P-Bass; the relief is fine and the action is already quite high, but the rattle on the one fret is very severe. I've had a similar issue in the past on an Ibanez AEB which was solved via the medium of a nylon headed hammer and a good few whacks to the fret in question. However, this is a maple board which I'm told should not receive the same treatment, and it's a 1975 Fender so I really don't want to hit it with a hammer. Any suggestions would be very greatly accepted!

202dy · #2 08-08-2010, 02:37 PM

Whacking the fret with a hammer wouldn't work on a 1975 Fender. The kerf isn't deep enough to permit the movement. The frets were not pressed or hammered in. They were slid in from the bass side like a drawer.

What needs to be determined is why there is rattle on this fret. Which fret rattles? Is the next fret (or two) too high? Is it a set up issue? Sometimes extreme relief can cause this problem.

Take some measurements: Relief at the seventh fret from the bottom of the string to the top of the fret and string height at the twelfth fret on E and G strings same way. While you're at it, string heights at the last fret, too. Post the data and someone will help.

wafu_vasco · #3 08-08-2010, 04:17 PM

Thanks very much:

E-String 7th: 2.5mm, 12th: 3mm, 20th: 3.2mm
G-String 7th: 2.5mm, 12th: 3mm, 20th: 2.9mm

This is after I raised the action a few days ago - the action is bordering on uncomfortably high now, but it has deifnately helped in reducing the fret buzz. The guilty fret is the 9th on the D-String. Also, not sure if it is a factor but the body of the bass is not a Fender body - the fit at the neck pocket is a good one, but it's not Fender perfect.
Many thanks again.

wafu_vasco · #4 08-12-2010, 07:41 AM

Ok, now I've finally got a proper-ish set of feeler gauges, I've finally gathered some useful data. I capo'ed the first fret and then fretted the 17th, before using the feeler gauge to measure between the bottom of the strings and the top of the corresponding fret wire.

E-String: 7th - 0.4mm, 12th - 0.15mm
G-String: 7th - 0.5mm, 12th - 0.15mm

Hope this gives some clues.
Many thanks!

202dy · #5 08-12-2010, 01:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wafu_vasco

Ok, now I've finally got a proper-ish set of feeler gauges, I've finally gathered some useful data. I capo'ed the first fret and then fretted the 17th, before using the feeler gauge to measure between the bottom of the strings and the top of the corresponding fret wire.

E-String: 7th - 0.4mm, 12th - 0.15mm
G-String: 7th - 0.5mm, 12th - 0.15mm

Hope this gives some clues.
Many thanks!

There's a touch too much relief. You probably want to be somewhere in the neighborhood of .3mm. Less, like .2mm is getting a touch on the straight side. Still, it is a reasonable amount of relief.

Back to the problem fret. It is unlikely to be popped in the middle. Fenders of that era just don't do that. To be sure, slide your feeler gauges along the edge of the fret where it meets the face of the fingerboard. Does it slide under? Or does the lacquer prevent this test? If not, the problem lies elsewhere.

What is the general condition of the frets? Can you see some wear? Maybe some parallel grooves (from round wound strings) in the fret or two right above the one that the rattle appears? Or a perpendicular groove from playing wear? Affirmative answers to any of these questions indicate a need for some fret dressing.

The best way to test for a high or low fret is with a small straight edge, one just long enough to span three frets. Center the tool and rock back and forth. You can also spin back and forth (30 degrees or so) like a propeller with the center on the fret. Check one or two frets adjacent, too. If there is a high fret, you'll feel it.

wafu_vasco · #6 08-13-2010, 07:46 AM

The laquer prevents the feeler gauge from getting underneath the fret, which I guess is a good sign. There isn't too much wear, only some discolouration where the strings have worn away a little bit and the frets themselves looking a bit tatty along the front and back edges. There aren't any visible grooves cut away. I'll get hold of a straight edge and try the next test.

202dy · #7 08-13-2010, 09:22 AM

The lacquer bridging is not disturbed. That indicates that the frets haven't moved. The frets are looking a little tatty? How so? Another thought: Is there any lacquer on top of the frets?

wafu_vasco · #8 08-13-2010, 12:28 PM

I've put a straight edge across the fret board centre and in between the D and G strings, where the problem is. Neither really shows up any noticable problem - the edge touches the first and last fret with a very gradual dip in between. The tattiness may be laquer related - it almost looks as if the frets were once lacquered and after years of use, they are now bare metal with the only laquer remaining at the front and back of the frets. There is a definate demarkation line on each fret with a distinct edge and a slightly darker colour on the front and back when compared to the top.

wafu_vasco · #9 08-13-2010, 12:33 PM

Just to add to the confusion - the fret rattle seems to vary in severity a little from day to day, which I've always put down to inconsistencies in my playing. Right now it has completely cured itself. There is no trace whatsoever. My first thought is expansion and contraction of wood due to temperature and/or moisture, but it has remained in the same place on its wall hangar throughout this whole thing. I have no idea what's going on... and I haven't even started on the problem with my Explorer Bass yet, either.

202dy · #10 08-13-2010, 05:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wafu_vasco

I've put a straight edge across the fret board centre and in between the D and G strings, where the problem is. Neither really shows up any noticable problem - the edge touches the first and last fret with a very gradual dip in between. The tattiness may be laquer related - it almost looks as if the frets were once lacquered and after years of use, they are now bare metal with the only laquer remaining at the front and back of the frets. There is a definate demarkation line on each fret with a distinct edge and a slightly darker colour on the front and back when compared to the top.

Sounds like the straight edge is too long. For diagnosing high frets, the straight edge should only be long enough to span three frets. Center the straight edge on the suspected problem fret and the frets that are on either side of it. Try the test on the frets that are sharper and flatter, too. In other words, if F9 is the problem, the straight edge spans F8, 9, and 10. Check frets seven through eleven while you're at it.

That is what the lacquer should look like on a '75 Fender bass.

Quote:

Originally Posted by wafu_vasco

Just to add to the confusion - the fret rattle seems to vary in severity a little from day to day, which I've always put down to inconsistencies in my playing. Right now it has completely cured itself. There is no trace whatsoever. My first thought is expansion and contraction of wood due to temperature and/or moisture, but it has remained in the same place on its wall hangar throughout this whole thing. I have no idea what's going on... and I haven't even started on the problem with my Explorer Bass yet, either.

The fact that it's in the same place all the time has little bearing on the subject. What is important is the fluctuations in temperature, and more importantly, humidity. In most places, seasonal swings in weather dictate setups. It is not unusual that the problem has fixed itself-for now.