fretless to fretted conversion

morebass! · #1 06-16-2006, 10:01 AM

I'm thinking of having frets put on my Fender jazz deluxe 4-stringer. It currently has a lined rosewood board. Anyone ever have this done or do it themself? Any potential problems to be aware of? The nut seems to be cut a little to deep already so I'm guessing that'll have to be replaced. I'd also like new position indicators as the currents ones are at the lines and I'd prefer the standard, between the fret, positions. Any recommendations on luthiers to do this type of work or should it be routine? Am I better off just buying a replacement necK?

nysbob · #2 06-16-2006, 11:16 AM

I'd just buy a neck, unless there's something spectacular about that one.

morebass! · #3 06-16-2006, 11:52 AM

Buying a new neck may not be that easy. The deluxe version is 22-"fret" so standard jazz necks don't work. I don't see deluxe necks at the Warmoth site and Fender would probably charge an arm and a leg....

SirChronique · #4 06-16-2006, 12:17 PM

bleh!

This makes me sick.

I'd just hunt around and try to find the right neck over ruining a nice delux neck. If you ruin the neck then your in BIG trouble because you won't be able to find a replacement. Is it that worth it?

Demon · #5 06-16-2006, 12:29 PM

Sell the bass and buy a new, seems like the best thing for you, or just enjoy it as a fretless-.-

morebass! · #6 06-16-2006, 02:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SirChronique

bleh!

This makes me sick.

I'd just hunt around and try to find the right neck over ruining a nice delux neck. If you ruin the neck then your in BIG trouble because you won't be able to find a replacement. Is it that worth it?

I'm confused by your post. On one hand you suggest I find the right neck but then say I won't be able to find a replacement??? I'm inclined to think that the later may be the case after doing a web search for replacement necks.

I'm no luthier but it doesn't seem to me that this would be much more of a job than re-fretting a fretted bass. Does anyone have any experience with this? Thanks in advance.

WillBuckingham · #7 06-16-2006, 02:35 PM

It's a much bigger job because you'd have to remove whatever finish is on the fingerboard and cut new fret slots. It sounds like a big waste of time and money and a bad idea.

An apt comparison might be buying the GT mustang and then spending 3 grand on throwing out the V8 and replacing it with a six cylinder. (this is not a jab at fretted bass players)

Hookus · #8 06-16-2006, 03:48 PM

Not routine.

You should just be able to use a Warmoth neck, and re-locate the bridge.

SirChronique · #9 06-18-2006, 07:13 AM

I was actually saying both things at once.

It will be hard to find the neck you want in fretted, yes, so you don't want to ruin the neck you have because it will be hard to replace.

The neck will be hard to find, so it would be hard to find a replacement in the first place!

Altogether a ****ty situation indeed! The only reason I would shy away from refretting is because I have bad luck and something would go horribly wrong, if you really think you can do it and it's what you want, by all means go for it!

morebass! · #10 06-19-2006, 08:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SirChronique

It will be hard to find the neck you want in fretted, yes, so you don't want to ruin the neck you have because it will be hard to replace....

Yes, I think you're right. If I have it done I'll make sure it's done well, by someone that has done it before. I think I'll post this in the luthiers forum. If I get the same types of responses there you may see this bass up for sale.

morebass! · #11 06-19-2006, 08:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hookus

Not routine. You should just be able to use a Warmoth neck, and re-locate the bridge.

Thanks, but relocating the bridge would change the scale length and therefore the intonation would be off, as well as the pickup placement.

morebass! · #12 06-19-2006, 08:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WillBuckingham

It's a much bigger job because you'd have to remove whatever finish is on the fingerboard and cut new fret slots. It sounds like a big waste of time and money and a bad idea.

An apt comparison might be buying the GT mustang and then spending 3 grand on throwing out the V8 and replacing it with a six cylinder. (this is not a jab at fretted bass players)

Is there a finish on rosewood boards?

I hadn't ever heard that before.

I can't say I really follow your mustang analogy either...fretted and fretless necks usually cost about the same.

IanStephenson · #13 06-19-2006, 09:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by morebass!

Thanks, but relocating the bridge would change the scale length and therefore the intonation would be off

No - the intonation would be right because you've CHANGED THE NECK!

Change the neck, and then put the bridge in the right place for that neck.

All of this sounds just way too much work - for what it will cost and the risk involved you're far better of either selling the bass and buying a fretted or just taking what you would have spent on the work, and putting it towards a new bass.

Ian

bigd4207 · #14 06-19-2006, 06:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by morebass!

Is there a finish on rosewood boards?

I hadn't ever heard that before.

I can't say I really follow your mustang analogy either...fretted and fretless necks usually cost about the same.

I've seen a couple finished rosewood boards. And as far as the mustang thing goes, I don't think it's just about cost but more cost/performance/functionability. It may cost the same, but you get different performance, thuse different sound. Plus it will play differently, and who is to say it won't have deadspots galore. Like the mustang, everything really does work in conjuction, it's the way it was meant to be and many things factored in to make it one. The mustang with the v8 has a different tranny than the v6, thus it would probably perform better with the v6 tranny to start with. If you wanted the 6 get the 6. If you want fretted get a fretted, why compromise so many things when you could have had all that to begin with, now you have to worry about things like will it work...how well...how long....it's really just not worth taking something that was already "in phase" with everything that makes it up, and change it to so they might clash. IMO

morebass! · #15 06-20-2006, 02:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigd4207

...it's really just not worth taking something that was already "in phase" with everything that makes it up, and change it to so they might clash. IMO

That seems to sum up the spirit of most of the comments so far. Everything about this bass is identical to the fretted version except for the lack of frets and possibly the nut.
I really haven't seen a specific reason for not doing it yet. If I can find a luthier to cut the board, fret it, and replace the nut for not too much $$ I may go ahead with it. I really like the bass and think the preamp would better complement a fretted bass.

bigd4207 · #16 06-20-2006, 05:57 PM

Sorry, not trying to be an @$$ or anything. Not that I am totally disouraging it, but to spend the money on something that might not sound as good as it did before. I just don't think it's really right to the bass, how does IT FEEL ABOUT THIS?

Probably not to good. There is one specific reason. It's really just that the board really defines how it plays, I am not saying it will not play good, but what are you going to do if you don't like it, or it has deadspots galore or something. If you really want a fretted neck on THAT bass, I suggest just getting a new neck or something. Besides, then you kinda have 2 basses in one!

morebass! · #17 06-21-2006, 07:38 AM

I wish someone made a replacement neck for this bass. But I haven't found any...

morebass! · #18 06-21-2006, 07:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigd4207

Sorry, not trying to be an @$$ or anything...

Not at all! Your sentiments seem to be exactly how some others feel. I'm not sure I completely understand it, considering how common other mods are. To me routing out a hole in the body for a bridge pickup is at least as much of a "violation" of a bass. But I've done that one too.

The deadspot comment I think I'd disagree with. I doubt if there's going to be a deadspot that turns up with it fretted that wasn't there as a fretless. Changing out tuners might have as big of an affect on that. I think what we're seeing here is that fretless players are very (emotionally?) attached to their fingerboards. Not to say that's a bad thing at all. It's actually kind of endearing. Just remember though as a previous poster said "all fretted bass necks started out as fretless necks".

bigd4207 · #19 06-21-2006, 05:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by morebass!

Not at all! Your sentiments seem to be exactly how some others feel. I'm not sure I completely understand it, considering how common other mods are. To me routing out a hole in the body for a bridge pickup is at least as much of a "violation" of a bass. But I've done that one too.

The deadspot comment I think I'd disagree with. I doubt if there's going to be a deadspot that turns up with it fretted that wasn't there as a fretless. Changing out tuners might have as big of an affect on that. I think what we're seeing here is that fretless players are very (emotionally?) attached to their fingerboards. Not to say that's a bad thing at all. It's actually kind of endearing. Just remember though as a previous poster said "all fretted bass necks started out as fretless necks".

Actually I've never played a fretless.

As far as the deadspot thing, I was just trying to think of possible scenarios, because, don't you have to raise overall action just to clear the frets? I'm just trying to see how that would affect things, every fretless I have seen had about the same clearence as you would between the strings and frets, sometimes lower. I realize the nut does a lot for this, but still isn't there always a possiblity of playability issues that would come with this? By the way, I don't believe in hacking on basses, mine came with dual soaps and 4 knobs, still remains dual soaps with 4 knobs, but now I have different pups, new preamp, pots, and naturally strings. LEAVE THE WOOD BE!, IMO.

morebass! · #20 06-22-2006, 06:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigd4207

... don't you have to raise overall action just to clear the frets? I'm just trying to see how that would affect things, every fretless I have seen had about the same clearence as you would between the strings and frets, sometimes lower. I realize the nut does a lot for this, but still isn't there always a possiblity of playability issues that would come with this? ...

bigd4207 - I appreciate your hanging in there with me on this. The playability issses are the kind of thing I was trying to get at. I'd guess that both the nut and the bridge action would need to be raised. I don't see the bridge end being a problem though. Maybe the nut isn't either.

I'm surprised that no one out there has tried this. Compared to some of the mods people have posted about this seems pretty tame. Haven't heard any horror stories or success stories yet.