Fretted Notes On E String Out of Tune?

Bobby Lemain · #1 07-11-2010, 11:03 AM

Must be the weather change but I noticed that adjusting the saddles on my E string aren't doing any good for intonation. Does that mean I need a neck shim? If so, I have some index cards but have no idea what to do with them since only one string has this issue.

I use La Bella 0760M strings if its of importance.

ridgeback · #2 07-11-2010, 11:10 AM

huh? what exactly are you doing? are you adjusting the intonation?

Marton · #3 07-11-2010, 11:11 AM

Bad/too old string maybe.

Bobby Lemain · #4 07-11-2010, 11:14 AM

I'm trying to adjust the intonation, everything is sharp except for the open E.

The string is maybe 7 months old at the most.

**lowendfriend** · #5 07-11-2010, 11:24 AM

Sounds like you need to adjust intonation setting in your bridge to shorten the string.

Is the harmonic at the twelfth fret in tune? how about when you press down to fret at the twelfth?

Get familiar with this document:

http://www.jerzydrozdbasses.com/akcn...ide_ver100.pdf

JLS · #6 07-11-2010, 11:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bobby Lemain

Must be the weather change but I noticed that adjusting the saddles on my E string aren't doing any good for intonation. Does that mean I need a neck shim? If so, I have some index cards but have no idea what to do with them since only one string has this issue.

I use La Bella 0760M strings if its of importance.

Why would a neck shim help your intonation?

Bobby Lemain · #7 07-11-2010, 11:49 AM

Excuse my stupidity, the fretted notes are all SHARP not flat...

And the reason why I am having problems with intonation is because I am already as far as I can go. I tried going all the way out to see what would happen and I ended up with a flat F when fretting the octave (12th fret). Currently with the saddles as far away from the pickups as possible, the octave is tuning as 20 cents sharp.

And I have no idea what a neck shim will do actually, maybe my problem is the nut?

SurferJoe46 · #8 07-11-2010, 11:54 AM

Raising or lowering the strings will not affect the tuning or intonation - unless you are having to fret a string , oh, say 1/2 inch or so and then it WILL be stretched to a new-higher freq.

Forget about the nut and bridge height at this point and think: 'intonation' to get it back where it belongs.

For the nut to be in the formula, it would have to have migrated somewhere it doesn't belong.

That E string looks all messed up and could be a problem - but I don't see how it can affect intonation from the pix. You have, however, run out of adjustment.

What are you using to decide if you are sharp or flat? You may want to get thee to a GC with an onboard luthier and get it professionally set up.

That string looks pug-ugly though.

You just can't leave this bass out in the rain and let it shrink like that - it isn't Sanforized, you know!

ridgeback · #9 07-11-2010, 11:56 AM

never seen a saddle having to go back that far..at a guess your going the wrong way?

Bobby Lemain · #10 07-11-2010, 12:03 PM

I'm using a KORG CA-30 plugged into the bass to tune.

All my other strings look like that so I'm guessing that's normal for La Bella's? (I do have to agree though, it looks pretty ugly.)

Quote:

Originally Posted by ridgeback

never seen a saddle having to go back that far..at a guess your going the wrong way?

I tried going the opposite direction to match the distance of the A saddle and now it's 25 cents sharp

SurferJoe46 · #11 07-11-2010, 12:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ridgeback

never seen a saddle having to go back that far..at a guess your going the wrong way?

Might be the prescription drugs in me - but I believe he's going flat in that direction. Lengthening the string will make it vibrate lower.

Is this ONLY on the E string? And if you stated that already - it's the drugs.

SurferJoe46 · #12 07-11-2010, 12:07 PM

There's some other dynamic going on here.

Bobby Lemain · #13 07-11-2010, 12:08 PM

Yup only the E string.

I have a P neck on a J body if that could be the thing... But it was fine a month ago...

Bobby Lemain · #14 07-11-2010, 05:19 PM

Anyone? Nut, neck shim, saddles distance and height... Suggestions?

SurferJoe46 · #15 07-11-2010, 05:45 PM

Get out a tape measure and see if the distance from the top nut to the 12th fret is pretty close to the center of the bridge adjustments.

Don't think of shimming or moving the neck at all unless it's in a bad 'u' shape and the tuners are touching the bridge.

If the other strings can be adjusted and intoned - then something else is going on here.

Maybe a bad string (?!#?&?*$!) - I got nothing yet and am grabbing at straws here until you report back on the measurements.

stflbn · #16 07-11-2010, 05:48 PM

If it's flat you need to 'shorten' the string to raise the pitch. Shorten the string means move the saddle CLOSER to the nut.

You're going to wrong way.

WarriorJoe7 · #17 07-11-2010, 05:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bobby Lemain

Yup only the E string.

I have a P neck on a J body if that could be the thing... But it was fine a month ago...

This is VERY important. Are all the notes FLAT or SHARP when you tune the string to E? Go double check right now. You posted both and it's leading to mass confusion.

If your 2nd post on it is right (all notes other than open E are sharp) then you need to make the string longer, which would require that you go further than it looks like you can go in the direction that you already have.

You might have a 20 fret neck on a body that requires a 21 fret neck. If that is the case the bridge needs moved back about 1/4 to 3/8. Then you will have room for the correct adjustment. (Make sure that if you move it the full 3/8 that the G string intonation has room to still stay on the bridge plate.) This happens sometimes when you use necks that aren't stock to the body.

However the red flag i see is that the saddle is way too far ahead of the other ones (is the A string intonated yet?) Usually the saddles are generally about the thickness of the string they hold ahead of the one before it (however I have seen basses with a shorter E string than A... this may have to do with curvature of the fingerboard, curvature of the bridge, individual saddle heights, and possibly the nut cut.)

This red flag is the reason I ask you to confirm sharpness or flatness.

PJSShearer · #18 07-11-2010, 05:51 PM

The OP implies that this issue is a recent thing?, ie. it was fine at some point in the past. Then as others have said, your E string does look a little wierd so replacing it might be worth a try.

However, before you do, come at the issue from a different angle:

The meter is telling you things are out of whack, but do your ears agree with it?.

Have you checked things out with a different tuner? and, I hate to ask this, but have you checked the Battery in your tuner lately???.

ridgeback · #19 07-11-2010, 05:55 PM

going by the mark on the bridge your way off from where it was and you say it was ok a month ago...but it back there and change the string.just going over your post again i would say it is the string at fault but your going to be miles outs now anyway..are you using a tuner to check???

DrewinHouston · #20 07-11-2010, 06:05 PM

You may need a neck stretcher.