Im curius for limp bizkit's bass lights (frets)

[bassheavy]

the above post is so wrong i don't even know where to start

[CrawlingEye]

I don't mean to be rude, bassheavy. But perhaps bass isn't the instrument you're looking for? Maybe not even an instrument.

[Bruce Lindfield]

Originally posted by CrawlingEye
I think that was an ignorant comment, Bruce. This is a forum to help people. Beginners shouldn't buy big toys they'll later regret. It's like telling a beginner to buy a MM Stingray. It may sound good, but it also may not be what they want, therefore meaning it's bad.


You're obviously confused with what I'm trying to say. Martin's not a bad guy, certainly. But he's arguing with me so he can sell his product, realize that. Ever goto a music store and you want the Stingray, and the guy tells you to get a 5 string Roscoe fretless that costs about 2x the price of the Stingray? It's because they get commission on it.

If you're gonna argue that, then I guess maybe I'm not the newbie here.

I think this last line is what the whole thing is about - obviously you are "desparate" to somehow prove that you are not a newbie and as I said before appear more knowledgeable than you are.

Now let's get a few facts straight:

1. Nobody ever said that TalkBass is about helping newbies - it's just about Talking bass - that's it! Nowhere has anybody ever said this is a forum about "helping people"!

2. Secondly nobody actually asked for help here! The original poster simply said he was curious - he didn't ask about whether he should buy them, he didn't ask for a list of the pros and cons.

3. Let's get it straight Martin was not arguing with you - you were picking on what is his liveliehood. Now when you're 15 I imagine that life seems very easy - people pay for everything for you. But I don't think it's on to try to discourage people from using something that is another person's living, just so you can appear self-righteous yourself. Oh I'm helping people - well nobody asked for that help and you certainly aren't helping Martin!!

4. As to the comments about music stores - errrr.... go teach your grandmother to suck eggs - comes to mind. If people ask for advice - then fine - but I must say that I will not be asking any 15 year olds to help me buy basses.

"Beginners shouldn't buy big toys they'll later regret. " - has somebody said this to you - like your parents. Well it may be OK for parents to tell their children things like this, but in the real world I 'm afraid that "should" just doesn't come into it and if a big sports star wants to buy a Ferrari, then no amount of "shoulds" will stop them.

And as people have been saying - who are you to say what people should and shouldn't do ?

[Bruce Lindfield]

Originally posted by The Mock Turtle Regulator


hmmmm, okay, but now you tend to pick fights with everyone else- need I mention the stuff about jazz bass pickups and '58 precisions, Bruce?
and didn't you post something in the "Ask Jeff Berlin" forum about people on here being too obsessed about gear and not concentrating on music?
I get the impression that you'd be arguing for the opposite view if there wasn't some respected industry person there to oppose you if you did.

I think there's nothing wrong with a good argument, but quite often people don't seem to be able to conduct these without getting personal. OK, I admit I'm biased - I'd rather have a forum where you can discuss bass stuff with people who know a lot about the subject and are respected in the industry, rather than a load of 14/15 year-olds who have never played a gig outside their school! And it really annoys me when you see one of the former being "hounded" by one of the latter.

I do think however that my position is consistent and it is all down to context (Brad would like this). Now I think there is a big difference between people arguing about the minutiae of what aspects of gear will give them a certain sound and "putting on a show" for live gigs. I think the amount of time people put into thinking about how they can sound like their idol would be better spent practising and studying. Also, if you are talking to people who are at the stage where they are sitting at home in their bedrooms practising, this is a world away from someone like Stuart Zender thinking about putting on a show for people who will have paid a lot of money for tickets to see the band.

Now in the last 20 years I have been in bands who were very concerned about image and stage presentation and "In the real world" as I keep saying - you have to think about these things as a professional musician. I have been on video shoots or on TV with bands and this is a necessary part of being in the entertainment business. If you don't have a video you won't sell records and won't be able to carry on making music. But there is no point in mentioning these things in a discussion about pickups!

The current band I play in is no different and I have no doubt that if we didn't have a very attractive Brazilian singer up front we would lose a lot of our appeal. We often ask for honest "feedback" from people who have been to our gigs
and while we are thinking about the sound, the mistakes we made, whether the balance of the set was OK - what sort of feedback do you think we get? Of course it is all about the visual presentation of the band - we don't smile enough or dance etc etc..

As to the instruments themselves - I do have a bass with a nice Zebrano and Quilt Maple finish and I don't see why I have to justify that and to me it is no different to having LEDs or whatever else fits in with your band's image.

As a PS - I have made over 3,000 posts here and I think it's a bit unfair to pick on the odd one or two to slag me off - if you look at the vast majority of my posts I think you will find they are helpful and informative or maybe attempts at humour!

[The Mock Turtle Regulator]

I'm totally in agreement with you about the visual aspect of live music, Bruce.
(in a covers band) I've found I usually get more attention when I go up to the mic to do backing vocals or jump about than when I'm doing some flash bass fill, or play continuous 16th notes- I've found only other musicians in the audience really appreciate whether something is particularly tricky to play.

I still (try to) play flashy stuff as well though, as it's fun.

even if I was watching a band play I'd enjoy the gig a lot more if the band didn't just stand there like statues while playing.

yes, the majority of your posts are helpful/informative etc. but you do sometimes tend to be unfairly dismissive of some of the younger players' views.

ps. I don't think Martin Sims' livelihood is in danger simply because of one topic on a bass forum, considering the number of people who are getting SIMS LED's fitted.
(didn't you say that this is "Talkbass", not "Sellbass"?)

[CrawlingEye]

Thank you, Mock Turtle... It seems I have nothing to say, except you took the words out of my mouth.

[Hambone]

Things sort of took off pretty quick here. To tell you the truth the first 2/3rds were well under control. But I don't think that I should take any action here. Though some of the opinions expressed came from an obvious lack of experience, they were civil and the discussion progressed.

As for Mr. Sims participation, if he chooses to not participate anymore in the discussion that would be his call. I personally think it was more out of impatience with some of the opinions rather than being run off. I think he will likely show up again sometime and he would be welcome.

This is probably the first discussion in Setup that has ever come to this but like I said, it remained civil if not somewhat heated. I will stick to my original platform of intervening only if things are out of hand. That is not the case here.

[bassheavy]

martin did the L.E.D.s on one of my basses and the results, while def. pricey, are astounding. anybody and everybody who has seen the work is amazed by how cool it looks. if you think you can do it yrself and get the same results as martin, good luck trying, but it'll cost you when you have to get a new neck.

the man is a professional and a craftsman and should be thanked and applauded for posting here.

Martin, all you have to say to get yr point across is 3 simple words:

JOHN PAUL JONES.

nuff said

[Angus]

Originally posted by CrawlingEye

I see you're a new member... This IS a forum to help people on topics they're not familiar with. So I have nothing to lose if you buy an $99 rogue bass and put flashy lights in it because you like it. But you will regret it. Point taken?

Really? Help people? I couldn't tell by your post.

Just so you know, ReiD has been here for about 8 months longer than you. He's just quiet.

Now, i don't know if you understand who Martin Sims is, but his presense here is absolutely AWESOME. The more the better. However, you are being absolutely rude and inconsiderate for his efforts to help answer questions. Ill agree with Bruce, you are living on a totally different planet, and arguing nothing. Show respect if nothing else to Mr. Sims, his presense here is appreciated greatly, and i don't want him to get turned off of her by some kid talking about absolutely nothing besides calling his innovative product useless. Insulting someones (very very useful) product is NOT cool, and I don't think Martin or anyone should have to deal with it. What, should he shut down his plant because YOU don't think things are based on image? Sorry, Martin is absolutely correct about image, it rules music these days. Sigh....

You make assumptions when talking about these "newbies"...but how many of them are going to spend $800 to put lights on whatever bass they have? Not very many. If they do, great! Why should you even care? Nobody talked about getting them put on these phantom Yamahas. Don't worry, hopefully most people find this amusing too.

Sorry C-Eye, you ARE still a newbie (nobody is pro in 4 years, and from what ive seen/heard, you're still a newbie), and you AREN'T helping anyone, which is the forums intention, right?

Mr. Sims, i apologize about Crawling Eye, please do ignore him. Don't let this be a the example you remember when you think of TalkBass. I know I appreciate the time you spend here, and I hope everyone else does, too. I hope you'll continue reading and posting in our forums and ignore soon-to-be trolls like this.

[CrawlingEye]

Perhaps you're missing the point, Angus. I didn't even nearly insult his product, It's not a product for everyone though. It's like bass mutes (I'm not sure if this is a bad example...?) but some people have no need for them and just perfer to mute other ways, some people think they're useful. I'm stating my opinion, my opinion's just as valid as yours. I don't know what you're trying to prove. As far as I see it, you don't really have much of a point other then telling me I'm wrong, without backing it up with anything.

I said, if someone wants to get the LED's they can, but if they just want them to look cool and are a newbie, they'd most likely later regret it. I don't see what's wrong with saying that.

[Angus]

Ok Crawling Eye. Nice Job.

Theres a time to say everything and a way to say it, and so far, you've yet to find the time nor the way. Nice.

[old_skool]

why cant we all just......get along?
anyway i think the leds are cool. i would definitely put them on a worthy bass. if you wouldnt its up to you. its your decision. not anyone elses.

[martin sims]

Originally posted by Angus


Really? Help people? I couldn't tell by your post.

Just so you know, ReiD has been here for about 8 months longer than you. He's just quiet.

Now, i don't know if you understand who Martin Sims is, but his presense here is absolutely AWESOME. The more the better. However, you are being absolutely rude and inconsiderate for his efforts to help answer questions. Ill agree with Bruce, you are living on a totally different planet, and arguing nothing. Show respect if nothing else to Mr. Sims, his presense here is appreciated greatly, and i don't want him to get turned off of her by some kid talking about absolutely nothing besides calling his innovative product useless. Insulting someones (very very useful) product is NOT cool, and I don't think Martin or anyone should have to deal with it. What, should he shut down his plant because YOU don't think things are based on image? Sorry, Martin is absolutely correct about image, it rules music these days. Sigh....

You make assumptions when talking about these "newbies"...but how many of them are going to spend $800 to put lights on whatever bass they have? Not very many. If they do, great! Why should you even care? Nobody talked about getting them put on these phantom Yamahas. Don't worry, hopefully most people find this amusing too.

Sorry C-Eye, you ARE still a newbie (nobody is pro in 4 years, and from what ive seen/heard, you're still a newbie), and you AREN'T helping anyone, which is the forums intention, right?

Mr. Sims, i apologize about Crawling Eye, please do ignore him. Don't let this be a the example you remember when you think of TalkBass. I know I appreciate the time you spend here, and I hope everyone else does, too. I hope you'll continue reading and posting in our forums and ignore soon-to-be trolls like this.

Hi Angus,
I'll certainly keep an "Eye" on how things progress with the talkbass forum & from time to time be sure to put my 2 penneth worth in..........Thanks.

[CrawlingEye]

Originally posted by old_skool
why cant we all just......get along?
anyway i think the leds are cool. i would definitely put them on a worthy bass. if you wouldnt its up to you. its your decision. not anyone elses.

I'll finish making my point, if anyone's still confused about it... My point is:

Put it on a worthy bass, not a squire. Don't get $800 lights and put 'em on a $200 squire or $100 rogue. I understand there's a lot of people here who just started playing bass and want to know what you need for it and all... I'm trying to insure that they're aware that LED's are NOT something you *need*.

If you have a bass that's worth putting 'em on, go for it. But make sure you do. As someone said before... "Don't polish a terd"

[Angus]

I don't understand...when did that become an issue now? Or maybe, why did you make it one?

Sigh...

[CrawlingEye]

I assumed it was an issue, since you were arguing it.

[Hambone]

And now that everybody has had their say, and said it again, I think this thread is going to be shut down. The two posts above are a good example of deterioration into a pissing contest.