intonation too flat

[shughey]

I just recently switched my strings on my Fender Jazz to La Bella flatwounds. Since then my intonation on the D and G strings have gone very flat. I tried loosening to the truss rod, but it didn't make a big difference. I also shortened the strings at the all the way but it's still pretty flat. what should i do?

[Rickett Customs]

Originally Posted by shughey

I just recently switched my strings on my Fender Jazz to La Bella flatwounds. Since then my intonation on the D and G strings have gone very flat. I tried loosening to the truss rod, but it didn't make a big difference. I also shortened the strings at the all the way but it's still pretty flat. what should i do?

Trussrod is not gonna do it, trust me.

Don't quite know what you mean by "shortened the strings".

If by adjusting the saddles on the bridge, no not the height adjustment, but the adjustment
that moves the saddle back and forth, towards and away from the bridge, you might want to consider comparing (with a good tuner, or at least decent) the open string, (of each string that you think or perceive is flat) then the 12th fret and the 13th fret. If you can get the string tuning the same in all 3 positions, then you are "intonated", if this seems like much to do, take it to a decent music store with a good reputation and have them set it up for you.

[Phalex]

Move the saddles a bit towards the nut.

[shughey]

Originally Posted by Phalex

Move the saddles a bit towards the nut.

that's what I did, the are all the way forward, I can't move them foward anymore.. that's the problem.

[JTE]

Press down slightly on the strings right where they come off the bridge towards the neck. That will give you a good "witness point" for the strings and should help narrow down the problem. Make sure the strings are sitting in the nut correctly. It's quite possible that the new flats are enough bigger than your previous strings that they're not sitting in the nut and you may need to file the nut slots a bit.

Then, make sure the truss rod is right before you do anything else. You already jacked with the rod, so make sure it's back where it belongs. Then set your intonation. If you don't KNOW how, take it to a good tech. And the right way to set intonation is to check the open string or its 12th fret harmonic to the fretted note at the 12th fret. The idea is to get the string set so the 12th fret is exactly at the mid-point between the nut and the bridge, adjusting for the amount the string bends when you fret it. This assumes the strings are vibrating the same over the entire speaking lenght and that there are good contacts at the saddle and the nut.

So, play the harmonic, tune the string to pitch and make sure it's stable- that's your reference pitch. Then fret it at the 12th fret and check that note against your reference note. If the fretted note is flat, that means the string is too long between the saddle and the 12th fret, so you need to shorten the string by moving the saddle towards the nut. If the fretted note is sharp, your string is too short between the saddle and the 12th fret and you need to move the saddle furhter from the 12th fret towards the tail of the bass.

If it won't set up and you know the neck and the nut are good, then assume it's a bad string. Happens on occasion to every string maker, and if LaBella's customer service is like it was 30 years ago, they'll take care of you.

jte

jte

[shughey]

I tried moving the saddles forward and they are all the way forward and it's still too flat.

[XylemBassGuitar]

Shughey,

Did you check what JTE suggested about pressing the strings down in the saddles and making sure they are seated properly in the nut? If not, check those things first...

Failing that, I've heard of a few people on this forum having similar problems with LaBella strings. It may just be the strings.

Also, did you get strings that are a much heavier gauge than your original strings? Heavier gauges of the same string require the saddles to be farther forward than their lighter counterparts. It is rare, but it may be possible that your bass' bridge was not set far enough forward to accomodate very heavy gauges of the higher strings D and G.

If none of this helps, your best bet would be to take the bass to a good repair tech just as Alembicplyr suggests.

Good Luck!

[EclecticElectrk]

Originally Posted by Alembicplyr

Trussrod is not gonna do it, trust me.

Don't quite know what you mean by "shortened the strings".

If by adjusting the saddles on the bridge, no not the height adjustment, but the adjustment
that moves the saddle back and forth, towards and away from the bridge, you might want to consider comparing (with a good tuner, or at least decent) the open string, (of each string that you think or perceive is flat) then the 12th fret and the 13th fret. If you can get the string tuning the same in all 3 positions, then you are "intonated", if this seems like much to do, take it to a decent music store with a good reputation and have them set it up for you.

how could the 13th fret be the same note as the 12th?

[EclecticElectrk]

i still dont understand the concept of intonation- how can the string , played as a harmonic be the same exact pitch as the string pressed down(the string is then shorter, so how could it be an equal note?

[Rickett Customs]

Originally Posted by EclecticElectrk

how could the 13th fret be the same note as the 12th?

It's not Don't be silly

It's just a method I use, the 13th fret will not be the same note as the 12th fret.
It's just another reference note other than the actual octave.
But that's just the way I intonate, so cast it away if you must.

[JTE]

Originally Posted by EclecticElectrk

i still dont understand the concept of intonation- how can the string , played as a harmonic be the same exact pitch as the string pressed down(the string is then shorter, so how could it be an equal note?

It's NOT shorter. The 12th fret harmonic is the node of the string, and divides the string exactly in half. It's basic physics of a vibrating string. The open string vibrates from the nut to the saddle, but it has nodes that also divide it at different points. If you put your finger at the half-way node, it prevents the fundemental wave (from the nut to the bridge) from developing, and allows the octave node to be the primary sound you hear.

jte

[Dr. Feelgood]

I really though this thread was going to turn into the next "replace the battery"!

At least the OT tried the obvious first...