Loosen strings before saddle adjustments?

Oded Ben-Ami · #1 01-27-2010, 03:59 PM

Hi,

I'm interested in setting up my own bass, something I have never done before.
I read all the setup guides in the sticky and was particularly interested in the Jerzy Drozd guide - full of detail, the way I like it.

In my Ibanez owner's manual, under "intonation" there is an asterisk with a note in small print that reads:

Please note that strings can be broken when the saddle is moved, so always loosen the strings before making any adjustments.

It is written under "intonation" but the moving of the saddles is clearly related to the action as well.

Does that make sense ?
As far as I can recall, non of the guides in the sticky mentioned loosening the strings before making adjustments to the saddles ...

memyselfandi · #2 01-27-2010, 04:19 PM

its always best to loosen the string you want to adjust before you make any adjustment so as any movement of the saddle is not hindered by the pressure the string is applying to the saddle, do your intonation adjustment last after balancing truss rod and action then intonation, re-tune check and if you still need to adjust then slacken that string re-adjust tune up and check

202dy · #3 01-27-2010, 07:35 PM

Loosening the strings, and retuning every time the intonation is checked, only adds time and unnecessary steps that complicate the process.

BigOldHarry · #4 01-27-2010, 07:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 202dy

Loosening the strings, and retuning every time the intonation is checked, only adds time and unnecessary steps that complicate the process.

I think it depends on the bridge... Some bridges have bits that might not be able to handle movement under the pressures/tensions involved... I can see some poorlly made aluminum bridges having issues... but I never had an issue with my old bent-metal Fender bridges.

walterw · #5 01-27-2010, 08:55 PM

with just a twist of the wrist or two you don't need to bother, but when cranking a saddle way back it's a good idea to loosen the string a little, as pulling the saddle back away from the neck will make the string go way sharp.

ehque · #6 01-28-2010, 08:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by walterw

with just a twist of the wrist or two you don't need to bother, but when cranking a saddle way back it's a good idea to loosen the string a little, as pulling the saddle back away from the neck will make the string go way sharp.

Also grinding the underside of the string with the saddle, and the bass plate with the saddle-support screws, and putting unnecessary strain on the intonations screws...

I've already seen some scratches on my baseplate caused by changing the action while the string was at tension.

202dy · #7 01-28-2010, 08:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by walterw

with just a twist of the wrist or two you don't need to bother, but when cranking a saddle way back it's a good idea to loosen the string a little, as pulling the saddle back away from the neck will make the string go way sharp.

Agreed.

Chasarms · #8 01-28-2010, 09:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by memyselfandi

. . . do your intonation adjustment last after balancing truss rod and action then intonation . . .

I agree that you should always set the neck relief first, but intonation and action are married at the hip. That is, an intonation change can affect the action and vice versa.

You really have to play with both back and forth a bit to get it just right. I'm not sure it matters which one you rough in first.

JLS · #9 01-28-2010, 07:20 PM

Oded Ben-Ami · #10 01-28-2010, 07:33 PM

It seems that the camps are divided.
One can only guess that if Ibanez, in their manuals, bothered to mention this (even if only in small print), may be an indication that some users broke their strings and reported back to Ibanez.

It makes sense that it's a different scenario with different type of bridges and string tension. At the moment I have GHS Boomers which are high tension and it appears as though they could make a good candidate for possible breakage (first time that I try them and I just cannot play them).

Thanks everyone for your advice.

ehque · #11 01-28-2010, 10:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chasarms

I agree that you should always set the neck relief first, but intonation and action are married at the hip. That is, an intonation change can affect the action and vice versa.

You really have to play with both back and forth a bit to get it just right. I'm not sure it matters which one you rough in first.

It's easier to do action first since action is mostly based on player preference - intonation isn't, and it won't affect the action enough to be noticable.

KellyM · #12 01-29-2010, 05:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JLS

No.

Heh, succinct, and I agree. You want to re-tune the string for each adjustment? If you do, that is just silly.

Kelly

JLS · #13 01-29-2010, 11:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KellyM

Heh, succinct, and I agree. You want to re-tune the string for each adjustment? If you do, that is just silly.

Kelly

Only time I'd detune, is if a string was intonating extremely sharp, and had to move, say, 1/4" back.

chadhargis · #14 01-29-2010, 12:32 PM

+1 on the sharp. That's what I decided. No need to detune if you are intonating flat. You're going to lower the tension when you adjust the saddle anyway.

T-Bird · #15 01-30-2010, 04:05 AM

Hi.

I always detune before moving a saddle.

No particular reason that I can think of just now as You asked about it, just a good practise I've been following for about 25 or so years now I guess.

Regards
Sam

Truktek2 · #16 01-30-2010, 05:10 AM

I agree. You don't have to de-tune in order to adjust your saddles. I normally don't, but I will say, I have stripped out a few intonation screws by not doing so. Just keep this in mind, and always use a quality tool.

rumblethump · #17 01-30-2010, 08:49 AM

"I normally don't, but I will say, I have stripped out a few intonation screws by not doing so."

Not acceptable when working on a customers bass or guitar.

Exactly the reason I loosen each string before making an intonation adjustment. Any movement of the saddle is going to require retuning any way, so why not loosen the string a couple of turns to make moving the saddle easier? The extra time it takes to do this is maybe 15 seconds? I don't put a time limit on intonation, I just get it right how ever long it takes.

Truktek2 · #18 01-30-2010, 12:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rumblethump

"I normally don't, but I will say, I have stripped out a few intonation screws by not doing so."

Not acceptable when working on a customers bass or guitar.

Exactly the reason I loosen each string before making an intonation adjustment. Any movement of the saddle is going to require retuning any way, so why not loosen the string a couple of turns to make moving the saddle easier? The extra time it takes to do this is maybe 15 seconds? I don't put a time limit on intonation, I just get it right how ever long it takes.

After thinking about it, I'm going to start detuning too. Simple insurance against anything going wrong. I've just been lazy.

rumblethump · #19 01-30-2010, 01:28 PM

Before anyone suggest better tools, I have them. The other part of this equation to be considered is how good of quality is the adjusting screw? Some companies use cheap poor quality parts here. Soft metal, easy to goober up even with a proper sized screw driver if its hard to turn.
When your bridge needs to adjust forward under pressure, do you hammer/push the screw forward after backing it off to move your saddle forward? Backing off the string tension also eliminates the need to do this.