Makeshift setup tools

[JustDavid]

Well, the thought of purchasing automotive feeler gauges can intimidate those new to setup &/or unfamiliar with the cost (they sure sound like something that should be really expensive). Ditto other items.

What are your favorite cheapo setup tools/references?

0.003 feeler gauge masquerades frequently as normal bond paper. 5 cents if you get it from a photocopier

How thick is your average credit card & what do you use it to measure? And no, it's thickness does NOT increase as you increase the balance owed (I've checked

A 1mm guitar pick is
a/ likely inaccurate
b/ very repeatable.

A capo can be a handy tool when measuring neck relief but I've recently learned herein a clothespin can do.

Share away . . .

[slyjoe]

Credit card is 0.030". I don't use it to measure anything.

Cheap capo - pencil and a rubber band.

And jeez - a whole set of feeler guages is about $5.

[JustDavid]

Originally Posted by slyjoe

a whole set of feeler guages is about $5.

I know, I know; even in Canada. But automotive tools are foreign territory for some.

Cool idea for the ersatz capo! Thanks!

[AlembicPlayer]

ditto, feeler gauges are not much moola

however, if you are on the cheap
you could use guitar strings, they come in all kinds of gauges fit for setup work.
I also like to use wound strings as burnishing tools for nut work

[Sinclair]

I often take velcro as a capo. Just wrap it around with some tension.. works great.

[EADG mx]

What basic setup tools AREN'T cheap?

[kevinmoore73]

I think I paid $5.99 for my set of feeler gauges. My nut files were a bit more money than those. Everything else I use for setups was cheap.

[unclejane]

Originally Posted by EADG mx

What basic setup tools AREN'T cheap?

The nut files are the most essential ones that aren't cheap . There are others that are expensive that you can more often do without for most setup purposes, like a set of radius blocks and other tools for doing more invasive repairs.

But a couple months ago I finally broke down bought a set of nut files from stew-mac after years of doing without them (and ruining a bunch of nuts). It was the best 120 bucks I've ever spent. They're hard carbide steel so they're useable for filing down bridge saddles also (a common need for setting up fretless basses). So I no longer have to live with a compromised setup, I can wail away until the sucker is setup right. All the nuts in the apt. are finally the correct height and even my bridges are all finally setup correctly too. So it was worth it.

I wouldn't try to do an end-run around nut files, just bite the bullet, buy a set and get it overwith.

I might have to get a radius block to fix a lifelong problem on my L2000 too, I don't plan to skimp on that type of thing again. BTDT and it almost sent me to the rubber room.

LS

[EADG mx]

Fair enough. Depends on how one would define 'basic'. I was referring to tools such as hex keys, a screwdriver, ruler, capo, tuner, soldering iron and solder. All cheap enough that (imo) a makeshift substitute is not needed. Nut filing is kind of beyond me - I had no idea a set cost that much (ouch)

[lethargytartare]

For nut files -- there are folks on ebay selling cheaper sets that are surely churned out from the East somewhere. My guess is that you can save 30-40% that way.

You can also get needle/micro/jeweler files at a place like Harbor Freight (et al.) that are 5 or 10 bucks, and have a few files that will get you by (and are good for a ton of jobs, actually). Nice thing about real files is that they have a rounded edge, so they are definitely the easiest to get the job done right in one shot.

Some folks describe using sandpaper wrapped around a guitar string to do the full job of adjusting nut slots -- so figure, use a needle file to rough it, then a string+sandpaper to get the final profile and to polish it. It's a lot more work, BUT, how often does the common musician make a new nut? YMMV

In my fretwork and setup classes, we used stacked feeler gauges as part of the nut tweaking process -- which damages the gauges. So I got a bunch off ebay for a nice price...and I didn't have to destroy an actual NICE set of them. BUT, that's where the credit card suggestion above comes in VERY handy -- use cut up credit cards as the main mass, and the layer that will get damaged.

Best tool that I HATED buying -- the setup gauge from stewmac -- the credit card that has all the scales and info on it...really, THAT'S the tool that I use the most, and regret purchasing less and less each time I use it.

Radiused blocks ARE cheap, but are also single-purpose -- if you have multiple instruments, odds are they're not all going to have the same radius. But someone else mentioned a neat thing -- IF you are refretting on the cheap, you can make your own reasonably functional block like this: pull the frets, then tack some sandpaper to the fretboard, grit up. then take a block of wood and run it over the sandpaper -- basically you're working the block into being a radiused block that matches the neck you're refretting. so, that, plus some spray elmers, and sandpaper from a discount hardware store, and you're all set.

Neck support -- if you have a hole-cutting drill bit, just drill a hole through a block, cut that block in half, and tada you have a neck support (add any soft material to pad it.

I've never tried this, but have seen people say you can use baking soda and superglue, mixed together, to rebuild a cracked or chipped nut. They say it hardens enough that you can rework it like the original material (I'm assuming that didn't apply to bone nuts, but then again I've never tried it). This would probably also work to build UP a slot that got too deep.

cheers!

ltt

[EADG mx]

Originally Posted by lethargytartare

I've never tried this, but have seen people say you can use baking soda and superglue, mixed together, to rebuild a cracked or chipped nut. They say it hardens enough that you can rework it like the original material (I'm assuming that didn't apply to bone nuts, but then again I've never tried it). This would probably also work to build UP a slot that got too deep.

cheers!

ltt

I can vouch for this, as long as you're working with a plastic nut it does the trick.

[Slowgypsy]

Someone once wrote to me about using regular high-speed drill bits instead of real nut files. I actually tried it, and... it works. No, it's not as easy as using a real nut file. Holding the drill bits and doing the sawing action can be a bit tricky, but I'm not a luthier, and basically I just make this adjustment once and then the instrument is "set for life".
Just my $.02.

[John Wentzien]

+1
Here it is.http://www.amazon.com/Pro-Quality-20.../dp/B000MOI9G6

[mrhardy]

For myself I can make some non-traditional tools work well.

1.) An old set of light gauge flat strings cut off at the ball end. These are wrapped with sandpaper for nut slot work. They are about 8" long.

2.) A clothespin works as a Capo to pin down the "E" string to check relief. I don't have a need for a capo for anything else.

Tools that I use a lot.

Feeler gauges.
machinist rule.
several small files.
sandpaper in various grits, and mini sanding blocks.
hex wrenches, sae, and metric.
razor blades, works great as a scraper.
screwdrivers, various tip sizes, phillips, and slotted.
radius block for fretboard leveling
various buffing compounds, lemon oil, tung oil.
towels to place work on
glasses to see work up close
soldering iron.
multi-meter
extra foam for pickup mounting.

[mrhardy]

It takes me about 4hrs to cut a nut from a bone blank using my improvised method.

Real nut files are much faster, but the aquisition cost is not warrented for my amount of work. If I needed to cut at least one nut a month, then the time savings alone would be worth it. This is a hobby for me, so I'd rather not spend the money.

Feeler gauges also work well for those real small slots.

[202dy]

My apologies in advance for the rant.

Here on TB, especially on the S&R forum, there seems to be a an attitude of tool buying avoidance. The same folks who spend lavish amounts of time debating the pros and cons of this boutique amp over another or that fifteen hundred dollar bass over another one for twelve hundred are the same folks who suggest using a business card rather than a set of five dollar feeler gauges. The reason usually given is, "I can't afford tools" or "It's good enough"?!!!

In another recent thread, I suggested the use of notebook paper as a makeshift feeler gauge. I don't really think that is the best way to do the job. I did it because I have been called out for assuming that everyone has feeler gauges or suggesting purchasing the right tools.

It is impossible to save money on tools. It cannot be done. If you buy cheap tools you will replace them and eventually will pay more than the outlay would have been for a good tool. If you use makeshift tools you are constantly reinventing the wheel. It is also time consuming to go looking for or making a tool that is already for sale and whose design and fabrication has been perfectly executed. And time is money.

Someone made a point about the average musician making a nut. That is true. The average musician will not make very many of them. Using the wrong tools, or makeshift tools will certainly make the experience such that the average player will never want to do it again.

Using the right tools makes work easy and quick. Someone also mentioned the four hour nut. If you have the right tools it's an hour and fifteen minutes from blank to polished perfection. It can be done faster if 12,000 grit micromesh is not part of the procedure. Tool junkies understand taking it to this level.

It was also suggested using guitar strings and sandpaper to cut nut slots. The strings are flexible. A lot of effort must be expended to insure that the bottom of the slot remains flat. If it is not flat, top dead center will be somewhere in the middle of the nut rather than at the fingerboard edge. If you want to learn how to diagnose a seemingly impossible to solve intonation problem that is exactly the way to get the job done. In this case, if you must use a makeshift tool drill bits are a better choice. But to get the right sizes a complete drill index is usually necessary. More tools to buy, but at least it's a multi-tasker.

I once read an article in Fine Woodworking about the level of craftsmanship seen in a furniture making operation somewhere in the third world. The writer was amazed by the tools he saw being used. There were a few mallets, some junky chisels, a few hand saws, and one screw driver. He crowed with amazement that they were turning out heirloom furniture. Where he would have taken an hour to make a jig and more time to do the set up work the barefoot craftsmen held the chisel at an impossibly awkward angle to make the cut. He ended with the thought that it is the craftsman, not the tool. He is right. But the important word here is not "tool". It is "craftsman".

The average reader here is not a craftsman. He will not do better work with a makeshift tool. Remember that the guys in the heirloom workshop mentioned above aren't working in thousandths of an inch like we are.

In my shop, I have the right tools, and in many cases doubles or updates of the original designs. I've made a few tools and found out through the process that, when shop time is considered, I can't do it any faster, cheaper, or better than Stew-Mac or LMI. It's also true that if you shop around you can find adequate tools for less, especially things that are not luthiery specific. Sometimes you can even find the same thing being sold in a guitar shop supply catalog for less somewhere else. Why do I spend the money? Because these tools enable me to complete repetitive work quickly and precision tasks accurately. My clients won't accept "good enough". They shouldn't have to. I don't believe in it, either.

The point is this: Makeshift tools almost always lead to makeshift repairs. If you want to do professional work professional tools are what you use. The work you do will show it. Buy good ones and you only buy them once.

[mrhardy]

I agree that the right tool makes the job easier. There is however in my case, a need to balance cost with usage frequency.

When I needed to radius sand my fretless board, I bought the tool to do that job. It was worth the cost for a very limited usage.

I don't have to make a new nut very often, and I'm not doing this as a buisness. Paying for a set of nut files to make a few nuts is not worth the cost to myself. I have enough technical background to understand the details of undertaking this procedure, in this manner.

As I said in my post about making a nut this way. Nut files would make this job easier, and take less time. For what I'm doing, I don't mind spending my time in this pursuit. If this was a buisness I would own the tools, as time is money.

I own lots of tools. Some of which are special tools that don't see much use. When I need them, I really need them for what they are. There purchase was weighed as too, could I do the job without it? We all have to decide for ourselves when we can make do, or buy the special tool.

I think your post is important as a counterpoint.

[Joshua]

Originally Posted by 202dy

My apologies in advance for the rant.

Your rants always make me happy.



And great post too...

[lethargytartare]

Originally Posted by 202dy

My apologies in advance for the rant.

In good spirit I will retort :-)

FretBender - $89.90 - does job in: 30 seconds
Hands - free - does job in: 15 minutes, and hurts thumbs
DIY bender - 20 bucks, does job in 30 seconds, plus time to build it

Fret pullers - $26.45
Cheap nippers ground flat on a bench grinder - $6

Set of nut slotting files - $140.98 does job in 1:15
Diy plus makeshift toos - free or cheap - does job in 4 hours

Take the 4 hour example: he wasted 2:45 to save $141 -- so he paid himself $51/hour to make the nut the hard way. That's very economical. When I ask "what's my time worth" if I'm saving more than I get paid at my day job, then it's probably a good deal.

But then consider crowning files -- ugh. Short of hand-filing each fret with a flat file, I don't think there's ANY alternative there -- you get good ones or cheap ones that are slightly less expensive. Or (a) you get a fret job for 300 bucks, or (b) you buy a new neck for some chunk of change relative to the quality of the instrument.

I just think you're overvaluing the quality component here, and undervaluing how expensive these tools are. The OP's question was clearly aimed at being frugal and getting BETTER at it. That's admirable. There are tons of guitarists who have much more time and industriousness than they do money. $140 may not seem like a lot to you, but it's a large sum to a lot of people. Getting a new nut made by a pro only costs 50 or 60 bucks -- getting an adjustment, 10-15. Doing it with makeshift tools is free, period. And those players never have to choose between paying for an adjustment or leaving their instrument in a poorly playable state -- that's the REAL choice. Many guys will simply accept a crappy setup and delay shelling out bucks for someone to give it a setup. But if they figure out a way to do it cheaply, they'll probably set up their instrument MORE OFTEN, so the benefit is more than just the value of ONE tweak.

I work on my car a lot because it saves me a ton of money. Many of the jobs I do would be a LOT easier if I had the right tools -- but as long as I can get the job done right with the tools I have, why shell out 400 bucks for a specialized tool? My gearhead cousin laughs at me for not having an air compressor -- sure does make all the jobs easier! But I can still do the things I need to, so I can't justify the expense.

At the end of the day, you have to accept that while some jobs REQUIRE the right tools, for many many jobs, the "right" tools are a luxury to a large segment of the population.

But I WILL grant you that it's reasonable to expect a higher standard from a pro...but then again, if he works magic, do you really care how he gets the job done?

BTW: the RIGHT tool for setting action and other things is the stewmac string action gauge...that's an awesome tool to have on hand! but at 20 bucks plus shipping, I can't begrudge someone from using a credit card if it gets the job done well enough for them!

I could see being pissed if you saw a lot of "those tools are BS -- all you REALLY need is this..." that's the opposite kind of snobbishness...specialized fretwork and nut work tools are wonderful (and once I was able to afford them, I started buying them) And it think it says a lot that there is almost NO resale market for them...

ltt

[EADG mx]

You get what you pay for, and anything worth doing is worth doing right. I agree with 202dy for the most part.