MIM J upgrades?

[westy1970]

I have a MIM J project bass and I am looking at upgrading the bridge, tuners and electronics.

I saw a Gotoh for about $50 and don't know anything about them as a company. This bass needs some work and when finished will be a back up for my USA and the one I use for lessons.

I also looked at babicz bridge but they are more expensive.

Also the tuners seem pretty weak on this bass so I would be open to suggestions.

I am heading to the local shop in the morning to new pots & a new jack for it. I noticed when I took it apart the jack was not grounded. Is that common or should I ground the jack?

[Bassman822]

The jack normally grounds to the control plate (as long as it's tight). The pickups especially on the early MIM models could stand upgrading (I have a 91 MIM Jazz- pickups upgraded to MIA 60s). I wouldnt worry as much about the pots unless theyre sratchy. Get a Switchcraft jack though. I havent had tuner issues on any of my MIM Fenders (3). The bridge isnt bad, but if I were upgrading, I'd go with the Gotoh 201

[westy1970]

Pickups are definate as I can afford new ones. Thanks for the tip on the jack.

[Phendyr_Loon]

The tuners on all my MIM basses are solid, though Schaller and Hipshot UltraLites are good replacements.
Gotoh bridges are nice, BadAss 2 & 3 models and Hipshot A style bridges are also popular direct replacements for under 100 bones.
Find some CTS pots and Switchcraft jack for sure, try an Orange Drop cap in your favorite value.

[treekiller]

Today I had my first band practice with my newly modded MIM Jazz. It started out life as an '03 fretless, now it has a new Allparts maple(fretted) P neck with NOS Schaller tuners. The body, bridge, p-ups, etc. are all original MIM. It sounds every bit as good as my MIA Jazz(live) and feels great. The only thing I would consider changing is the p-ups, but I'm not for sure what I want and with the whole band the stock ones are pretty decent.

My MIM P Bass has the stock tuners & vintage bridge with CTS pots & a '62 RI p-up. This one has been my main gigging bass, but the Jazz is definitely gonna see quite a bit of stage time!!!

[fhm555]

I recently made some changes to a mexi j basses. A babicz bridge, dimarzio model j pup set, fender straplocks, and a white MOTS pg. I also took advantage of having it all broken down to put a good buffing and polish on everything.

I had issues with the oem bridge and the full contact hardware solved them all. it's a bit spendy and using the (slightly oversized) included mounting screws will prevent going back to the stock L plate and mounting screws without some additional work, but it's nothing beyond the skills of the average diy'er. Good machined bridges ain't cheap and the babicz is no exception, but it's also very functional, easy to install and adjust, and looks just high zoot enough to impress those who are impressed by such things.

The model j pup set is kicking major butt on the stockers. They are much hotter so are a bit tricky to adjust for good sound balance, but once they are properly dialed, look out. They also require some initial volume/tone fiddling, but the reward is massive balls down low and more than adequate highs for all but the most discriminating player, all for less than a C note. What's not to like?

I had to repair a mushy strap button screw anyway so I went with the straplocks for no other reason than my jazz plus came with them and in more than 20 years of regular use have never let me down.

The MOTS guard? All I can say is the pimp hand must remain strong in today's world and what better way to demonstrate that resolve than with some gratuitous flash strictly for the sake of it. Not to mention my wife says it changed my pretty ordinary little blue bass into full blown sex on a stick, whatever that means.

[Giraffe]

I've worked on dozens of MIM instruments, and my opinion is that every one of these instruments needs a pro fret dressing and nut cutting before anything else, This is not a close call.

The tuners, bridges, and pots are generally nothing special but they are usually functional. The fret- and nut-work is almost always the weakest element of these instruments by light-years.

Don't put lipstick on a pig and expect to be satisfied with the results. Once you've played a pro fret/nut/set-up job, you'll see how foolish it is to be obsessing over cosmetics and third-tier mods when your fretboard is ridden with potholes.

[westy1970]

Actually I was able to tighten up the tuners last night. As I can afford it I am ordering the fretting tool set from Stewmac and will practice on an old strat neck but I agree with you about frets. Also, the neck on this soaked up 4 coats of lemon oil before looking decent. I have done plenty of mods to MIM strats and know my way around them pretty good. I am just not familiar with bass parts. I know I am polishing a turd but I am not planning on selling it as I know I will never get my money back. I just don't want to haul my $1500 bass to lessons. Plus it gives me something to do so I don't get into trouble.

[Giraffe]

Have fun, Westy! I highly recommend the fretting book as the tools won't help if you don't know how to use them.

Once you get handy at fret and nut work, it can be almost as much fun as practising!

I don't see what you're doing as polishing a turd, because those basses will work fine once you tune them up. I just hate to see newer players throwing money at replacement bridges, pits, and tuners when their fretboard is a typical Mexi-Fender product. They are not finished as they come out of the box.

Fire truck drives up the street. On the left, a cat is caught in a tree. On the right, an orphanage is ablaze, with little children trapped on the top floor, about to get burned to death. Fire chief is faced with the dilemma: What should I do first?

[Phendyr_Loon]

Originally Posted by Giraffe

Fire truck drives up the street. On the left, a cat is caught in a tree. On the right, an orphanage is ablaze, with little children trapped on the top floor, about to get burned to death. Fire chief is faced with the dilemma: What should I do first?

First thing the fire chief does is save the children, then the he should grab the cat out of the tree and cook it in the blaze before putting it out. That makes a useless animal dinner for the whole station after the call.

[maturanesa]

put some good pickups and pots and you have a bass.
I dont see any difference in tuners or bridge in comparison with MIAs and MIJs...
Not a huge difference in general... Any issue that you can find in a MIM is the same as MIJ or MIA... Even the sound.. In a record or a live show its difficult to know if its a MIA, a MIJ or a MIM..
For me all standards fenders are crappy for the priceyou pay

[Bassmickeyd]

Originally Posted by maturanesa

put some good pickups and pots and you have a bass.
I dont see any difference in tuners or bridge in comparison with MIAs and MIJs...
Not a huge difference in general... Any issue that you can find in a MIM is the same as MIJ or MIA... Even the sound.. In a record or a live show its difficult to know if its a MIA, a MIJ or a MIM..
For me all standards fenders are crappy for the priceyou pay

Good points.
Spend your $$ on pickups and pots, then if you need tuners and bridge do it later. .... You'll always get you money out of pickups.

[westy1970]

Pickups are next payday. I changed out the pots and strings and the sound improved but the action is really high and may need a truss rod adjustment. I think I will take it in for a set up and see if they can lower the action. If not a new bridge may be before pups. I am looking at the Fender Custom Shop 60's.

[Bassmickeyd]

MIM necks seem to do that and need attention. .... You can do it yourself and safe $. .... Get an allen key, fit it in and loosen the trust rod first. (Right to tighten Left to loosen) If it hasn't been moved for a while it may make a noise, but that's normal. After that let it sit a second or two then tighten it by turning it to the right just a quarter turn at a time. Then wait for it to settle in. ..... Don't turn the trust rod more than a 1/4 turn at a time and you'll be fine. .... My MIM moves more than I want, but I can fix it to set it right. .... You'll notice a big improvement with pickups more than a bridge. ..... Buy Falins or Norts, more $ but worth it.

[westy1970]

Adjusted the truss rod and reset the intonation and it is playing better. I going to check out the pickups section.

[fhm555]

Originally Posted by Giraffe

I've worked on dozens of MIM instruments, and my opinion is that every one of these instruments needs a pro fret dressing and nut cutting before anything else, This is not a close call.

I guess both my MIM's had this done already when I got them second hand because they are both fine in that regard.

Any time I look at a bass for the first time I always first check the neck bow, then I look for any random dull/shiny marks on the frets which would indicate excessive wear or in need of leveling and dressing, and on the several used mexi j's I've looked at in the last few months I have yet to find one with a bad neck or crappy frets. All I know to look for on the nut is general overall condition, no cracks, etc, and to see if any strings are riding the edges of the slots instead of fully seated and if the strings are all the same height off the board where they cross the nut. Like the neck bow and frets, none of the MIM j's I've looked at had anything about the nut that looked wrong to me.

As a general rule on a new (to me) bass I'll play it for a while to make sure I like it enough to spend more money on it. Once I'm satisfied I'm going to be keeping it I take it to a tech for a complete IRAN.

In the case of my blue mexi j, during the initial get to know you period I determined I didn't like the way my bridge saddles moved while playing, the pups were thin sounding, and I had a real punky, problematic strap button screw hole. Since it was just basic parts swapping I did the bridge and pup swap, and since it was just an mim bass I drilled out the strap button holes, glued in hardwood pegs and drilled them for the smaller straplock screws. The MOTS pg was all wifey's idea when I told her I was going to be breaking the thing down to do a few upgrades. I forgot to mention in my original post I also enlarged the control cavity slightly and filled and drilled new holes for the control plate to get a better pg to plate fit. After so many years in the machining business, I have a real thing about uneven or gappy joint lines so it had to be done to keep me from obsessing over what most would never even notice. Since I already had it broken so far down I went ahead and dismounted the pots and jack so I could put a good shine on the plate and also put a couple coats of paste wax on the body.

After I got it all back together I took it to a local tech for the IRAN and all he wound up doing was fine tuning the setup. I gave him a brass nut blank with instructions that if he found anything the slightest bit wonky about the original nut to make me a new one from the brass blank. When I got the bass back the brass nut blank was still taped to the back of the headstock and the overall action/feel of the bass was so slick I would have sworn it was greased.

Maybe my standards are just lower than most, but I've picked up and played several mexi j's since last november and I have yet to find one with any fret/nut issues worth mentioning. At worst I've played a couple with frets that needed dressing on the edge of the board, but nothing I couldn't take care of in a minute or so with a good file and some sandpaper. Maybe like my obsession with perfect joints, you have a real thing about MIM frets and nuts so you obsess over them well past the point of reason? Or maybe I'm just very lucky and live in MIM j bass fret/nut defect free zone?

[Giraffe]

Originally Posted by fhm555

...Maybe my standards are just lower than most, but I've picked up and played several mexi j's since last november and I have yet to find one with any fret/nut issues worth mentioning. At worst I've played a couple with frets that needed dressing on the edge of the board, but nothing I couldn't take care of in a minute or so with a good file and some sandpaper. Maybe like my obsession with perfect joints, you have a real thing about MIM frets and nuts so you obsess over them well past the point of reason? Or maybe I'm just very lucky and live in MIM j bass fret/nut defect free zone?

This is not intended to be critical or disrespectful, but until you have gotten familiar with top shelf fret and nut work, off-the-shelf products will seem fine to you, and people like me will appear to be cork-sniffers, all obsessed beyond the point of reason. Once you can tell the difference, those stock fret jobs will look like what they are: unfinished, or incomplete. They will work and sometimes play okay for many, but they are not finished, which partly explains the price of those basses.

I will make a prediction: your life is going to become much more complicated when you get familiar with pro quality fret dressing.

[fhm555]

Originally Posted by Giraffe

This is not intended to be critical or disrespectful...I will make a prediction: your life is going to become much more complicated when you get familiar with pro quality fret dressing.

Same here on being critical or disrespectful.

Why do you think I mentioned that maybe my standards are lower than most before I went on to mention that maybe as a pro in your field you see things the average clod such as myself will never see, or be bothered by?

I make my living these days hand building an item which is available in huge numbers off the shelf so I'm well acquainted with the rather large difference between what the average user will find acceptable and what I know to be perfection of the craft. When my customers get their hands on my work they rave about the beauty and functionality of it and how it is so much better than anything coming off an assembly line, and justifiably so. When I look ay my work, all I can see are the places where I could have done better. my wife says I should not be so hard on myself, but I always ask her, who will keep me striving for perfection if I stop with the pressure? Certainly not my customers, they would be as pleased with half the effort I put in, and to be perfectly blunt only a handful would even know the difference if I only put in half the effort.

I put every bit of myself into every piece I do because it's not a matter of what I can get by with, it's a matter of knowing I've given my best effort to someone who trusted me to do so, and it's also the satisfaction of seeing that knowing smile on the face of one of those few people who can tell the difference when they fist pick up something I've done.

What I've learned doing this for a living over the last 15 odd years is just because they can't tell it does not mean I don't do it, but I also learned I can't rub their noses in the fact they are largely ignorant when it comes to the really fine points that won't effect them either way in their enjoyment of the things I build for them.

The point of all this rambling comes down to this. The average MIM bass is a better player off the shelf than 99% of the people who will ever own one. A pro level fret/nut dressing won't make a bit of difference in the average owners ability to make the thing sing. For every gifted surgeon there are thousands of butchers. Both professions use the same basic tools but only the gifted surgeon can make full use of all the many details which separate a scalpel from a cleaver.

As for my life becoming more complicated, don't count on it. I'm on the back side of life my friend, and one of the truths of being where I am is reaction time and reflexes decline. You would be surprised at what one can rationalize when they come to the realization they are helpless to turn the tide of time. 30 years ago I would have been up late learning to do a proper fret dress after reading your original post, but since my well worn sense of feel and hearing can't tell the difference any more, it's not something I will lose any sleep over.

[4Mal]

Originally Posted by Giraffe

I've worked on dozens of MIM instruments, and my opinion is that every one of these instruments needs a pro fret dressing and nut cutting before anything else, This is not a close call.

The tuners, bridges, and pots are generally nothing special but they are usually functional. The fret- and nut-work is almost always the weakest element of these instruments by light-years.

Don't put lipstick on a pig and expect to be satisfied with the results. Once you've played a pro fret/nut/set-up job, you'll see how foolish it is to be obsessing over cosmetics and third-tier mods when your fretboard is ridden with potholes.

Pretty much I agree with that. First out of the gate on any MIM Fender is fingerboard edges, frets and nut.

After that pickups - the pot's are generally fine though it is always advisabe to double check the bridge ground. My personal pref is the Vintage Vibe JBX-4 woulnd side by side. it is a very nice, pretty close to vintage sounding pickup with zero noise while retaining the J's single coil edge. A great pickup!

After that the bridge. The BA-II is fine if slotted properly - The Hipshot would be my preference these days - I like the higher mass, super adjustable version as opposed to the 'vintage replacement' type personally.

If it were an Ash bodied J (an FSR or similar) I might be inclined to keep the original bridge and replace the saddles with Graphtech graphite barrels - they can help contain the high zing & ring character of a really zingy bass. Very much a matter of taste there.

[Turnaround]

My beater bass is a MIM Jazz. I got it second hand then went to work. Here's what I did to make it "good".

1. Fret level and dressing. The fret job was average but not good enough for me.

2. While the neck was off, I rounded the edges of the fingerboard. Feels so much better with a nicely rounded edge, but I must admit I like a more rounded edge than you find on most instruments. Roger S spoiled me.

3. Nut replacement. I am not a fan of "plastic" nuts. So I fit a new bone nut and slotted it to the proper heights.

4. New tuners. Went with Hipshot HB7's in black (it's a black bass). Much better tuners than the stock MIM's.

5. Replaced the bridge. Really nothing wrong with the stock Fender bridge, but I wanted a black one to go with the new tuners. Chose Gotoh 201. But there's a small issue - the string spacing on the 201 isn't quite wide enough to align the strings with the pickup pole pieces. Something to take note of if you are thinking of a 201 and you have a Jazz that has a wider bridge pickup than the neck one.

6. Replaced the pups. Wasn't thrilled with the stock pups - they had a bar magnet at the base of the pole pieces rahter than individual magnets. Sounds OK but different from what I am used to . Since I had a set of good Jazz pups (Fralin) on hand I used them.

7. New pots. I like CTS pots, not crazy about whatever was in the bass.

8. New tone cap. I have never figured out why .047mfd is the standard cap in passive basses - it's way too muddy for me when fully engaged, I do like a brighter bass. So in went a quality .001mfd cap - just enough to take out some zing.

9. Full copper shielding in all cavities, and rewiring with star-ground system. Helped the noise somewhat, but you can't get rid of single coil noise entirely.

10. New pickguard. Just to be sexy, I fabricated a wood pickguard made of Macassar Ebony. Looks great on the black body.

11. Strap locks - black of course.

I must say that if I had to pay retail for all the bits I put into this bass I would have been further ahead if I just bought a better bass to start with. But I have had offers that would take me well beyond my costs if I were to sell.

In the end it's a souped up Mexi Jazz - along with the limitations inherent to the beast. The wood quality is not great, mostly noticeable in the neck (since the body is painted). A bit heavy for my liking, but you have to pay significantly more for lighter tonewoods these days. And the resonance of the instrument is what you would expect in this price range - passable. It's a wood quality issue mostly.

Would I do it again? Well I did - with a Mexi PBass.