Problem keeping bass in tune

Mingus Dew · #1 09-08-2006, 09:48 PM

After reading the many praises of SX basses I decided to pick up their fretless short scale jazz from rondo. I figured that it would be nice since the agile guitar I bought from them is incredible. The good part is I LOVE the sound I get from it. There's very little hum and the tone with flatwounds is very smooth. Now the big problem...THIS THING WILL NOT STAY IN TUNE. The string will go flat minutes after I finish tuning it up. I am assuming the tuners are absolute junk but is there anything else that could be causing this to happen?

ergodynebass · #2 09-08-2006, 10:22 PM

I'm not sure exactly, one of my basses is like this but the new one I just bought stays in tune for quite a while. I'd like to see a response as well.

JimmyM · #3 09-08-2006, 10:28 PM

Stretch the strings really well, check the neck plate and make sure the neck is screwed on tight, and check that the tuners are screwed on tight.

SherpaKahn · #4 09-09-2006, 12:49 AM

Also make sure that the nut slots are smooth and not too small for the strings that you're using, and that there's no place on the nut that the string could bind and make it difficult to tune. Also, try lubricating your nut with some pencil lead. It sounds silly, but it'll be nice and slippery after rubbing some graphite into the slots.

Mingus Dew · #5 09-09-2006, 12:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JimmyM

Stretch the strings really well, check the neck plate and make sure the neck is screwed on tight, and check that the tuners are screwed on tight.

Yep! this seems to have done the trick. I just realized that the bass must have been sitting in a box for months. It seems to stay in tune alot better now.

JimmyM · #6 09-09-2006, 01:26 AM

Good! Yeah, I learned that one from my luthier a year ago when I had the same problem with my Jazz. Now it stays in tune no matter what.

ddnidd1 · #7 09-12-2006, 09:40 AM

Also, Always tune Up to a note and Never Down to a note.

lomer · #8 09-15-2006, 02:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ddnidd1

Also, Always tune Up to a note and Never Down to a note.

+1 Once I learned this, tuning became soooooo much easier....

pkr2 · #9 09-15-2006, 03:57 AM

Hambone once posted a how to article with the procedure for readjusting the tension spring on tuners that wouldn't stay in tune, complete with pix. It was a great article but a search didn't turn the post up in the archives.

Hambone has made some posts in setup in the last few days so maybe he still has the gist of the post in his notes and will do a repost if he happens to read this.

I hope so because that's one of the few problems with my SX.

Hambone · #10 09-28-2006, 10:10 AM

Guys, I don't think it was me that did that post with pics. I had a long treatise on the various tuners and their quality. Maybe that's what you remember. But, as luck would have it, I do know how to adjust the tension on these inexpensive tuners.

First, disassemble the tuner by unscrewing the phillips head screw on the back of the tuner. You'll now have several individual parts:
- Main screw (the one you just removed)
- A couple of thin washers
- The spur gear
- The tuners stalk with the worm gear and paddle
- The tuner post that you wrap the string around
- And finally, a spring steel retainer with a hole that goes over the post.

The key here is that spring retainer. You've got to put a little more bend in that spring to hold the tuner stalk in the frame. You've got to use a pair of pliers and be very careful because these are tough pieces of steel. I've also made replacement retainers out of thin pieces of polyethylene plastic. They worked because of their thickness and not a bend in the spring. After you've adjusted the retainer, do a test fit. It will be a little more difficult to get it back together because of the new tension in the retainer but, to put it plainly, force the spur gear and screw into place and tighten the screw. This should tighten up the tuner somewhat and give you some resistance when you tune up.

There are lots of cheap tuners and there are lots of ways for a string to go flat and not stay in tune but I sorely doubt that it's because the string is actually "unwinding" the post. The gear ratio of a tuner is somewhere from 20:1 to 25:1 and that high of a ratio makes it impossible to turn the stalk by turning the string post. The combination of a worm gear and a spur gear doesn't work in reverse. If you don't believe me put a tuner in a vice and try to make the paddle turn with the string post. You'll be in a frustrated sweat and the tuner will still be in the same spot. That said, there are any number of reasons to change tuners and trying to get a tightly fitted assembly is certainly a good one.

pkr2 · #11 09-28-2006, 10:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hambone

Guys, I don't think it was me that did that post with pics. I had a long treatise on the various tuners and their quality. Maybe that's what you remember. But, as luck would have it, I do know how to adjust the tension on these inexpensive tuners.

First, disassemble the tuner by unscrewing the phillips head screw on the back of the tuner. You'll now have several individual parts:
- Main screw (the one you just removed)
- A couple of thin washers
- The spur gear
- The tuners stalk with the worm gear and paddle
- The tuner post that you wrap the string around
- And finally, a spring steel retainer with a hole that goes over the post.

The key here is that spring retainer. You've got to put a little more bend in that spring to hold the tuner stalk in the frame. You've got to use a pair of pliers and be very careful because these are tough pieces of steel. I've also made replacement retainers out of thin pieces of polyethylene plastic. They worked because of their thickness and not a bend in the spring. After you've adjusted the retainer, do a test fit. It will be a little more difficult to get it back together because of the new tension in the retainer but, to put it plainly, force the spur gear and screw into place and tighten the screw. This should tighten up the tuner somewhat and give you some resistance when you tune up.

There are lots of cheap tuners and there are lots of ways for a string to go flat and not stay in tune but I sorely doubt that it's because the string is actually "unwinding" the post. The gear ratio of a tuner is somewhere from 20:1 to 25:1 and that high of a ratio makes it impossible to turn the stalk by turning the string post. The combination of a worm gear and a spur gear doesn't work in reverse. If you don't believe me put a tuner in a vice and try to make the paddle turn with the string post. You'll be in a frustrated sweat and the tuner will still be in the same spot. That said, there are any number of reasons to change tuners and trying to get a tightly fitted assembly is certainly a good one.

Sorry for the mistaken credit. You know what they say, the mind is one of the first things to go. lol

Anyway, alls well that ends well.

What you've just posted was basically what I remembered. However on my SX, the spur gear seems to be pressed onto the tuner post. I've never ran across one that didn't slide apart with little more than finger pressure. I've only checked one of the tuners. Maybe the one I checked is just siezed to the shaft for some reason.