Want lower action, but saddles won't go any lower?

[Minger]

Suggestions? I have an Ibanez SR800, in which the saddles are kinda just on the bridge, so I can move the bridge up and down and move the whole thing. But, I can't go any lower...and ever since I put Fender Flats, the tension has pulled the neck upwards a bit, so now the actions a bit too high for me...

The strings are a bit high through the entire neck, so I'll probably need to mess with the truss rod a bit as well...

Suggestions? Shims?

[jeffhigh]

Don't "mess" with the truss rod, Measure the relief and adjust it as necessary.
You will probably need to tighten the truss rod to cope with the higher tension of the flats.
This will probably be all you need, if not you may nedd to shim

[Minger]

I didn't mean mess with it like anything stupid; I know which way to turn for results and not to do more than 1/4 a turn.

Actually, that probalby makes the most sense, as previously I had loosened it because the lower frets were buzzing when I had rounds on.

[EADG mx]

Tighten your truss rod is the best thing to do. Your saddles should never be as low as they can go, from my experience.

[bigd4207]

Correct me if I am wrong but the saddles are mainly an intonation thing. The truss rod is the only way I tweak my action, then if any intonation is off adjust it accordingly but I have never heard of using the saddles solely to tweak action.

[20db pad]

Saddles are used to adjust action after the neck relief is properly set.

Design schemes on some bass guitars don't allow for a really super low action. In some cases you'll need to remove some metal from the bottom of the saddles in order to get a lower action than the bridge lets you get now.

For this stuff, you have to take the bridge apart, take all the screws and hardware off the saddles, and do each saddle individually. Usually, the higher string's saddles are the ones that need the most metal removed.

I've done this before with a metal file about an inch wide and slowly removing the material and checking often to see if I was getting the result I wanted. If you take too much off, you can't put it back. Read that once more again with feeling

For flat-bottomed saddles I've also used a belt sander which gives a uniform and consistent result. It's best to use gloves when doing it this way because the saddles get very hot.

As always, if this seems to be a little intimidating, go to someone who is more comfortable doing it such as your local luthier.

[avast_bass]

Originally Posted by bigd4207

Correct me if I am wrong but the saddles are mainly an intonation thing. The truss rod is the only way I tweak my action, then if any intonation is off adjust it accordingly but I have never heard of using the saddles solely to tweak action.

See the allen key head 'screws' in most saddles. They are there for a reason! Saddles tend to move forward and back (for intonation), and up and down (for action). I don't often find that you need to stick the saddles down THAT low though, and I've never filed them down to sit even lower before.

[SGT. Pepper]

You have to straighten the neck. One thing I learned is that Ibanez SR series and flats don't mix. The necks are just too thin to handle the tension from flats as well as a fatter neck.

[pkr2]

Originally Posted by jeffhigh

Don't "mess" with the truss rod, Measure the relief and adjust it as necessary.
You will probably need to tighten the truss rod to cope with the higher tension of the flats.
This will probably be all you need, if not you may nedd to shim

What he said!

[bigd4207]

Originally Posted by avast_bass

See the allen key head 'screws' in most saddles. They are there for a reason! Saddles tend to move forward and back (for intonation), and up and down (for action). I don't often find that you need to stick the saddles down THAT low though, and I've never filed them down to sit even lower before.

Well I will be a SOB. I have noticed them before but never knew why they were there. I thought adjusting the length was the only way to move the saddles. HHHMMMMM, excuse me guys, I have some tweaking to do.

[Jazzin']

Wouldin't shimming be the best idea?

[JcHc]

could you guys also help me? veiw my thread "problems with Badass II" saddle wont go any lower, and my action is way high.

[Minger]

Alrite.

Lets see...today, I definately fixed it by a bit (dropped a few milimeters or so)...

Turned truss rod 1/4, and shimmed it with 2 layers of strips of playing cards. Worked out great, but the first few times with the shims I forgot to hold the neck all the way with the body so I couldn't realize why it was still high after I shimmed it until I looked at the neck pocket sticking up a centimeter.

[Foamy]

QUOTE from other post
For flat-bottomed saddles I've also used a belt sander which gives a uniform and consistent result. It's best to use gloves when doing it this way because the saddles get very hot.
END QUOTE From another post

Do not use gloves with ANY power tool. I appreciate the reason gloves are suggested, but it is not safe in the least bit. Use another tool to hold them, but DO NOT use gloves.

Hmm...what to suggest? I have not had to do this, but if I had to, I'd use a chisel to make a hole in a block of wood about 3/16" deep that fits the saddle, and hold onto the wood. Pliers with hard rubber jaws would work too, but I like the file idea alot better.

[pkr2]

Originally Posted by 20db pad

Saddles are used to adjust action after the neck relief is properly set.

Design schemes on some bass guitars don't allow for a really super low action. In some cases you'll need to remove some metal from the bottom of the saddles in order to get a lower action than the bridge lets you get now.

For this stuff, you have to take the bridge apart, take all the screws and hardware off the saddles, and do each saddle individually. Usually, the higher string's saddles are the ones that need the most metal removed.

I've done this before with a metal file about an inch wide and slowly removing the material and checking often to see if I was getting the result I wanted. If you take too much off, you can't put it back. Read that once more again with feeling

For flat-bottomed saddles I've also used a belt sander which gives a uniform and consistent result. It's best to use gloves when doing it this way because the saddles get very hot.

As always, if this seems to be a little intimidating, go to someone who is more comfortable doing it such as your local luthier.

I'm sorry to disagree and don't take this personally but this information is just wrong.

NEVER use a nonreversible repair method when a reversible repair will work as well or better.

While what you describe will technically work, so will gouging out the bridge plate to drop the saddles down. A simple shim and there's no need to destroy the bridge.



Given the info that Ming furnished, a shim is needed. Maybe a slight tweak of the truss rod because of the different strings.

[pkr2]

Originally Posted by 20db pad

Saddles are used to adjust action after the neck relief is properly set.

Design schemes on some bass guitars don't allow for a really super low action. In some cases you'll need to remove some metal from the bottom of the saddles in order to get a lower action than the bridge lets you get now.

For this stuff, you have to take the bridge apart, take all the screws and hardware off the saddles, and do each saddle individually. Usually, the higher string's saddles are the ones that need the most metal removed.

I've done this before with a metal file about an inch wide and slowly removing the material and checking often to see if I was getting the result I wanted. If you take too much off, you can't put it back. Read that once more again with feeling

For flat-bottomed saddles I've also used a belt sander which gives a uniform and consistent result. It's best to use gloves when doing it this way because the saddles get very hot.

As always, if this seems to be a little intimidating, go to someone who is more comfortable doing it such as your local luthier.

I'm sorry to disagree and don't take this personally but this information is just wrong.

NEVER use a nonreversible repair method when a reversible repair will work as well or better.

While what you describe will technically work, so will gouging out the bridge plate to drop the saddles down. A simple shim and there's no need to destroy the bridge.



Given the info that Ming furnished, a shim is needed. Maybe a slight tweak of the truss rod because of the different strings.

[lug]

First things first. You properly set the relief with the trussrod BEFORE making ANY other adjustments. If your relief on the neck isn't properly set, all the other adjustments will not be proper for all fretted positions. If you do not know how to adjust the trussrod, find an online tutorial or take it to a pro.

[Audiophage]

Hey cool, since you're also living in Rochester I could actually look at it for you.