What's great about the 'Badass' bridge?

[Stone Soup]

Originally Posted by tekdiver500ft

That negates it how?


Oh, yeah, it doesn't.

A friend and client of mine has been playing for 40 years, and he can't do a basic set up.

Difference between he and I? I'm not technically challenged. Seems you and your 'techs' might be. It's really very simple to intonate ANY bridge with one adjustable saddle per string. Your claim is, at best, silly.

[DigitalMan]

IMO aftermarket bridges are nice to have if you are looking to replace a bridge you feel is problematic for whatever reason. I don't see a real benefit over stock bridges in most cases. Having said that, the BA is a solid and reliable bridge.

[bassbully]

I would love to see a true Fender/Squier bridge bent from just the strings...um..yea.

[cjp3044]

Originally Posted by bassbully

I would love to see a true Fender/Squier bridge bent from just the strings...um..yea.

I've had a bridge bend from the strings - Fender style bridge, but I can pretty much guarantee it wasn't a real Fender or Squier bridge (maybe a Squier affinity bridge - don't know if they use super cheapo parts everywhere on those), but this metal was just incredibly soft and I think it broke down, when I took it off I swear I could bend it with my bare hands. Found the bridge in a parts box when I was building a bass and really have no idea where it came from or what brand it is. I'm still looking for it in my junk drawers as I am sure I didn't throw it away and wanted to post a pic of it.

Back to the topic of aftermarket bridges - just put a Babicz on a Vintage Modified Squier Jazz for a customer. Very, very nice bridge, well made, hefty, great adjustment options andit looks really cool. Does it make a difference -- on this bass, I don't know since it isn't mine I don't really have a frame of reference, however as I said in an earlier post, I have had BAs change the tone and sustain on some basses and one where it really made no difference at all, and might have even been slightly worse than the stock bridge on an American P with string through body. I think that's why there is so much back and forth in this thread of the "yes it changes tone" vs "no it does nothing" - I believe that whether an aftermarket bridge will or will not help is a function of the instrument itself and the current hardware on it. I currently have them on three J basses - on one it made a big difference, one of the others came stock with it (a Geddy Lee), and on the one I built, I used one to replace the bent bridge mentioned above - if I hadn't been given the BAII for it, I probably would have put a stock Fender bridge on and on that instrument, I really don't think it would have made much, if any difference. So I guess what I'm trying to say is whether it will help or not is not a black and white answer - maybe it will, maybe it won't. YMMV

[StebonPlezon]

I had an inexpensive Penco Jazz Bass copy. The original bridge was thin metal with cheap plating. I replaced it with a Badass which appearance-wise was a great improvement. As far as functionality, An increase in sustain was immediately noticeable. I attribute that to the increased weight and mass of the bridge which seems to better conduct string vibrations through the body of the guitar. However, I do NOT endorse replacing the bridge on just 'any' guitar. I think most bridges on mid to high end quality guitars are fine and there is very little to be gained to justify the expense. But for a low budget bass that doesn't require any structural modifications to fit, it makes sense.

[bootsox]

Originally Posted by StebonPlezon

I had an inexpensive Penco Jazz Bass copy. The original bridge was thin metal with cheap plating. I replaced it with a Badass which appearance-wise was a great improvement. As far as functionality, An increase in sustain was immediately noticeable. I attribute that to the increased weight and mass of the bridge which seems to better conduct string vibrations through the body of the guitar. However, I do NOT endorse replacing the bridge on just 'any' guitar. I think most bridges on mid to high end quality guitars are fine and there is very little to be gained to justify the expense. But for a low budget bass that doesn't require any structural modifications to fit, it makes sense.

But then again a $200 bridge on a $90 bass doesn't make much sense either.

[MetroBass]

Originally Posted by aasti3000

Okay, before I see the sarcastic comments, please remember I'm a newbie bass player. I have a Fender Precision deluxe 5 string with the stock bridge. But most of the Fender threads I see I notice bassists switch their bridge to a badass bridge which I remember was on my Marcus Miller.

Can someone explain what's great about the Badass bridge? Or even one I think I read called a Hipshot bridge? I'm still trying to learn the technical aspects of a bass. You guys sound like NASA experts sometimes with your technical knowledge. Should I change the bridge on my bass? Will it make a difference in sound or something?

OK as a noobie bass player the difference is nill, zero, zilch, nada. "MOST" of us FENDER BASSISTS don't change their bridge to BAs. That is a major misconception you're reading. There's a lot of better ways to spend 100 dollars.

[cjp3044]

I would call this a misconception - almost every Fender player I know has swapped out their bridge with a BA (or Hipshot or Babicz, or...). Whether it makes a difference I believe depends on the instrument itself to begin with. On some instruments, in my personal experience, the difference is quite dramatic, in other situations, the difference, if any, was indescernible. While some people think they are useless and a waste of money, there are others that wouldn't have their instrument any other way. And a BA can be had for a lot less than $100, just check ebay, or if you know someone with an Allparts account see if they will order one for you at their cost (from Allparts they are just over $50 if you have a commercial account with them). And some people just think they look cool, and if that's all they are after, hey, more power to them! Is a BA bridge the end-all beat-all product that you simply MUST have on your bass? No, of course not, and doubtful that any difference in sound would really be worth the expense either unless you simply want one (nothing wrong with that) or if you happen to have an instrument that it DOES make a difference on

They are not "useless" if you like them, they are only "useless" if you don't like them. And THAT is up to the individual.

Originally Posted by MetroBass

OK as a noobie bass player the difference is nill, zero, zilch, nada. "MOST" of us FENDER BASSISTS don't change their bridge to BAs. That is a major misconception you're reading. There's a lot of better ways to spend 100 dollars.

[micgtr71]

I was going to replace the ridge on my Squier P because it was one of those bridges that has a history of sliding and shifting. Instead, my tech put nail polish under the saddles so they wouldn't move. Highly effective and cheaper than a badass. I like the look of a badass but could not justify placing a $100 bridge on a bass I paid $179 for.

[micgtr71]

^ that being said I did place a hipshot a style bridge on my MIA jazz and do notice a difference.

[grendle]

Originally Posted by bassbombs84

I had the original bridge on my 77 P-bass break down on me, so I sprung for the BAII. It holds strong with aggressive playing, has better sustain (on WHOLE notes), and slightly changed the tone of the instrument (more highs). This was obvious when I made the switch.

No additional holes were required, so the mod is completely reversible.

It looks awesome as well.

Sorry you guys cant hear the difference.

my experience as well.

[bigsnaketex]

My Steve Harris model came with the BAII on it straight from the Fender factory in Japan - and I love it.

Yes, it sounds different than my other P-Basses but it's a different bridge so I would expect that.

It's all in the ear of the bassist as to what tone they are looking for and we all know that we have many different basses for all those tones in our heads!!

[rubbadubdub]

I shouldn't be saying this just before I put my badass on evilbay but I think their popularity is down to mojo bull!*+! marketing and innate human desire for tinkering. Fashion may have something to do with it to although that's inseperable from the marketing and mojo 'credibility'.
As for the improvements they offer? If there are any improvement they are so slight that I couldnt tell through some very good studio monitors. A lot of people will 'hear' an improvement because they are expecting to or want to. Especially when they just paid far too much for something they could have done without.
If you like the look or feel the need to follow a trend that's cool but don't expect your bass to suddenly sound or feel much different. Apart from the extra weight of having an ugly lump of steel stuck to your pride and joy that is.

[tekdiver500ft]

Exactly. "Sorry you guys can't hear the difference..." Well, you're hearing something that simply isn't there. You "hear" it in order to justify the cost in your own mind. Looks? Personal preference, but I like the way they look, for the most part.

As far as I'm concerned, the only true benefit to them is to add weight to improve balance.

[bumperbass]

I have a MIM P-bass. I changed mine to a vintage threaded saddle bridge because the saddles were creeping down due to vibrating saddle screws. I don't have that problem anymore. Yeah, I coulda used locktite or nail polish, but I like the small adjustment I have in the location of the strings on the saddles. Plus, it's still a Fender bridge on a Fender bass. It was about $30, I believe; maybe less. Can't remember.
I've also heard (but not experienced it) that if you put a Badass on and decide to take it off and put the original back on, the finish will have a slight indentation where it was taken off. I'll stick with my 'stock' bridge.
Until someone offers scientific proof, like using a spectrum analyser, oscilloscope or other technical means to prove anything one way or another, I'll continue to believe that putting on a Badass does nothing. However, we all don't like the same thing, so if you think it looks cool, go ahead. If you want to put stickers ll over your bass or change the pickguard to another, it's your bass and that's all that matters.

[maturanesa]

there are many bridges in the market better than Badass...

[grendle]

Originally Posted by tekdiver500ft

Exactly. "Sorry you guys can't hear the difference..." Well, you're hearing something that simply isn't there. You "hear" it in order to justify the cost in your own mind. Looks? Personal preference, but I like the way they look, for the most part.

As far as I'm concerned, the only true benefit to them is to add weight to improve balance.

you really couldnt hear a difference in the attack, the responce and the sustain from the stock bridge? what kind of tone do you generally dial in?

[cjp3044]

What about recordings with the same bass, using the same strings, same settings, etc and the only difference is the bridge - I'd be willing to bet that I could blind test you with those recordings and guarantee you will hear a difference.

BUT, having said that, will it make a difference on EVERY bass? No, absolutely not. But on some basses it will make a dramatic difference -- that's not a function of the "BA mystique" or even the BA bridge itself, the same could be said of many different bridges. In many cases, adding more mass to the bridge will make a difference, likewise, in many cases it will do absolutely nothing. The BA is a nice bridge, bolts on to a Fender with no modification and is definately more adjustable than a vintage Fender type bridge, then you have Hipshot bridges, Babicz, etc that all offer more mass and more positive contact with the body. The new Fender Hi-Mass bridge is also great, nice and heavy - if I had one of those on, I certainly couldn't think of a good reason to replace it.

There are so many arguments for and against after market bridges - the people that say they make no difference and the people that say they are the best things since sliced bread are simply both wrong. Abridge with higher mass can, but not always, make a difference in sound. A difference -- not necessarily better and not necessarily worse. I believe I have posted this information earlier, but I have three J basses, all of them have BAIIs - one came stock (Geddy Lee model), One I put on a fretless I built because the bridge was given to me, otherwise that bass would have had a stock Fender bridge as any difference a BA *might* have made on that bass would be to add sustain and maybe bring out the highs a little, which is NOT be the tone I would be after on that instrument, but it was free, so... And the third - yes a dramatic difference in tone and sustain - it's considerably brighter with more sustain than it had with the stock bridge.

Conversely, I put a BAIII on an American Standard P (I used the III because it has the capability of string through body unlike the II and that bass had that option as well) - THAT was a mistake- it worsened the sustain and made the bass sound kind of "tinny" - sounded MUCH better with the stock bridge, which went back on within 2 weeks of "trying" to like the BAIII. Blech, at least on that bass. BTW - I sold that P because it weighed almost 11 pounds and killed my shoulder after a long gig night. I believe the weight of the bass had a lot to do with how the bridge interacted with it. I am in the process of building another P (with a J neck) and have no plans to put a BA or anything other than a stock Fender bridge, preferably one of the newer Hi-Mass bridges. I *might* go with a Babicz, but only because I think they look cool and the adjustments on them are fantastic, but I doubt it cause I'm going for an old school beater P bass vibe with this one - it's not intended to be a "pretty" bass, just a functional, comfortable P.

Is replacing the bridge necessary? Of course not. Will replacing the bridge be like some magical spell? Highly doubtful. Can it change the tone of your instrument? Yes, it can, but your results will vary on a LOT of other factors. Will it change the tone of your instrument? Possibly, possibly not.

Originally Posted by bumperbass

I have a MIM P-bass. I changed mine to a vintage threaded saddle bridge because the saddles were creeping down due to vibrating saddle screws. I don't have that problem anymore. Yeah, I coulda used locktite or nail polish, but I like the small adjustment I have in the location of the strings on the saddles. Plus, it's still a Fender bridge on a Fender bass. It was about $30, I believe; maybe less. Can't remember.
I've also heard (but not experienced it) that if you put a Badass on and decide to take it off and put the original back on, the finish will have a slight indentation where it was taken off. I'll stick with my 'stock' bridge.
Until someone offers scientific proof, like using a spectrum analyser, oscilloscope or other technical means to prove anything one way or another, I'll continue to believe that putting on a Badass does nothing. However, we all don't like the same thing, so if you think it looks cool, go ahead. If you want to put stickers ll over your bass or change the pickguard to another, it's your bass and that's all that matters.

[rubbadubdub]

I would like to take you up on the blind test and would have to agree that just because it didn't make a difference on my bass it won't on someone elses. My bass is a fairly heavy piece of alder with excellent sustain and note definition as standard. On a light piece of wood it may make a noticable difference but I would not expect it to be dramatic.
I have an SG guitar which to I fitted a Lenny Pogan pitch changer instead of the standard tailpiece and I did notice an improvement in sustain. This device is a heavy piece of brass though and the guitar is much thinner and more resonant than any of my basses.
Blind tests can be fraught with problems though and a lot of academics place little value on them for all sorts of reasons. If money is no object then blow a substantial amount on the badass by all means but if money is tight you would be better off spending the same amount on new strings. Any bass is only as good as the strings on it and you can buy a lot of strings for the price of a badass.

[cjp3044]

I don't disagree one bit. Since this thread started I looked into what the BAII is selling for these days (new), and they are about twice the price now as when I bought one. I believe I paid right at $50, but looks like the going price now is over $100. I still see them pop up used for a good price now and then, but for that money, IF I were going to change a bridge, I'd probably go with something cooler - I'm really digging the Babicz right now.

You're also right about blind tests, but just for an experiment (and a shameless plug) check out a couple of these recordings - I just tried to listen to them on my crappy work work computer speakers and it sounds pretty bad, no bass in the mix, but if you listen to them on a decent system you should be able to tell -- pay particular attention to "Something You Can't Buy", "Alone With You" and "Six Days On The Road" - same bass, same settings, different bridge on at least on of those three - I won't reveal which one yet, see if you can tell (If you can get a decent sound - I think this is the first time I've listened to these from online) http://www.reverbnation.com/GrayHorseBand

Let me know what you think and if you can tell a tone difference. This should be an interesting experiment. :-) Of course it really doesn't prove anything, but... you never know.

Originally Posted by rubbadubdub

I would like to take you up on the blind test and would have to agree that just because it didn't make a difference on my bass it won't on someone elses. My bass is a fairly heavy piece of alder with excellent sustain and note definition as standard. On a light piece of wood it may make a noticable difference but I would not expect it to be dramatic.
I have an SG guitar which to I fitted a Lenny Pogan pitch changer instead of the standard tailpiece and I did notice an improvement in sustain. This device is a heavy piece of brass though and the guitar is much thinner and more resonant than any of my basses.
Blind tests can be fraught with problems though and a lot of academics place little value on them for all sorts of reasons. If money is no object then blow a substantial amount on the badass by all means but if money is tight you would be better off spending the same amount on new strings. Any bass is only as good as the strings on it and you can buy a lot of strings for the price of a badass.