Can Anyone Recommend Some Fusion That Isn't Tedious?

[Would'e?]

I'm an old school hard rock and metal guy. Give me Black Sabbath over King Crimson any day.

But I recently started playing in a fairly progressive hard rock band. Our drummer, who is great BTW and FWIW, is heavily influenced by prog and greatly by fusion. I have been trying to turn him on to the heavy grooves of King's X and Tool and he has been tossing old Genesis and Brand X at me.

So far I'm not finding anything to really groove on in that stuff. Stanley Clarke's School Days is a fun listen, and some of the Brand X stuff peaked my ears, but for the most part I can't see myself ever voluntarily listening to this stuff. The musicianship sure is great, but to my ears it just doesn't sound very, well, musical.

The Genesis was fairly tortuous (maybe that is a bit much) and Jeff Beck's fusion stuff almost puts me to sleep. Jean-Luc Ponty's Cosmic Messenger grabbed me quickly with it's cool title track and then promptly lost me with it's noodly jazz meanderings.

So can anyone recommend me some fusion that might serve as a gateway for my metal-addled mind? Right now I kind of feel like I should learn to take my medicine; it may taste like crap, but I know it is supposed to be good for me.

It may turn out that this isn't the music for me, but I'd like to give it all careful consideration before I dismiss it, if only for the sake of intraband camaraderie

[Blackbird]

Allan Holdsworth, maybe?

I'm with Joshua. What have you heard and what was tedious about it?

[bottomzone]

I'm not sure what you're searching for, but check these out:

-Return to Forever-Romantic Warrior
-Vertu-Vertu
-Allan Holdsworth-Metal Fatigue and Road Games
-Adam Nitti-Evidence and Balance
-Bunny Brunel-Ivanhoe
-Lenny White-Venusian Summer and The Adventures of Astral Pirates


Keep God First!

A Groove is a Terrible Thing to Waste!

[KidFunky]

Headhunters - Straight from the gate
Unbelievable Album

[StanFan]

Check out Chick Corea Elektric Band and Tribal Tech to check out some great musicianship and 2 excellent bass players in John Patitucci and Gary Willis.

[Sarbecue Boss]

check out
Mahavishnu Orchestra-inner mounting flame
Derek Sherinian-Black Utopia and Blood of the Snake
(heavier stuff)
Chick Corea-Elektric Band

[Bruce Lindfield]

Billy Cobham - Stratus

[stealth51]

Originally Posted by Bruce Lindfield

Billy Cobham - Stratus

+1

[ThorBassManiac]

Check out the good ol' Howe-Wooten-Chambers disc Extraction, it's heavy and fusion as far as I'm concerned.

[Eublet]

Chances are you probably won't get into it by listening to CD's.

What I mean is, have you ever really disliked a band until you just happened to catch them in concert or music festival? Then their CD's suddenly sound great? I think fusion is like that. The CD's to me are usually lack-luster at best compared to live performances, but because of the energy in the live setting, the CD becomes enjoyable.

My recommendation is to get out there and check this stuff out in person. If you try to force yourself to listen to CD's, you might just make yourself more allergic to it IMO.

[stealth51]

Mahavishnu Orchestra - Visions Of The Emerald Beyond

[pedro]

The only fusion I still listen to from time to time is Weather Report but my guess is that it'll be even less to your liking.

[Psychicpet]

yep, Billy Cobham "Stratus" and Mahavishnu's "Inner Mounting Flame" as mentioned before... takes a little to get into but try it out in small doses at first

also.... those modern proggers Porcupine Tree and the modern grand daddys of prog/metal Tool

[onewebfoot]

subscribed. Meantime - does anyone find *any* credibility in books that discuss musical genres? Here's one that pertains. Haven't read it. Not that book-level reading is a norm on a topic like this, or should be. the "look at live" suggestion rocks. http://www.amazon.com/Jazz-Rock-Fusi...1147103&sr=8-2

Edit: If this thread continues, I'd cite Maynard Ferguson, as one of the most innovative geniuses of the Jazz-Rock genre ever to live, and I believe it's more than mere nostalgia on the part of fans. Mere mention or thought of his name gives me goose bumps, but some of his work will indeed strike some as esoteric. Otherwise, Amazon lists nearly every single album by him with 4-5 stars (mostly 5 stars).

[jomahu]

+1 for mahavishnu orchestra. actually, anything from john mclaughlin is awesome.

[Would'e?]

Originally Posted by Joshua

Can you be more specific as to what tracks or discs you heard?

There is a lot of variation in the catalogs of some of the bands you list.

The Dixie Dregs (sometimes called just The Dregs) as well as The Steve Morse Band might be up your alley. Steve Morse's first solo disc (The Introduction) is great. Not sure if it's everyone's definition of fusion, but I like it.

The Dregs! That's actually a good suggestion. I've liked most of what I have heard from them (more when they rock out and less when they get jazzy) and a girl I used to date once dragged me to see Steve Morse in a little club. He was stellar. I don't think he's an improvement on Blackmore for Deep Purple, but he's definitely a rocker.

I've listened to a good bit of this stuff as background music and given close attention to a diverse selection of a few discs. It sounds more alike to me from artist to artist than different. Mostly it isn't nearly as thematic, dramatic, or melodic as the music I tend to like.

For me a great song is three or or four great riffs alternated, a spiffy solo and melodic vocals.

When I hear fusion, I hear atonal noodling over a series of chord changes the almost never repeat over the course of a song. I rarely hear any hooks to hang my hat on or groove to shake my thang to. It seems to be more about, "hey look what I can play" and less about "listen to this great song." I don't even know why most of the discs are even divided into separate songs. Any piece of any one of them could fit into any other or they could all be strung together.

Thanks for the suggestions all. I will keep my eyes, ears and mind open for those titles.

[avid]

Originally Posted by Would'e?

I rarely hear any hooks to hang my hat on or groove to shake my thang to.

The Crusaders in particular these two pieces, Stomp and Buck Dance and Chain Reaction. I can't imagine you won't dig those. When I get into a song I play to death. Those two pieces don't die.

OBTW, I am with you noodling by anyone rockers or fusion sucks.

[T-MOST]

3 words... Return To Forever. If this doesn't light a fire you just don't like fusion!

[pedro]

FWIW, I would agree that Genesis is definitely NOT fusion.

[[When I hear fusion, I hear atonal noodling over a series of chord changes the almost never repeat over the course of a song.

Hardly atonal. I think you maybe searching for a different term here. I'm not knowledgeable on music theory but perhaps its that the solos in fusion are not based on pentatonic scales generally favored by blues and rock guitarist.

[[I rarely hear any hooks to hang my hat on or groove to shake my thang to. It seems to be more about, "hey look what I can play" and less about "listen to this great song." I don't even know why most of the discs are even divided into separate songs. Any piece of any one of them could fit into any other or they could all be strung together.

Plenty of funky grooves w/ Herbie Hancock, Weather Report and Zawinul's Syndicate. For that matter Mike Stern has quite a few cuts that I think are downright dance material. However, based on your post above, I doubt you'll like 'em anyway because these grooves have no resemblence to Deep Purple, and that seems to be your signpost.

My $.02

[Blake Bass]

I think you need to spend ALOT of time listening to jazz and fusion before you'll really understand it. The general public is pretty lazy when it comes to listening to music. They want it to be catchy, simple, and familiar, so as a result the same crap gets rehashed over and over. Fusion is not easy to listen to until your ear becomes accustomed to hearing more complex harmony, rhythmn, and song forms. I really didn't like Chick Corea's Elektric Band at first because it was way over my head. But as I progressed as a musician I began to understand what they were doing on those recordings, now that is some of my favorite music. To progress as a musician you must progress as a listener. It takes work.