D'Angelo Voodoo

tightbidness · #1 10-07-2004, 03:34 PM

This album has been discussed here in the past, but I'm curious if anyone knows what's happening with the bass on the tune Playa Playa. I've read that Pino Palladino used a P-Bass strung with flats and tuned down a whole step. But there are times when the bass sounds doubled up an octave. It's subtle and intermittent. Upper register fills and double stops aren't doubled, but the main groove is for the most part. Does anyone hear what I'm talking about? Is this D'Angelo's production work?

Wrong Robot · #2 10-07-2004, 10:31 PM

What a coincidence, I just listened to that album from start to finish earlier today.

xolin · #3 10-24-2004, 12:06 AM

Any more info on this album? I'm trying to use it to get some knowledge good note placement within the rhythm. Tone sounds amazing as well (the doublestops are tasteful, too).
Is there any theory to learning how to groove within these beats or is it a listen and feel thing?

jokerjkny · #4 10-24-2004, 01:39 AM

listen, feel, and pray...

aint no one lays it down like Pino. ridiculously laid back pocket that never feels sluggish, and yet groovey. listen to his new track with Jill Scott, "Cant Explain". been keeping me up, just trying to apply that feel to other songs i'm working on.

20db pad · #5 10-24-2004, 02:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tightbidness

Does anyone hear what I'm talking about? Is this D'Angelo's production work?

I think what you're hearing is a guitar doubling the main theme of the bass part. It's a common device in soul and R+B recordings.

I know it's being debated elsewhere on the forum, but working with a metronome helps to devolop the skill of locking in at slower tempos. My partially educated guess is that "Playa" clocks in around 85-90 bpm. Along with the standard 4 count, I also divide the tempo in half and make the clicks the "2" and the "4". A tempo of 86, say, gets knocked down to 43.

tightbidness · #6 10-24-2004, 11:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 20db pad

I think what you're hearing is a guitar doubling the main theme of the bass part. It's a common device in soul and R+B recordings.

The guitar is doubling at points, but listen from 6:08. The guitar drops out and it's easier to hear what I'm talking about. The bass has a weird resonance to it. Anyone hear it?

tightbidness · #7 10-24-2004, 11:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by xolin

Any more info on this album? I'm trying to use it to get some knowledge good note placement within the rhythm. Tone sounds amazing as well (the doublestops are tasteful, too).
Is there any theory to learning how to groove within these beats or is it a listen and feel thing?

Pino addresses that in the March 2004 BP.

D'Angelo's behind-the-beat grooves have intrigued many musicians. What light can you shed on the subject?
It's something D and Raphael Saadiq got from hip-hop--where the samples are not always in perfect time, creating a sloppy feel--which they incorporated into the way they feel the music. [edit]

How do you approach the feel?
The only way I can play that style of bass--really hanging back--is for the drummer to sort of ignore what I'm doing. The tension is created by the drummer keeping the beat strongly in the middle and maybe even pushing slightly. If the drummer tries to hold back with me, the tension is gone. I like to feel the snare just on the edge of pushing, and then I can sit back in a certain space that makes the grrove wider. It's not about listening to the drummer and playing an instant later; I'm still locking with the drums, but I'm feeling the groove in a different rhythmic dimension.

xolin · #8 10-24-2004, 01:07 PM

Woah, thanks a lot. It seems I'll have to work some stuff out with my drummers while practicing. I always thought that I sucked as I would completely throw them of when I tried to do those sorts of lines...they always think that they have to tie in with me perfectly, I thought I just put the placement wrong (still a possibility

)

Thank you very much, again.

Colin

xolin · #9 01-17-2005, 05:55 AM

Time to resurrect.
Anyone have at least some charts for some D. Songs?

Freeloader · #10 01-17-2005, 06:36 AM

i don't think its something you can 'try' to do. its more just the feel. that way, d'angelo's music is something no one can touch. he's an absolute genius. and all the cats on that album just blow me away.
as a drummer, questlove is my GURU!

Freeloader · #11 01-17-2005, 06:38 AM

found this on drummerworld.com

"Hip-hop is based in rhythm, repetition, and perfect time," says Thompson. "With Roots stuff, I go for a more perfect, quantized-type sound than I would with, say, Erykah or D'Angelo. For D'Angelo's Voodoo, we wanted to play as perfectly as we could, but then deliberately insert the little glitch that makes it sound messed up. The idea was to sound disciplined, but with a total human feel."

xolin · #12 01-17-2005, 09:51 AM

Thats why I want the chord sheets, I want to feel the music and jam with it. I dont want to copy the licks.

tightbidness · #13 01-17-2005, 12:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by xolin

Thats why I want the chord sheets, I want to feel the music and jam with it. I dont want to copy the licks.

There was a partial transcription of Chicken Grease in BassPlayer a while back. I'll see if I can dig it up when I get back home later this week. IIRC, the harmony on that song is somewhat ambiguous (common with D'Angelo), so Pino just played what he heard in his head.

gruuv · #14 01-17-2005, 12:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jokerjkny

listen, feel, and pray...

aint no one lays it down like Pino. ridiculously laid back pocket that never feels sluggish, and yet groovey. listen to his new track with Jill Scott, "Cant Explain". been keeping me up, just trying to apply that feel to other songs i'm working on.

Can I get an AMEN!!!

Pino is a bad, bad man. . .

Mojo-Man · #15 01-17-2005, 02:07 PM

That one CD, helped bring back flatwounds.
Pino-Kills

Freeloader · #16 01-18-2005, 11:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by xolin

Thats why I want the chord sheets, I want to feel the music and jam with it. I dont want to copy the licks.

my advice to you (if it counts) is to just sit and listen to the album and absorb as much of it as you can. no chord sheets will give you groove. you can't be bookish when approaching this kinda thing. its just about feel.

Starrchild · #17 01-18-2005, 01:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Freeloader

my advice to you (if it counts) is to just sit and listen to the album and absorb as much of it as you can. no chord sheets will give you groove. you can't be bookish when approaching this kinda thing. its just about feel.

+1

lach7 · #18 02-29-2008, 07:12 AM

Yes, Pino is tha ****! I use a 62 P-bass with flatwounds and the tone half down, gives a good Pino-esque sound.

has anyone got a transcription of Pino's playing on D'Angelo's
Playa Playa
Chicken Grease

I know there was a partial transcription in a Bass Player issue from 2000..but i haven't got it & can't find a copy either!

Just wanted to study what Pino has played & how it relates to the chart...and because it's Kool as Kats!!

Keep on

markjazzbassist · #19 02-29-2008, 11:34 AM

love that album, great stuff, pino is the man.

rochishin · #20 03-06-2008, 10:07 PM

For what it's worth Raphael Saadiq's playing on Untitled (How does it Feel) absolutely floors me. It's right up there with Jaco and Jamerson, imo.