first mix from new studio... advice plz

[djero44]

After taking about four years off from recording to focus on my musicianship I have just invested in a new core system and re-initiated the process. I'm excited to share my progress and talk with people about mixing and especially mastering, which i've never really done at all and need to learn about.

So here is my first track for the world: http://danielb.bandcamp.com/track/hour-hands


I will have more music up soon, so keep an ear out. Thanks for listening!

Daniel B.

[djero44]

Well, it can't be that bad! =)

The song is pretty live (for a solo multi-tracked piece, that is), there are very few edits on it; I played the tracks all the way through on each instrument while writing them until I got an fair take and went with it from there. It was a new approach for me to use the studio as a songwriting tool, I had some lyrics, a melody and a basic idea for the rhythm in my mind (two sections in 5, the other in 4...) but let it evolve as I worked through it. The drums are my weak spot, but although they are slightly laggy I actually like the feel and i'm happy to have got it to this place. I'm working quite hard at my drumming atm. The bass got minimal attention on this number, but I like it's simplicity for the song, and although the tone isn't exactly what i'd like i'm pretty pleased with it considering it was a single track di through my t-funk with basically no tweaking. I'm going to experiment with some cabinet miking and other ideas in the near future.

Anyhow, i'm doing some very different tracks now too, i'll throw them out here soon and see if I can rally some feedback.

[Joe Nerve]

Don't be too insulted by the lack of responses. It's real hard to get people's opinions here on stuff we create. Not sure why. I really wish talkbassers would be more supportive in this way. I've been doing my best to listen and give my honest opinion whenever it's asked for and I can these days.

Anyhow. I listened and I like it. Liked the rawness of it, the bass tone, and while it sounded nothing like jeff buckley something in it reminded me of him. Could be I just have Jeff Buckley on my mind lately for no good reason.

As fer constructive criticism, the only thing that jumped out at me was the need for another track. Either a keyboard pad type of thing possibly, or another guitar. It sounded sparse, like it was calling for something else. A little panning of the guitar and bass would give it a little more dimension also. Sounded like it was all panned center. Hope that helps.

[djero44]

That helps a lot! I wasn't insulted by no response, thus the smiley face I inserted there. I'm just trying to pry for some.

It is a sparse track, which I like, but it does sound slightly empty so i'll have to listen and see what else I could hear in there. I agree some organ or something could sit in there nicely.
I have no skills with keys, but I have some good friends who do. Once I get used to the process I am going to bring in a lot of local musicians for projects, for now i'm just messing around on my own.

Stereo imaging is one area I need to learn a lot. I have two mikes on the guitar cabinet which have different tones, and they are panned about 30 L and R, perhaps that doesn't create much of an effect. I am not sure if I panned the bass track (i'm out of state atm), you are probably right in hearing it center. I have stereo mics on the overheads which are panned too, but i'm still trying to get the balance down on the kit and learning a lot.

So this is why i'm fishing for hints, I appreciate yours. And I love Jeff Buckley, so any connection there faint or otherwise is a compliment.

[TimWilson]

Well, I'll jump in!

Just to flash my bona-fides, I'm an engineer/producer, too. You can hear my most recent releases at www.reverbnation.com/mowingbymoonlight and www.reverbnation.com/shakedownvirginia

This is all subjective, of course - one man's pleasure is another man's poison, no right/no wrongyadda yadda yadda... So take everyone's advice with a two-pound grain of salt.

The good: Your mix is clean as a whistle (not sure how clean a whistle really is, but it's how the saying goes). Very sweet, pure sound. And a good level balance, overall.

The less-good: compression, separation, and density. With so few instruments playing at such varying dynamic ranges, I'd have compressed the master a lot more to keep a more constant apparent level and keep more support under the vocal. And I'd have added more instruments for density. To me, the track feels too sparse for too long. I'd try some percussion loops: shakers, guiro's, etc., to fill the too-large gaps in the sonic field. Finally, it sounds too monophonic. If you do add some more instruments, split 'em out left & right 50% or so to more deeply 'immerse' the listener into the song.

Again, this is all just another guy's opinion, and the stuff I produce is generally louder and harder-hitting, so I could be wrong. But you asked for it (literally!).

Peace and Teddy Bears!

[djero44]

More good advice. See, I am fishing in the right pond! The track itself hasn't had any type of mastering approach yet, it is still kind of a rough mix. I have been racking my brain today trying to hear some other instrumentation in there to flesh it out a bit, but the guitar isn't coming to me, and I just had a little insight that percussion might fill some holes and, voila, I read your post with similar advice. Sweet!

Thing is, i'm really new at the finishing mixes thing. I actually have produced less than ten mixes in my short engineering career, so I really do want as much advice as possible. I am excited to get back to my studio in the next couple of days and play around with some of these ideas.

There are very few plug-ins on the track, which is an approach I like but don't use exclusively at all; over the years I have finally got a grip on compression and it's place but haven't really applied it to the recording/mixing process yet. There are a couple of spots this song drops out too much to my ears as well, namely between what would be the verses and the pre-chorus. I toyed around with the idea of shortening that area in the arrangement, but in my mind it sounds right at the length that is there. That is one part I would like to up the guitar a bit to keep it together. And the leads are pretty weak, too.... kind of nice for an ambient thing but I think over those instrumental sections it needs more.

So generally you guys are pointing out things that I have considered, with the exception of the stereo/monophonic sound advice, which is something i'm taking to heart and eager to experiment with. I'll see if I can work a little voodoo on this song and see what happens. Update to come! Thanks, as always, for the input.

By the way I want to return the favor of listening, so I checked out Joe's video link earlier (love it!) and i'd like to hear yours as well, Tim. At the moment i'm at a coffee house with no headphones, alas. But I will!

[flypejose]

Nice take given that you arranged and played all tracks on the fly! That basically how we learn the craft.

My impression is that you were able to make the song convey a consistent overall mood. However, execution-wise, maybe the accents (usually at unison passages, etc.) should be a bit more pronounced! My ears want to hear much more guitar too!

Also, since on one hand, the different parts are played with a greater degree of variation from section to section, and on the other hand the compression is lacking a bit, the listener have the impression to listen to a “live at a small club” type of sound.
(Opinion of an amateur)

[TimWilson]

Alway glad to offer what I can to a bass brotha! And hey, recording/mixing over the net is fun, too! If you wanna try tossing your mixes to others around here to remix/remaster/add to, I've found that to be really educational, too!

Looking forward to hearing what you think of my work, too.

[djero44]

I believe the format I posted that in is open to downloads for remixing and whatnot. That would be awesome if people were interested. I have a producer friend in Cali who has tweaked this particular track a bit, and another song I sent him made him want to come record with me. That was awesome!

I really like the idea of collaborating with other musicians and engineers via the web. There are so many talented people and a lot of cool project studios nowadays too. Unfortunately I picked my DAW to work with a friend in town (Presonus's Studio One) and I doubt many folks are using that, though so far I love it. But there is probably a good way to put some individual .wav files out there for people to mess with.

Basically i'm very excited about the whole process. Years ago when I started it was all too overwhelming, and though i'm still pushing myself hard I feel like I can get to a certain point with some more work to be able to make some functional mixes and learn some basic mastering skills. I can't wait.

flypejose -thanks for the input. Everyone seems to agree there needs to be more guitar presence in the track. Honestly when I thought it up it was supposed to be a lot more driving and groovy, rather than the laid back feel it conveys at the moment. That happens to me a lot, I have a hard time injecting my recordings with the kind of oomph I would like, but that is something to work towards. Also, I like the small club comment, that is one thing I thought too, it is fairly live sounding, which is good considering it is just me. That also is hard for me to do with the multitracking, and is why I didn't spend too much time redoing parts, I have a tendency to overthink stuff. Plus I was just writing them, as you noted. I will go back and tweak the guitar lines a bit, though. One of the big challenges for me is just coming up with parts. If it doesn't just come, I have to work with it a lot, and I play a lot more bass nowadays than guitar. That may even out a bit in the coming months, which could be good. My chord theory and execution is not what I would like it to be, so there is another area to work on..... phew!

Tim-- I checked out What I Could Be and Crimson Sins from the Shakedown project. Heck yes! It made me nostalgic in very good ways of some of my favorite rock bands. Unfortunately my laptop speakers didn't do the bass justice, but the overall mix is professional sounding; rich, full and quite clear. I get what you are saying with the stereo immersion, there is a lot of depth with the way it is tracked. I don't have much constructive criticism, from what I hear it seems like you pretty much nailed what you were going for here, and it sounds very good. I particularly like Crimson Sins and the cymbal work in it. Were those cymbal flams done with sticks? It kind of sounds like these metal comb-like things i've seen a drummer use recently and was fascinated with. So you tracked these songs all over the place and then took them home and mixed them? That is quite cool. The Ace Frehley project is awesome too. I'm impressed, and inspired. I played metal and rock for a long time (though it's been a long time), lately I have been wanting to do a high energy project, I know this insanely talented young drummer in town who would just kill it. I might even know the vocalist for the job. Hmm...

[TimWilson]

Thanks! I'm very glad and very flattered that you hear those drums as being natural/played, but in fact, I programmed all the drums on that project myself using DoggieBox®. Though the band did have a very good drummer, for the CD, I chose to start off with my own programmed drums, with the intention of replacing my parts later (with the real drummer's tracks). Unfortunately, the band dissolved before that happened...

Thanks again. and good luck with your future projects. For what it's worth, I find that it matters little what a producer uses in the way of our individual programs of choice (personally, I use Apple's Logic Pro®) In the end, as long as it sounds good...