Problems (and what is going right) in the recording studios today

[darknes40]

Hey you guys, next year I am going to be headed to school for music production and it got me thinking, so many musicians (many on this thread ) complain about what is being done "wrong" in the studio these days, ie. Over compression, too much bass frequency cut, too much over all volume etc.

I figured hey if I'm going to be getting into this field, maybe it's time to help push future recording back into a state we as musicians can be proud of, back to the high level of quality production found in many old albums like those of Zeppelin, Floyd and many others.

So what do you guys think the problems are facing modern recordings, what can be done better? And not only that what is being done RIGHT, cause honestly if it ain't broke don't fix it right?

[darknes40]

Bump

[darknes40]

Haha nothing guys?

[MysticMichael]

Originally Posted by darknes40

Hey you guys, next year I am going to be headed to school for music production and it got me thinking, so many musicians (many on this thread ) complain about what is being done "wrong" in the studio these days, ie. Over compression, too much bass frequency cut, too much over all volume etc.

In general, too much of a reliance on technology as a quick fix for a performance problem, i.e. "Don't worry. We'll fix it in the mix."

That includes way too much use of autotune...as a substitute for good singing. And ultra-clean digital mixes that have "every hair in place" - instead of leaving a bit of imperfection here and there...in order to humanize the mix and give it more of an organic sensibility...

Broadly speaking, the problem is simply over-reliance on a good thing - in an industry where form too easily overpowers function. Not unlike Hollywood movies that try to get by on CGI special effects...instead of developing a really good script...

MM

[Jay2U]

Originally Posted by MysticMichael

...And ultra-clean digital mixes that have "every hair in place" - instead of leaving a bit of imperfection here and there...in order to humanize the mix and give it more of an organic sensibility...

+1 Everything is under (digital) control nowadays. Every note is being washed, cleaned and dried before it is put on cd. In the seventies every studio had it's own tricks, gizmos and devices. They created a good sounding production, not a bunch of perfect bits and bytes.

[dlenaghan]

Originally Posted by MysticMichael

In general, too much of a reliance on technology as a quick fix for a performance problem, i.e. "Don't worry. We'll fix it in the mix."

That includes way too much use of autotune...as a substitute for good singing. And ultra-clean digital mixes that have "every hair in place" - instead of leaving a bit of imperfection here and there...in order to humanize the mix and give it more of an organic sensibility...

Broadly speaking, the problem is simply over-reliance on a good thing - in an industry where form too easily overpowers function. Not unlike Hollywood movies that try to get by on CGI special effects...instead of developing a really good script...

MM

Yes, yes, YES. +100

Too clean, it'll sound inhuman. Even electronic music relies on the fundamental reality of harmonic structures to give deal depth and texture to sound, so even if it's made by a computer the very act of playing it evokes overtones, whether they are real or imagined.

A band/musician/composer/performer should be able to play something all the way through, though I do appreciate the juxtaposition of a good studio album vs a stripped down live performance, though that's more of an orchestration thing than a technology-crutch issue.

Make everything that clean, it's no wonder things can sound generic. Those little imperfections pile up and are the essence of a performer's individual CHARACTER. And I do think lots of that is in the production, not necessarily just songwriting or other more subjective things.

Music demands space, but too many people think space exists to be filled. Nature may abhor a vacuum, but that's where your imagination gets to play when you hear a track that really captures you.

[hernameisrio]

I work at a studio as an assistant engineer and I also apprentice with an audio technician for several studios throughout NYC/NJ doing wiring, minor repairs, tape machine calibration, and so on. So I've kinda seen it from all sides, in a way. I don't even know where to start on this topic. I'm basically posting this to remind myself to gather my thoughts and post in greater detail later!

I'm totally exhausted so I'm just skimming, but here's something that popped into my head right away though, and it's from the perspective of someone who is just starting to bring sessions to the studio as an assistant-turned-engineer. It was a long climb and it's far from over, nor do I aspire to make engineering my living, but it's interesting stuff regardless, and it beats a desk job. :-P I know you're more in the production vein of things, OP, but maybe others on here can relate.

Anyway. If you are hoping to intern at a studio and work your way up to being an engineer, be sure that you're aware of your limits as far as your knowledge and experience. I'm generally pretty humble and if anything, I tend to think less of my abilities than others on occasion, but even I've had some rough spots where I've come off as knowing more than I do. It's not because I'm full of myself, but because I didn't realize I was wrong and didn't think to ask questions...I got caught up in doing things my way because in my eyes, if it gets done, what's the problem? However, there have been many times where it's screwed me to think this way; I've gotten yelled at and made mistakes, and it sucks.

In other words, you should never assume that the way you learned how to do something, is the way someone else wants it done...when it comes to studios, as much as there is sort of a "system" of doing things, especially nowadays, it's always gonna be a bit different depending on where you're working and who you're working for. Even down to simple things like wrapping cables, recall sheets, cleaning the patchbay, etc. Unfortunately, not everyone you work for is going to understand that if you just arbitrarily tell someone to patch something or clean something or whatever, you might get a few variations as to how it's done...it's awkward to deal with this, and if you work for good people, it'll be easier.

But more importantly, I think a potential problem in studios nowadays, is people coming out of audio or audio engineering schools knowing all the Pro Tools shortcuts, and thinking that they are entitled to the hot seat right away. Furthermore, a lot of these audio schools are preparing students for jobs that are, sadly, dying out...and finally, they are flooding the market...too many wanna-be engineers and not enough studios to go around. I'm not trying to sound cynical and I think it's great that you're pursuing a formal education with this stuff...it beats reading about it all day on the Internet and then thinking you're an expert, which seems to be the way people educate themselves these days...

As far as what's going RIGHT in regards to protocol/hierarchy within the studios, I am glad that there are studios around who still play fair ball when it comes to internships and don't just exploit people. They are hard to find, but they do exist. Also, I think it's great that people are into analog/vintage gear. There's definitely a certain generation who had their share of tape and then were happy to have Pro Tools come along, but as someone who hardly gets a chance to work with tape apart from aligning the machines, I really enjoy it. Finally, I was talking to one of my engineer friends at the studio last night and he pointed out that one of the best things about digital technology is to be able to use it as a means to completely, accurately capture your analog experience. In other words, if you track to tape and you come back to that tape in a few years, it's gonna sound different because over time, you'll lose the sort of "color" of that tape, if that makes sense. However, if you track to tape and then print it back to Pro Tools, as long as you stay on top of all their upgrades and any potential changes in their file management system, you'll be able to open that session in a few years and hear it exactly as it was when you first recorded it. He said it better than me, I'm just paraphrasing, but it was sort of a paradigm shift for me because I used to be like, "**** digital! blah blah blah" and now I'm realizing that it does have its advantages.

Not to mention, it's important to adapt well to all the changes in this business. Anyway, I could/should write a novel....that's all I can come up with right now...by the way, if anyone in New York City is interested in checking out the studio I work at, you can have a look at the website at http://pyramidrecording.tv.

[darknes40]

Originally Posted by hernameisrio

I work at a studio as an assistant engineer and I also apprentice with an audio technician for several studios throughout NYC/NJ doing wiring, minor repairs, tape machine calibration, and so on. So I've kinda seen it from all sides, in a way. I don't even know where to start on this topic. I'm basically posting this to remind myself to gather my thoughts and post in greater detail later!

I'm totally exhausted so I'm just skimming, but here's something that popped into my head right away though, and it's from the perspective of someone who is just starting to bring sessions to the studio as an assistant-turned-engineer. It was a long climb and it's far from over, nor do I aspire to make engineering my living, but it's interesting stuff regardless, and it beats a desk job. :-P I know you're more in the production vein of things, OP, but maybe others on here can relate.

Anyway. If you are hoping to intern at a studio and work your way up to being an engineer, be sure that you're aware of your limits as far as your knowledge and experience. I'm generally pretty humble and if anything, I tend to think less of my abilities than others on occasion, but even I've had some rough spots where I've come off as knowing more than I do. It's not because I'm full of myself, but because I didn't realize I was wrong and didn't think to ask questions...I got caught up in doing things my way because in my eyes, if it gets done, what's the problem? However, there have been many times where it's screwed me to think this way; I've gotten yelled at and made mistakes, and it sucks.

In other words, you should never assume that the way you learned how to do something, is the way someone else wants it done...when it comes to studios, as much as there is sort of a "system" of doing things, especially nowadays, it's always gonna be a bit different depending on where you're working and who you're working for. Even down to simple things like wrapping cables, recall sheets, cleaning the patchbay, etc. Unfortunately, not everyone you work for is going to understand that if you just arbitrarily tell someone to patch something or clean something or whatever, you might get a few variations as to how it's done...it's awkward to deal with this, and if you work for good people, it'll be easier.

But more importantly, I think a potential problem in studios nowadays, is people coming out of audio or audio engineering schools knowing all the Pro Tools shortcuts, and thinking that they are entitled to the hot seat right away. Furthermore, a lot of these audio schools are preparing students for jobs that are, sadly, dying out...and finally, they are flooding the market...too many wanna-be engineers and not enough studios to go around. I'm not trying to sound cynical and I think it's great that you're pursuing a formal education with this stuff...it beats reading about it all day on the Internet and then thinking you're an expert, which seems to be the way people educate themselves these days...

As far as what's going RIGHT in regards to protocol/hierarchy within the studios, I am glad that there are studios around who still play fair ball when it comes to internships and don't just exploit people. They are hard to find, but they do exist. Also, I think it's great that people are into analog/vintage gear. There's definitely a certain generation who had their share of tape and then were happy to have Pro Tools come along, but as someone who hardly gets a chance to work with tape apart from aligning the machines, I really enjoy it. Finally, I was talking to one of my engineer friends at the studio last night and he pointed out that one of the best things about digital technology is to be able to use it as a means to completely, accurately capture your analog experience. In other words, if you track to tape and you come back to that tape in a few years, it's gonna sound different because over time, you'll lose the sort of "color" of that tape, if that makes sense. However, if you track to tape and then print it back to Pro Tools, as long as you stay on top of all their upgrades and any potential changes in their file management system, you'll be able to open that session in a few years and hear it exactly as it was when you first recorded it. He said it better than me, I'm just paraphrasing, but it was sort of a paradigm shift for me because I used to be like, "**** digital! blah blah blah" and now I'm realizing that it does have its advantages.

Not to mention, it's important to adapt well to all the changes in this business. Anyway, I could/should write a novel....that's all I can come up with right now...by the way, if anyone in New York City is interested in checking out the studio I work at, you can have a look at the website at http://pyramidrecording.tv.

Amazing post, and trust me I would love getting into the engineering,

[darknes40]

Also if I'm ever in new York expect a pm

[ksandvik]

Too much focus on technology instead of capturing an original performance.

[hernameisrio]

"Too much focus on technology instead of capturing an original performance."

Yes! I can attest to this, having spent hours meticulously aligning drums to the freakin grid (come onnnnn!), PUNCHING IN on the third movement of "Moonlight Sonata" (blasphemy!), pitch-correcting 3 out of every 5 notes in a vocal melody, way too much Pro Tools chop-shop to make it "perfect" instead of just either playing the darn thing again or letting the tiny mistakes [that most people won't notice] slide. There is this P.I.L. album that I love, it's "Album" if anyone's interested. Anyway, during "Ease," somebody coughed. At least that's what it sounds like to me. Every time I hear it, I smile because to me, it's cool to hear those little nuances. I also hear bad punches all the time in older albums...it reminds me that people are human. But nowadays, you can just cross-fade into oblivion and get all persnickety about everything. Argh. Then you have the people get obsessed with plug-ins or effects and end up burying their own performance. As someone who's been on both sides of the glass (and UNDER the console/squished behind the Studer/trying to solder an XLR panel in terrible lighting while lying on the floor of the live room), I've seen sessions really go downhill when the band (or the engineer, for that matter) gets hung up on fancy effects or the convenience of editing. I mean, if I'm sitting in front of Pro Tools for an extra two hours, at least the studio is making extra money, but it really kills the vibe of the session fast.

[JdoubleH]

+2^64 on autotune and over-massaging everything. But fixing it "in the mix" dates to the earliest days of mult-tracking. We've just got more tools that can do way more, and yield a final mix that is still listenable. To me it just means the original recording can be tortured that much more before you destroy it. And with the undo feature, multiple revisions, etc, that never really has to happen.

In the days of analog, it was much more apparent when the recording had been produced to death. It was pretty easy to over cook the processing and post production and end up with a bunch of wasted tape. There were a number of naturally limiting factors along with tape and studio time costs which prevented most of us from going overboard too often. Before starting a project, you had to have a good idea of what you wanted to accomplish and how you wanted it to sound. Your tracks and arrangements were likely known ahead of time and you had a solid plan to make the best use of the studio time and tape. Talent, skill and a good set of ears were critical. You also had to have a keen understanding of your mics and how to place them and your sources to get a good take. You had to know how to structure gain and when to EQ. You had to do all of this BEFORE you started rolling tape, or you were just wasting time and money. Mixing and mastering were done on material that was already pretty solid. Pitch correcting or punching in corrections were done on only the most glaring of mistakes.

I don't know that we're worse off with all the awesome capabilities modern digital gives us, but there certainly pitfalls with every paradigm shift. It seems what is needed today alongside the skill, talent and ears is a good sense of judgement, restraint and discipline. The fundamentals of a good first take still apply.

IME, IMHO of course!

[MysticMichael]

Originally Posted by JdoubleH

Before starting a project, you had to have a good idea of what you wanted to accomplish and how you wanted it to sound. Your tracks and arrangements were likely known ahead of time and you had a solid plan to make the best use of the studio time and tape. Talent, skill and a good set of ears were critical. You also had to have a keen understanding of your mics and how to place them and your sources to get a good take. You had to know how to structure gain and when to EQ. You had to do all of this BEFORE you started rolling tape, or you were just wasting time and money.

Every single one of those preparations should still be done today. Not just to save time and money, but to ensure the best possible musical outcome from the session. But just try telling that to the newbies and kids - who've never known anything other than ADAT and hard-disk media...

Originally Posted by JdoubleH

I don't know that we're worse off with all the awesome capabilities modern digital gives us, but there certainly pitfalls with every paradigm shift. It seems what is needed today alongside the skill, talent and ears is a good sense of judgment, restraint and discipline. The fundamentals of a good first take still apply.

Absolutely agreed. Instead of trying to see how little work he can get away with, a real professional will leverage the technology to see how much more he can accomplish with it...

MM