Recording fees... how does that work?

[manutabora]

Mods, please move this to the appropriate forum if necessary.

Hi Y'all,
I have recently been contacted by a couple of cats who want me to go record bass parts for them. One of them is a keyboard player/songwriter. The other is a sax player and I think he sings too. Basically, they don't have a band. From what I understand, they just bring in other players when they need to record or do shows. They have two cd's already, and they do sort of a mixture of latin jazz, pop, etc.
Anyway, here's the thing. I'm a college student and I have no previous experience recording. When we talked over the phone the guy said this would be a paid gig (some people try to get college kids to play for free ) and that they would pay me to record and to play at their shows. He did not specify how much I would be paid. I imagine we will discuss that and make some sort of agreement. However, I have no idea what other people charge for this kind of thing. I don't want to play for too cheap, but I don't want to ask for so much that they won't want to hire me either.
What can you guys suggest? Is there any sort of standardized fee for recording? Any advice will be greatly appreciated! Thanks!

[manutabora]

Bump
Really, I'm pretty clueless here.

[Kobaia]

i know some people who charge what they do for lessons. their rate is just $50 an hour doesn't matter if its lessons, a gig or recording. more well known people for $100 and hour. I've heard rumors of Michael Brecker charging $500.

[VroomVroom]

Lots of variables here. Are you being asked to play parts that have already been written, or are you contributing to the writing/arranging process? Are there actual live gigs that have been booked, or is this more of a gentleman's agreement?

Go with your comfort level here, and also determine what's valuable to you. Gaining experience playing in the studio, along with copies of the music that you can use to add to your resume may well be worth more than a set dollar number.

So, my advice, for whatever it might be worth, is to ask a bunch of questions - of these cats as well as yourself - and look for the common denominators. I can tell you that I keep my rates variable on these types of calls - generally overcharging if I'm not comfortable, yet happily undercharging to work with people I really like and respect. Good luck...

[The Wrench]

Hold on a sec... People get paid? To play bass?

[manutabora]

Well, they didn't tell me if they already had bass parts or they just want me to make something up. I guess I'll find out.
Thanks for your advice guys.

[JohnDavisNYC]

how good are you?

how much do you like the music?

how big is the artist's budget?

there are lots of variables in deciding how much money to ask for... assuming that you are a solid, proficient player, and that the client will be getting their money's worth, the big variables are: how much of a pain in the ass it will be to get to and from the sessions, how much you like the music/people, and how big a budget they have.

if you hate the music, charge more! if the people are really cool and you dig the music, but know they don't have much money, give them a 'bro deal'... if you are ambivalent to the material, just charge whatever you feel like you need to make to spend a day in the studio.

for example, if i really like someone's music, and i know they don't have much money, sometimes i'll just play on sessions for meals and drinks afterwards...

but, most of the time, i'll do something like $100/song or $500 a day, whichever is less... single song, $200... but it's pretty loose. i'm not in the 'session' scene, so i'm not up on union rates these days and stuff, but that is sort of my starting point when people ask me to play on records... if i have to bring like 4 electrics and my upright, the price goes up, and i need cartage money.

it's all about having some sense of the baseline value of your time, and then scaling from there based on variables.

john

[Intune]

Read John's post twice.











Then read it again.

[Oraflora]

I agree with John D.

They asked you to play for them.
That's a good sign that they desire your playing over someone else's, and that is worth something to them.

Your time should be worth something to you, but YOU need to know what you would like to make for your time.

If you play gigs are paid $100 a night, you are performing, setting up, loading in and out - maybe 5 hours total time, you are making approximately $20/hour.

If you sit in a studio for 8 to 10 hours tracking multiple songs, you should make the same or more than you could somewhere else (part time job, gigging, etc.)

I'd say a minimum of $200 a day, probably more if the musicians are making a decent living from playing/selling their music.

As far as performing with them - you are kind of at the mercy of what the gig pays the band. One band I play with, we split the cover charge, often with two other bands, so each band makes between $50 and $400 for playing an hour long set. With 5 guys in the band, it's not great money.

A second band I play with that plays blues in clubs, 3 sets a night, no other band, usually plays for a set rate, and the band leader (who hires the drummer and myself) pays us a set rate each night, sometimes less for an in-town, weeknight gig that doesn't pay him very well.

The first band plays original music, one set only, and maybe once a month. (Getting paid for this is not a priority, playing original music is).

The second band plays originals and covers, and plays 2 to 3 nights a week. (Money is important here, I consider it my part-time job, but it's a really fun part-time job).

Bottom line is: It's up to you, just don't cut yourself short.

[themarshall]

(Coping best elder-statesman vibe) Well, son, if your serious about this music thing, than you have to learn to talk business...

A great piece of advice I read is to steer the talk toward pay while you're "looking for your date book to see if your available". That way, if the money isn't what it should be, you can claim scheduling conflicts. If possible, contact other players these guys have or are using and see it they can shed some light $-wise. In your situation, it seems as if you should do it even if the pay is low as long as it doesn't limit your ability to raise your rate in the future.

[manutabora]

Ok, that's making more sense to me now. I'm sure it will all work out just fine. From the times we've been on the phone, they seem like cool doods, not the kind that's out to take advantage of someone else. They've also been doing this for a while, so they know what's going on.
The reason why they contacted me is because someone mentioned me when they asked about a bass player in the specific style that they want to do (latin jazz). The funny thing is, they person who referred them to me has never even heard me play He and I have only talked a couple of times. But the guys who contacted me said that person said I was a really good latin jazz player Maybe he thinks latino=good latin jazz player??
Anyway, it's all good. Thanks for your valuable advice. I'll keep checking on this thread for more pearls of wisdom