Way back in time to when metal was okay...

[bassybill]

Here's a track purely for nostalgia purposes, going back to a time when metal was actually good.

http://www.billygreen.pwp.blueyonder...s%20Priest.mp3

Some of this is really quite musical. I thought a few folks might like to hear some metal from the 70s when it had a very different flavour to today's offerings.

[stuonbass]

+1 to Classic Metal!

[bassybill]

That whole album is absolutely classic. I saw JP about that time and it still stands out in my mind as one of the best gigs I've ever been to.

I saw them again a couple of years later and they had become a product of the genre and lost a lot of the things that made the "Sad Wings of Destiny" stuff so great.

[Geezerman]

Originally Posted by bassybill

Here's a track purely for nostalgia purposes, going back to a time when metal was actually good.

http://www.billygreen.pwp.blueyonder...s%20Priest.mp3

Some of this is really quite musical. I thought a few folks might like to hear some metal from the 70s when it had a very different flavour to today's offerings.

You'll find a lot of newer metal to be more technical, it's just the progression

[Deluge Of Sound]

Judas Priest sucks.

[Fli]

Originally Posted by Deluge Of Sound

Judas Priest sucks.

Whether you like them or not, Black Sabbath and Judas Priest were not only the pioneers of metal, they invented it.

[Deluge Of Sound]

Judas Priest invented metal? That's a new one for me, I was under the impression it was Sabbath, Zep, Blue Cheer, and Pink Floyd (by virtue of The Nile Song)

[MAJOR METAL]

Bill = METAL.

[bassybill]

Originally Posted by MAJOR METAL

Bill = METAL.

New sig!

[Fli]

Originally Posted by Deluge Of Sound

Judas Priest invented metal? That's a new one for me, I was under the impression it was Sabbath, Zep, Blue Cheer, and Pink Floyd (by virtue of The Nile Song)

I'm sure the line between early hard rock and metal has been debated to death...

I probably shouldn't have used the word 'invent', but to me, Black Sabbath and Judas Priest were the first real metal bands. Zeppelin, Blue Cheer, Deep Purple all = rock n roll.

& Pink Floyd? ...Are you serious?

[bassybill]

I don't know about elsewhere, but I come from the same town as Black Sabbath (I used to be in a band with singer Tony Martin before he joined Sabbath). Judas Priest are also a Birmingham band and I can tell you with certainty that around here, in the very birthplace of British metal, both bands are considered to be formative influences on the genre.

As for whether Judas Priest "sucks" or not, I think I'd probably agree that most of the later stuff does, to be honest. They became quite a stereotypical example of what NWOBHM was all about and I really disliked this period. I think any band that ties itself too closely to a particular genre - especially a fashionable and overhyped one - risks losing anything that makes them thoughtful or original. And that was certainly the case, I think, with JP at that time.

But earlier stuff (like the Sad Wings of Destiny album, from which the track that I linked is taken) shows that they were a very creative, polished and musical example of what heavy metal could be like. IMO etc etc etc

[Baryonyx]

Just goes to show that metal is definitely not okay these days!

[smogg]

what is song like 30 yrs old? still love it, man i'm gettin' old...lol

[metalbass777]

UP THE IRONS!!!!!

[MAJOR METAL]

Originally Posted by bassybill

New sig!

[DoomandHeavy]

If you guys like classic sounding bands you should check out Saint Vitus, Brocas Helm, Pentagram, Saxon, Cirith Ungol, and Manowar! KEEP IT HEAVY, AND KEEP IT TRUE

[Mutato]

Originally Posted by Deluge Of Sound

Judas Priest invented metal? That's a new one for me, I was under the impression it was Sabbath, Zep, Blue Cheer, and Pink Floyd (by virtue of The Nile Song)

Good call on Blue Cheer. Don't forget BOC.

[f'nar f'nar]

I don't think metal has gotten any better or worse over the years, it has just changes. I like the song Bill posted and I like modern tech-metal but for different reasons. Oldschool metal is good because it's softer and the musicality focused more on music and riffs being catchy whereas modern metal is more about difficult riffs and musical technicality which is impressive to listen to in its own right.
Everyone said that guitarists like Slash where pioneers of metal lead guitar breaks and this is true because what he was doing back in the days had seldom been heard before, it was new and fresh. But now every man and his dog with any knowlege of guitar can learn slash solo's quite quickly. Whereas you look at modern metal guitarists suck as Muhammed Schummer (from Necrophagist) who IMO push the envelope of guitar playing what they are doing is new and fresh just like the guitarists of old.

If you understand any of what I just said then fantastic!

Just my 2c!

[bassybill]

Yeah, fans of newer metal shouldn't take what I said in the opening post TOO seriously - hence the smiley.

There are some good metal and rock bands around today, I know. People have posted some stuff over the last few days in this forum that meets that description. But as I hinted above, any band that gets overly concerned with issues of "genre" or "image" can end up with the music becoming very sterotypical, unimaginative and frankly they can very often become a parody of themselves - awesome to their devoted admirers and capable of no wrong, but incomprehensible or just plain silly to everyone else.

I do think a lot (but not all) of the metal around now has fallen down this slippery slope. It can happen in any genre, but metal seems to suffer worse than most in this respect. YMMV etc etc.

This kind of stuff gets really boring. 'When metal used to be good.'

Spare me.

That’s like saying, ‘When jazz used to be good.’

I don’t enjoy much Ornette Coleman, but I’m not going to say he’s crap. I have enough respect for him and what he means to the development of music in general to refrain from that.

I think that a lot of people like to bust on contemporary metal because they believe that contemporary metal fans or musicians don’t have the intellectual ability to defend their art. Well that might be true in some cases, but not all.

Black Sabbath is the first real metal band. And there wouldn’t have been a Black Sabbath without Muddy Waters. And there wouldn’t have been a Slayer or Anthrax or Metallica without Black Sabbath, and yada yada yada yada . . . Everything is derivative of something else in this world to an extent. The interesting thing is to make the connections and learn, as in all art history. Unfortunately, lots of people, especially metal heads, like to get into these discussions and turn them into meaningless debates about who is the ‘real’ this or that. Qui bono?

Of course, I’m not arguing that there should be no standards. Standards are necessary; otherwise everything would be crap. Every person has the right to say ‘This is good, and this isn’t good.’ I’m certainly not a fan of useless relativism. But I’m also not a fan of superficial opinions.

If you don’t like today’s metal, don’t listen to it. It’s that simple. I don’t like pop country, so I don’t listen to it. There is no accounting for taste. There are informed opinions, and there are statements of personal preference. There is often a stark contrast between the two.

I like old school metal. To me, Sad Wings of Destiny is a masterpiece. I also think that a few Opeth albums are masterpieces, but I’m not going to waste my time rating one band against another. I understand the historical significance that Judas Priest has in relation to Opeth, which to me is far more important in that such understanding helps me learn about music and become a better musician. If I want to sit around all day in Starbucks and argue about what is ‘real’ or ‘ok,’ I can do that too, although I choose not to.

BTW – nothing annoys me more than extreme or death/black metal musicians-fans who accuse every other metal genre of being false. To me, these people are cretins. I was at a show a few months ago where a band Eluvietie was an opener. They were multifaceted, and had a woman playing hurdy gurdy, a guy on tin whistle, and a violin. They were still heavy as hell and really sounded great, but nonetheless, a few feet away from me some jerk was loudly cursing them between songs and calling for ‘real death metal.’ I withstood about five minutes of this before I walked over and told him to shut his trap and have some respect.