bold and ugly amplification

[christoph h.]

Hi Justin!

In my "dirt sound thread" you suggested that I look into a different setup than the Markbass LMII and the 4x10.

I already own an 2x12 cab so I will definitely try that. But you also mentioned 15 inch speakers - would you ADD one of those to the 4x10 (or 2x12) setup? Or did you mean to use one exclusively? (I have to admit, I played through an Ashdown 1x15 combo one time and it was the worst thing I ever heard.)

Regarding amps:

You mentioned Aguilar and I have been eyeing the AG500SC for a long time. But I have a feeling that that's not what you meant. I guess you were thinking about their tube amps - or is the AG500SC "bold and ugly enough"?

Also, in general does "bigger equal better"?

I know you like the MESA 400+, but it's very big and heavy, as are the Aguilar DB 751 and most Ampeg SVTs.

What about using just a preamp into a poweramp (I still have an older QSC)? Any "bold and ugly" preamps you would recommend? Or does it have to be an "full tube" setup, including the power amp?

I guess to make a long story short, is there a "bold and ugly" setup that's still at least a little bit portable? The 8x10 + 4x12 + Mesa 400+ or DB751 setup is probably perfect but it's also a logistic nightmare without roadies.

Thanks again for your time!

-Christoph

[thombo]

hi chris, i had been following the other thread and thought i would chime in... imho, you may want to consider some cabs instead of heads, particularly cabs w/out tweeters, or at least something less hifi.

looking at your profile, it looks like you have some sweet gear that is suited for a sterile, hi-fidelity sound. it has been my experience that hifi gear (accugroove, acme, ea, etc) doesn't really lend itself well to overdriven/distorded bass sounds. it is made for full frequency, tweeter driving slap stuff, which typically sounds bad/harsh when you introduce drive.

[Marton]

The Aguilar GS212 that I recently got seems to be really between the hi-fi and the dirty old school tones. I love it with my Traynor tube amp.

[christoph h.]

Originally Posted by thombo

hi chris, i had been following the other thread and thought i would chime in... imho, you may want to consider some cabs instead of heads, particularly cabs w/out tweeters, or at least something less hifi.

Hi! I thought I'd open up this thread to make it a bit more general.

I'm definitely interested in cabinets, too. But in my experience, the Accugroove cabs don't sound that "Hi-Fi". When using effects, especially distortion I usually turn down the tweeter to 0-10%. I've never experienced harshness that way!

[christoph h.]

looking at your profile, it looks like you have some sweet gear that is suited for a sterile, hi-fidelity sound.

Yeah, it's funny, when I was younger I went for a totally different sound - not sterile, though . But as I said, at least the Accugroove cabinets are pretty versatile if you keep the tweeter in check. But of course I'm still interested to hear about any 15 inch speakers or so, just focussing on amps because I think that part of my gear might make the biggest difference.

I have never slapped much, BTW.

[jmjbassplayer]

I dunno about Accugrove, sounds suspiciously modern to me.

You need an old 2 x 15 or 8 x 10 or 4 x 12 cab, man. Seriously. And a brutish, ugly head like GK, Acoustic, Ampeg, Sunn, Traynor, Mesa, Marshall, etc. etc. Solid state even. A rig with some "klang" and some "honk" to it.

Something with some power, but it doesn't need to be insane. Just start trying some stuff out.

[casio]

If I can give my 2c:
Logistics are a funny thing. If you're chasing tone, that's your main priority IMHO. If not, you make due with what you have.
Try combining stuff. I do a lot of versatile stuff, since Croatia isn't the largest market, so I need stuff that eorks across the board.
What I found was that head/cab combinations work. Not meaning companies, but size.
I have a mesa mpulse 600, mesa 2x10 and 1x15. Depending on the gig size and what's needed, I combine.
Mostly all three, but sometimes just the 1x15 or just the 2x10. Tweeter off full time.
If you're into combining stuff, I would even recommend using one small cab and head for clean, and a small guitar head. I use a JMP into my 2x10 sometimes for the dirt, and the 1x15 plus bass head for clean. And to finish off - all of this, along with 2 basses, fits nicely in my little Toyota Auris, along with more band/recording equipment and an extra person to ride shotgun. So it's all a matter of sorting out what you want for yourself!
Sorry for the long post!

[Peter_00]

+1 on an ugly solid-state head. This might sound crazy but... PEAVEY!

I have played through some that sound RUDE on their own, but are awesome in the mix.

[christoph h.]

Ok, I get the message.

I guess the idea of spending lots of money and carrying heavy objects around isn't the most attractive thing.

The Mesa stuff looks very interesting, I like what I've heard about the 400+. Unfortunately there's not a big market of vintage stuff here, so it will be hard to find some stuff. What about the newer MESAs? Casio mentioned the mpulse 600 - that one looks pretty cool!

The Ashdown ABM500 seems to be nice, too...

Time to do some research, maybe I can borrow some stuff from my friends to try out...

[christoph h.]

One more - specific - question to Justin:

What do you think about the Aguilar AG500SC for my situation? It's an amp I've played a lot and always loved the sound of. Unfortunately I couldn't afford it when I had to buy a new amp. But I've never used it for heavy music . I know that it doesn't get "dirty" on it's own, but maybe that isn't neccessary?

Other than that I'm leaning towards a Mesa amp currently, something like the M6 for example.

Or is all of that still not extreme enough? Sorry for all the words, I just never spent any time on "bold and ugly amps" and all the (expensive) options are confusing me.

[jmjbassplayer]

AG500SC would sound great. It nice and "fast" sounding, so it'll be cool. Mesa M6 is amazing, simple and loud.

But I have to also big up what Peter said...why didn't I think of that: PEAVEY!!! An old Mark IV or whatever head and a 2 x 15 cab? That will cut through anything with ugliness!

Gotta say guys: those '70's and '80's amps have character: Peavey, GK, Carvin, Acoustic, Sunn, Traynor, etc.

Basically, you need harmonically rich midrange. Enuf said.

Time for you to start trying stuff. And/or posting in the Amps forum if you wanna get more answers than I can provide.

Best,
JMJ

[christoph h.]

Time for you to start trying stuff. And/or posting in the Amps forum if you wanna get more answers than I can provide.

Yeah, I already realized that it's getting more general than what your forum is intended to cover. I already started a thread in the Amps forum. Still wanted to get your opinion of the Aguilar, though.

I feel that you provide a really useful and refreshing "real life" perspective as opposed to the "gear porn" talk that can happen in the other forums! I'm certainly guilty of falling into that trap in my earlier years!

Thanks for all the time you give to the bass community!

[gillento]

Originally Posted by christoph h.

Ok, I get the message.

I guess the idea of spending lots of money and carrying heavy objects around isn't the most attractive thing.

The Mesa stuff looks very interesting, I like what I've heard about the 400+. Unfortunately there's not a big market of vintage stuff here, so it will be hard to find some stuff. What about the newer MESAs? Casio mentioned the mpulse 600 - that one looks pretty cool!

The Ashdown ABM500 seems to be nice, too...

Time to do some research, maybe I can borrow some stuff from my friends to try out...

The ABM is very good for what you are looking for.

I'd make sure to get a used EVO or EVO2 instead of the EVO3 (which is way noisier than the former)

[christoph h.]

Thanks, I'll look out for those!

[pbd]

I don't have anything to add other than I love the thread title!


Todd

[christoph h.]

The credit for that one goes to Justin.

[skulletwhip]

Originally Posted by jmjbassplayer

But I have to also big up what Peter said...why didn't I think of that: PEAVEY!!! An old Mark IV or whatever head and a 2 x 15 cab? That will cut through anything with ugliness!




Best,
JMJ

You just made me wanna listen to Faith No More......

Anyway, I use a GK800RB into an old Acoustic 2x15. It rocks. I'm thinking of adding a 2x12 into the mix too. My set up cuts through our mix pretty well. I don't have to blend any of my dirt pedals(Fulltone OCD, and a home made Green Muff clone).

I support 2x15 cabs.

[christoph h.]

Originally Posted by skulletwhip

I support 2x15 cabs.

I guess I really have to check those out. After a horrible experience with an Ashdown 1x15 I never gave them another chance...