Vintage vs. Reissue Ampeg B-15

basementparty · #1 01-07-2009, 01:53 PM

Justin,

The gear post says that you own/use both the vintage and the reissue Ampeg B-15. I own the B-15R, and I love it. I've played a little on some vintage ones, but not extensively. Obviously, the vintage ones are legendary, so I want to know more about them. Aside from the obvious stuff (the reissue has a 100/60W switch, the reissue has an XLR out, etc.) what do you feel the biggest differences between the two amps are? Do you have an overall preference between the two, or is it more of a situational thing?

Thanks so much. I just joined this forum yesterday, and I've spent most of my time since then reading all your posts. You're a fantastic resource. Thank you for taking the time to write detailed answers to so many questions.

-Matthew

jmjbassplayer · #2 01-07-2009, 06:56 PM

You're welcome Matthew.

As far as the B-15R versus older ones (of which I have three):

The B-15R goes lower and deeper. It's also nicely woody sounding, and I highly recommend trying some higher quality tubes, as well as disconnecting the tweeter. It also has more flexibility as far as gain to volume, which is super cool. That amp, for instance is largely the sound of Beck's Sea Change, as well as parts of Guero and The Information, Ima Robot's debut record, Dixie Chicks, etc.

The older B15's are, well, even woodier sounding. They don't go as low, they aren't as flexible, but the tone straight out of the box is something to behold. I also prefer the late '60's and early '70's ones with the graphics like the blue line or black line SVT heads. They are louder, go deeper, but still have a lot of "funk" to the sound, just the right amount of "hair", and a very forthright midrange voice.

Hope that helps.

Best,
JMJ

basementparty · #3 01-08-2009, 02:30 AM

That's really helpful. Thanks for also mentioning what you used the B15R to record. I love the bass sounds on Sea Change. I know what you mean about it sounding "woody". I don't have the money to own a bunch of amps right now, so I'll take versatility any day, but it's good to have something to look forward to owning someday.
Also, I disconnected the tweeter and replaced the stock tubes with JJs the day I got it. A world of difference.
Thanks again.

jmjbassplayer · #4 01-09-2009, 02:45 AM

Cool...There you go - JJ's and no tweeter. Perfection. And keep in mind: the Sea Change bass sound is no DI, just B-15R > Fet 47 > Delcon console pre > 1176 > API 550A. Nothing fancy.

ssommer · #5 01-11-2009, 11:05 AM

Justin, first of all, thank you so much for hanging at TB, you are a big inspiration for me!

I've had a '71 B15s that I've recorded with for about 5 years. The "three knobs and no bad sounds" really taught me a lot about what a bass tone is supposed to be(as opposed to my previous 40 knobs and NO good sounds, amp).

I recently got a '69 B15n, and have started using it as my main recording amp.

I'd love to know your thoughts on the ultra-hi/ultra-low settings. I initially was thinking they were going to be pretty useful, but when I've used both the ultra hi/low, I liked how the amp sounds in the room, but it seemed to translate to loss of that "mid voice" and creates a less useful, more muddy sound in the track.

I feel like there are some great options with those settings, but I'd hate to make any more tone mistakes on someone else's record.

I know that it has a lot to do with the decisions the engineer is making, but I'm very interested in always improving the "stock" I'm sending for them to work with.

JimmyM · #6 01-11-2009, 06:18 PM

If you'll allow me to butt in just a sec...

I have a 77 B-15N, which is the same as yours except for possibly the speaker (mine's a 73 CTS...what's yours?). I kind of like the ultra-hi switch but I don't use it much at all because it does affect everything else. But if you need a little more attack on the note, it's cool because the Thiele cabs are quite a bit darker than the double baffle and single baffle cabs they used in the early-mid-60's, and with that CTS, there's little or no high end at all. The ultra-lo switch I have no use for whatsoever. It cuts down volume and makes an already dark cab sound even darker, venturing into mud.

So I'd suggest the TB tone mantra to you...start flat and work from there, and only use the switches if there's something lacking on the recorded sound. I'm sure J will have some great advice as well.

Hey Justin, you still have that B100R you kept at Beck's house? Ever try recording with it? I tried one because you said it sounded so good, and I was blown away at how close it sounds to a 60's B-15N. Does it record well?

ssommer · #7 01-11-2009, 10:33 PM

Thanks Jimmy, that's good info. I've got two cabs, and three different speakers. I believe both cabs are '71, B15s cabs. I've got an Eminence beta 15 in one, a old Altec 418b in the other, and a blown Altec 421A in the garage that came out of my first cab.

I'm with you on the TB mantra! To my ear, the sound I had dialed in using both ultra hi/ultra low was a "flatter" sound than without those switches engaged, but what threw me off was how much of the character of the amp got lost when hearing it back in the control room, in the context of the track.

Quote:

Originally Posted by JimmyM

If you'll allow me to butt in just a sec...

I have a 77 B-15N, which is the same as yours except for possibly the speaker (mine's a 73 CTS...what's yours?). I kind of like the ultra-hi switch but I don't use it much at all because it does affect everything else. But if you need a little more attack on the note, it's cool because the Thiele cabs are quite a bit darker than the double baffle and single baffle cabs they used in the early-mid-60's, and with that CTS, there's little or no high end at all. The ultra-lo switch I have no use for whatsoever. It cuts down volume and makes an already dark cab sound even darker, venturing into mud.

So I'd suggest the TB tone mantra to you...start flat and work from there, and only use the switches if there's something lacking on the recorded sound. I'm sure J will have some great advice as well.

JimmyM · #8 01-12-2009, 01:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ssommer

Thanks Jimmy, that's good info. I've got two cabs, and three different speakers. I believe both cabs are '71, B15s cabs. I've got an Eminence beta 15 in one, a old Altec 418b in the other, and a blown Altec 421A in the garage that came out of my first cab.

I'm with you on the TB mantra! To my ear, the sound I had dialed in using both ultra hi/ultra low was a "flatter" sound than without those switches engaged, but what threw me off was how much of the character of the amp got lost when hearing it back in the control room, in the context of the track.

That seems to mirror my experiences when I first got the bigger cab in April. I'm more used to the double baffle B-15's which have a flatter tone, and I tried to get the Thiele cab to do things it's not meant to do when I first got it. I think I get the best results with it when I don't strive for a flat tone and just let it do what it does best...dominate 125-200 hz. But that's just me...I'm sure you'll lock onto your own tonal thing.

Levitamin · #9 01-17-2009, 04:00 PM

Hey Justin,

Have you ever had problems with your B15 Reissue sounding like something was shorting out? Mine is driving me absolutely crazy lately. It snaps and pops intermittently, and makes a weird sizzle/buzzing sound when I hit certain notes. I've checked my tubes for microphonics, unhooked the tweeter, nothing works. I think the house my band practices in might be improperly grounded (or something), because I took the B15 to my local tube amp shop and they couldn't find anything wrong after playing through it all day. I used to own the SVT Classic reissue, and that amp definitely had a similar issue. I had to have a tech change the ground in the amp to get the problem to go away.

jmjbassplayer · #10 01-17-2009, 08:19 PM

Not at all, I've never had anything like that. Bummer! I'm sorry to hear about that, and I'm not really knowledgeable enough to have a technical opinion. Good luck!

JimmyM · #11 01-17-2009, 09:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Levitamin

Hey Justin,

Have you ever had problems with your B15 Reissue sounding like something was shorting out? Mine is driving me absolutely crazy lately. It snaps and pops intermittently, and makes a weird sizzle/buzzing sound when I hit certain notes. I've checked my tubes for microphonics, unhooked the tweeter, nothing works. I think the house my band practices in might be improperly grounded (or something), because I took the B15 to my local tube amp shop and they couldn't find anything wrong after playing through it all day. I used to own the SVT Classic reissue, and that amp definitely had a similar issue. I had to have a tech change the ground in the amp to get the problem to go away.

It's possible a tube could have gone kaflooey and not go microphonic. I'm not qualified either, but post about it in the Amps forum...Jerrold Tiers who was a chief Ampeg engineer while that amp was being made is a regular.

JimmyM · #12 01-18-2009, 01:38 AM

Justin, could you please put a little more definition on the word "hair" as you use it? I was just rereading this thread and "hair" stuck out (pardon the pun) as something that could use a little 'splainin' for us old timers.

jmjbassplayer · #13 01-18-2009, 10:42 AM

I'd probably quantify it as a subtle, very warm distortion that you hear on the low to mid areas of the spectrum, rather than the type of distortion you hear way up high. It's the stuff that adds character in the low mids, growl, that kind of thing.

JimmyM · #14 01-18-2009, 01:17 PM

Ah, I get it. Very good, sir.

Caca de Kick · #15 01-18-2009, 03:40 PM

Yes, more love for the B15R. The best tone change I've done is switch to JJ E34L tubes (similar to EL34, but supposedly for low end).
Mine gets used for every recording session I've done for the last 4 years, and every engineer/producer loves the sound. A session I recenty played one song on for a local duo, the engineer re-looped all the other album's bass tracks through my amp to liven up the tones.

JimmyM · #16 01-18-2009, 05:51 PM

I look forward to the day I can actually play through a B-15R that's tweaked and find out for myself. I've only seen pics, and really, the only B-15's I've ever seen in person are mine

But there are times I'd really like to have a few extra watts. Not many...100 is probably overkill for me, but a little more than 25 or 30 would come in handy occasionally.

jmjbassplayer · #17 01-19-2009, 12:52 AM

Ooh...I'd like to try those JJ tubes in my second B-15R. I'll bet that's a good way to go.

JimmyM · #18 01-20-2009, 02:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jmjbassplayer

Ooh...I'd like to try those JJ tubes in my second B-15R. I'll bet that's a good way to go.

Hmmm...I figured you for a NOS guy. I hope you guys have better luck with JJ's than I did. Got a few last year to try out...the 6L6's went out in 3 months and one preamp tube went out within a couple weeks. Great tone when they worked, though. I understand that my experiences aren't typical with them, though. Most people speak highly of them. But since I have a great NOS tube store 20 minutes away, I just go there now. I've given up on new tubes.

Levitamin · #19 01-26-2009, 02:08 PM

I just found out that my fuzz/buzz problem only happens when the B15r is set to 60 watt mode. It's clean in 100 watt mode. Very strange.

JimmyM · #20 01-26-2009, 08:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Levitamin

I just found out that my fuzz/buzz problem only happens when the B15r is set to 60 watt mode. It's clean in 100 watt mode. Very strange.

That is strange. Sounds like you need to take it into the shop before it takes out the 100w mode, too.