German Bow Grip?

[KSB - Ken Smith]

What do you prefer on a German Bow, Whalebone Grip, Silver or Nickle-Silver Wrap or no Grip at all. See pic for clarity; http://www.kensmithbasses.com/Double.../techfrogs.jpg

Being a French Bow player, I am wondering why you would want a Grip at all other than to possible balance the stick or just plain looks when your fore-finger barely touches the leather trim wrap.

So if you are a German Bow player, please tell me what you like or prefer most and why.. thx, Ken

[damonsmith]

I like using both French and German grips on a German Bow, but still prefer no grip at all.

[Cory Palmer]

I prefer no grip. My Pfretzschner has a leather grip without any silver. It looks nice but doesn't have much of a function other than that. I also have a Rubino without a grip.

[KSB - Ken Smith]

Here's some pics with no Grip at all just to make things clear; http://www.kolstein.com/instruments/...6/bb0526_2.jpg
http://www.kolstein.com/instruments/...1/bb0151_2.jpg

[sibass89]

Hey Ken,

For German Bow, I believe the grip is just for looks and is a preference. I personally like the look of having a grip on there. My bow has a leather grip and silver winding and although my fingers never go near it I believe it just looks better. But I also have seen and played bows with no grip and liked those too. I think a person should step back and look at the bow and decide which look they like better.

As of what you said with weight - it might help balance the bow a little better being that many bowmakers make tip heavy bows to counterbalance the heavier frog. Then the bows tend to be too tip heavy. But, I can't imagine that overall 1 gram making that much of a difference.

-Nick

[toman]

My best German bow had a grip at one time, but no longer. It plays great, so I'm not concerned. That, plus I think German bows just look cleaner and nicer without them. Aside from the possible weight factor, why did German bows ever have grips, anyway? When I'm playing, no part of my hand ever touches the thing, and it only adds cost to a new bow... Although, I don't see much advantage to them on French bow either, although at least you do come in contact with it a bit; I think a gripless French bow would be just fine too.

[Jeff Guevin]

A lot of people (incl. Rabbath, I gather) find a nice thick grip very handy on the French bow. I've gone back to German now, but French was much easier for me with a thick rubber grip on it. That said, I'm not sure there's much point to the thin traditional wound grip.

For German, I love the look of having no grip.

EDIT: Sorry, Ken, you asked for why German players prefer whalebone/silver/no grip--I like the "no grip" look because a) bow wood is beautiful and it deserves to be seen, and b) I think it lends a sort of "simple", baroque, elegant look to the bow.

[Machina]

I have a very nice snakewood Wilfer bow with no grip and like it that way. The grip wouldn't serve a purpose, so I say why have it other than looks. However, I do love the look of whalebone.
As far as prefernce goes, I am concerned with sounds first then looks, so it is not like I wouldn't buy a bow with silver wrapping.

[jdapodaca]

If I had the option of buying the same bow, and it sounded exactly the same with me playing my own bass, with or without grip, I'd buy it without grip.

I think most players prefer the look of no grip on the German bow.

[LouisF]

+1, no grip or just leather

LF

[rprowse]

To be honest, although I practise up to 2 hours a day with my bow (almost every day), I had to go and get it out to have a look! I played French for many years, but injured (wore out) my right hand index finger. About two years ago I took my much loved bow to a luthier who built a new German frog for it. Unfortunately, he decided to use a slightly different shape for the frog. The bottom of the frog curves in more, putting more weight onto the tip of the bow. At first I wasn't keen on this, but I've grown used to it. It doesn't seem funny when I use other German bows. Sorry, I digress.
Richard

[JimGullen]

Originally Posted by sibass89

I can't imagine that overall 1 gram making that much of a difference.

Greetings!

Windings and grips actually span a relatively large range in weight. The winding is the biggest contributer. The type of material (silk, whalebone or silver...in a couple of guages), as well as the winding's length (some silver windings go under the grip others don't) all are used to give a bow the balance that it needs. If a bow is very tip heavy, lead tape can also be under the grip to move the balance point even closer to the frog. The great French shops used the lead wrappers from wine bottles! :-) You would be amazed at the difference a gram or two can make. It can be difference between playing with or without pain! (moreso on the smaller bows of violin and viola.) It's easy to vary the weight of the winding/grip anywhere from 2 to 8 grams

Aesthetically, I like the looks of a silver winding and a goatskin grip....but I'll give the bow whatever it needs for balance first. Soemtimes that means something other than silver. Maybe it's beacuse I started on French bow, but I think a German bow looks "nekkid" without a grip and winding....not that I'm looking at it when I'm playing Brahms! :-)

Best regards!
Jim

[sibass89]

Thanks Jim. That was very informative. I did not know all of that and how much effect the winding can have on a bow.

[Jake]

I used to play a Lothar Seifert German bow. When I had the grip taken off, I felt that the balance was better on that particular bow. It also looked better IMO.

[Johnny L]

Originally Posted by KSB - Ken Smith

Being a French Bow player, I am wondering why you would want a Grip at all other than to possible balance the stick or just plain looks when your fore-finger barely touches the leather trim wrap.

So if you are a German Bow player, please tell me what you like or prefer most and why.. thx, Ken

Doesn't Jeff Bradetich play a French bow without a grip in one of his videos?

Anyway, it's all aesthetics regardless I think. The music's gonna come out no matter what.

[Jake]

You're right, Johnny, the bow that Jeff Bradetich uses in the Double Bass Technique video does not have a grip. That's his main one and it's an extra long Steven Riley French bow.

[stefaniw80401]

I find the leather grip on my gr bow serves as a "pad" of sorts for my middle finger, and its thickness also makes it easier to keep the bow perpendicular to the strings. Although, I've never played a gripless bow. If nothing else, the grip protects the stick from wear. - Mark

[toman]

I would think that in order to have your middle finger touching the grip on a German bow you'd have to have one long finger... Maybe not though.

[billyfalconer]

Originally Posted by stefaniw80401

I find the leather grip on my gr bow serves as a "pad" of sorts for my middle finger

Your middle finger isn't on the middle of the frog? Perhaps you mean your first finger (closest to your thumb)? Still, you must have enormous hands to have your first finger past the frog. Even then, though, for a German grip it sems you'd still need to curl your fingers down before the grip. Can you give us a picture of how you hold the bow?

Originally Posted by stefaniw80401

its thickness also makes it easier to keep the bow perpendicular to the strings.

How is that? Does it help you sight the angle better?

[Dr Rod]

Originally Posted by sibass89

For German Bow, I believe the grip is just for looks and is a preference.

Ken

Sidbass98 stated the truth. For the German bow, the grip is not functional but 100% esthetics.