Is compression necessary for live sound?

SubSectorSucker · #1 08-27-2011, 06:18 PM

Hey guys. My old mixer which just gave up the ghost had on board compression for each channel. Going through the board is 3 vocal mics, 2 guitars (mic'd amps) a bass (di'd) and we usually mic the kick drum but sometimes the snare, too.

Our new mixer doesn't have onboard compression. Do I need to buy a compressor, or can I get by with careful eq-ing, careful gain control (mainly for the drums) and good vocal/mic technique?

Thanks in advance!

walterw · #2 08-27-2011, 09:38 PM

compression is nice for vocals, especially with big PAs that can actually make the vocals too loud; if you don't have it with a smaller system, don't sweat it.

Jimbob Jones · #3 08-28-2011, 05:12 AM

+1, it's nice to have some comp, but it's not essential. I would just try a few gigs without, and you'll probably be fine. If you aren't happy with the results, then look at investing in one.

SubSectorSucker · #4 08-28-2011, 10:40 AM

Thanks guys

Never_grew_up · #5 08-28-2011, 11:01 AM

If you do decide to add compressors, the best bang for the buck is the Samson S-COM-4 channel unit. Runs $160-170 & does pretty much anything you need except for fetching a cold beer. I have 3 that I use on channel inserts for wireless lavs in a theatre environment & couldn't be happier with them.

ggunn · #6 08-28-2011, 02:07 PM

Is compression necessary? No. Can it be useful in some situations? Absolutely.

4Mal · #7 08-28-2011, 08:48 PM

I consider it essential. Probably not on individual channels where it is often overdone. You know the old adage about how if you can hear it it's too much ? Nope. I run my comps right after the crossover setup per dbx's brickwall limiter guideline as protection for my tops and bottoms.... Essential? Hell yeah!

agreatheight · #8 08-28-2011, 08:59 PM

Is compression necessary for professional live sound. YES, ABSOLUTELY. Is it necessary for amateur live sound? No.

TimmyP · #9 08-28-2011, 09:01 PM

I've yet to encounter a singer who doesn't have huge level changes over the course of a song. Couple this with the fact that almost all get thinner as they get louder, and compression is very important - preferably one with sidechain EQ.

It's important to note that an inserted comp will affect that channel's send(s) to the auxes.

stingraysvt · #10 08-28-2011, 09:10 PM

Even when I'm behind the console compression really reigns a mix in when applied on each channel.

Instead of turning down a hot vocal I'll tighten up the compression, same for bass and guitar, kick, etc....

There's a few things I don't compress so the mix has some "fluctuation" but I always compress the bass in the mains. Pretty hard too, and compensate the gain by 3.4-4db.

I make sure vocals sit above that and that gives me a solid mix.

I'm spoiled by having it on every channel now because I can dial it in if needed... I really hate mixing without it now, really... Gives the mix more consistency, and volume changes wind up being minor at best...

T-Bird · #11 08-29-2011, 11:25 AM

Hi.

My 0.02€ as a someone who used to do pro sound part time a long time ago.

If You have learned to live with a compressor on every channel, and learned to rely on 'em, I can't see any way how you could live without.

IME any compressor is better than none, especially for a bar band, makes the sound persons (=Your

) life a lot easier. I use my Yamahas one-knob ones with the small rig, 4 channel B's with the big rig, good enough for me.

Regards
Sam

konodl18 · #12 08-29-2011, 04:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TimmyP

I've yet to encounter a singer who doesn't have huge level changes over the course of a song. Couple this with the fact that almost all get thinner as they get louder, and compression is very important...

I concur. I would have a very hard time being happy with a mix without at least some compression on the vocals. Most vocalists with have a pretty wide dynamic range and its hard to mix without squashing that range a little.

Barisaxman · #13 08-30-2011, 10:03 AM

If you have to ask, you probably stand a chance of doing more damage with outboard compression than good. If not used carefully, you can introduce all kinds of feedback problems and other undesirables. One-knob compression on a mixer is fine for amateur sound, but chances are you probalby won't need it anyway...and if you think you do, spend some time learning how to properly use it. No use putting a bunch of stuff in the signal chain if you don't completely understand how to use it.

jaywa · #14 08-30-2011, 10:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by agreatheight

Is compression necessary for professional live sound. YES, ABSOLUTELY. Is it necessary for amateur live sound? No.

This.

uhdinator · #15 08-31-2011, 07:41 AM

For vocals it depends on vocalist technique, style.

For drums, yes. You need to tame the transients to get the average level up if you are using subs and want to get a solid thump. A comp with gate is good to cut out any ring or clean up a sloppy sounding kick.

Bass guit usually benefits from comp as well.

I keep 4 dual ch comps in my rack and use 4-8 ch of them on inserts as required.

TimmyP · #16 09-02-2011, 07:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by uhdinator

For vocals it depends on vocalist technique, style.

For drums, yes. You need to tame the transients to get the average level up if you are using subs and want to get a solid thump. A comp with gate is good to cut out any ring or clean up a sloppy sounding kick.

Bass guit usually benefits from comp as well.

I keep 4 dual ch comps in my rack and use 4-8 ch of them on inserts as required.

I seldom comp a drum. Often comp bass, but vocal I always comp - NEED to comp.

PDGood · #17 09-02-2011, 08:01 PM

To answer part of the original question - even careful EQing, mic technique, and gain control won't do the trick (because how can you guess when someone is going to spike?) Singers get carried away with the moment and many of them vary a great deal from song to song as well as within a song.

Zooberwerx · #18 09-03-2011, 01:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TimmyP

I've yet to encounter a singer who doesn't have huge level changes over the course of a song. Couple this with the fact that almost all get thinner as they get louder, and compression is very important - preferably one with sidechain EQ.

It's important to note that an inserted comp will affect that channel's send(s) to the auxes.

I've heard that sending a compressed vocal signal via the aux's to monitor can be a bad thing. What's the preferred method of applying vocal compression in terms of routing?

Riis

ggunn · #19 09-03-2011, 02:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zooberwerx

I've heard that sending a compressed vocal signal via the aux's to monitor can be a bad thing. What's the preferred method of applying vocal compression in terms of routing?

Riis

It can be a bad thing if it's not set correctly. It can, for example, send the monitors into roaring feedback if the threshold is set very low and the gain very high.

If it's in a channel insert, it will most likely be in the monitors.

Jimbob Jones · #20 09-03-2011, 02:18 PM

I would guess that the channel that requires compression is routed to its own group, then the group insert is used.

Just to chuck in my $0.02: only invest in compression if you've done a few gigs without it, and you are left thinking 'hmm, I need a compressor.'

Every situation is different; I've heard some truly great mixes using nothing but an analogue desk with EQ only, and a single reverb unit. The truth is, even though it's nice to have, sometimes (I would say often), the 'need' for compression simply doesn't justify the $$$ required to get a decent one. (I respectfully disagree with T-Bird's comments about cheap compressors; just my approach to doing things).

Also, if you're used to a 1-knob comp, setting up one with 5 or 6 or more knobs for each channel may be more trouble than it's worth. A badly set up comp can be more devastating to a mix than a badly set up EQ, IMO.