Heil PR 35---best all around mic ever?

JimmyM · #1 02-22-2009, 10:29 PM

Did a gig last night where the soundman had the new Heil PR 35's for vocal mics, except for our drummer who wants a wireless, so he had a Sennheiser wireless. Wow, does this mic sound impressive! Our drummer sounded like crap compared to us! Crystal clear, almost dead flat response all the way up from 40 hz, and possibly the best S sound I ever heard in a handheld. Sounds like a condenser but it's a dynamic. Our guitarist liked it so much that he's buying one. I'm still on the fence about it because even though the sound is fantastic, you really have to get right on it. I've used a 58 all my life and I like being able to sing into it off axis and still get picked up. I tend to get a little sloppy with the mic technique during a gig because I hop around a lot. The PR 35 is very unforgiving of sloppy technique.

But boy does it sound great! And with its near flat response down to 40 hz, it would probably make a really good instrument mic as well. Didn't get to try it on a bass cab but I wanted to.

Anyone else try this mic yet? If not, you really should.

GregShadoan · #2 02-23-2009, 03:25 AM

Every Heil I have ever heard sounded great. Have you tried a Shure Beta57 for vocals yet? You might be plesantly surprised with those too :-)

ehque · #3 02-23-2009, 03:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GregShadoan

Every Heil I have ever heard sounded great. Have you tried a Shure Beta57 for vocals yet? You might be plesantly surprised with those too :-)

Why a 57 and not a 58?

projectMalamute · #4 02-23-2009, 06:53 AM

Jimmy: have you considered that despite being ubiquitous, durable and cheap, the SM57 and SM58's are not really all that great?

I ask this because you have spent a great deal of time raving about how the PR40 has replaced an SM57(or was it a 58?) in front of your amp, and that it's fan-fricken-tastic. And now you have heard a PR35 instead of a 58 on vocals and have declared it the best mic ever.

Heil make nice stuff. So do Sennheiser or AKG or Audio Technica or ElectroVoice or Neumann or Schoeps or Josephson ... Best mic ever is a pretty lofty claim. Lots of people make nice stuff, especially if the point of comparison is an SM58.

JimmyM · #5 02-23-2009, 10:02 AM

Greg, I have tried the Beta 57 and 58 many times. Don't like either. Too papery sounding in the highs, although our guitarist likes them. I've always just liked a regular 58 for onstage vocals.

Malamute, please don't insult my intelligence. The reason I've always liked the 58 is because it sounds great for my voice in a live setting, is very easy to sing into, and is indestructible. I have no illusions that it will blow away a U47. However, I have tried pretty much every vocal mic you see regularly in the field and I always wish it was a 58. The Heil, however, is the first one where I didn't miss the 58. Hey, what can I tell you? I like the 58...sorry.

I should have added the word "live" to my thread title, though. Of course I wouldn't use the Heil in a studio where they have a good condenser.

fokof · #6 02-23-2009, 10:44 AM

If we talk handheld , "live" vocal microphone , the KMS105 is pretty hard to beat.
You think the PR35 is better than the 105 ?

Never had the chance to compare......

JimmyM · #7 02-23-2009, 11:46 AM

Nobody in my circles is ever going to pull out a $650 live vocal mic for me

So no, I haven't got a chance to try a KSM 105. Looks like a great mic, but it wouldn't last a night with me. I'm pretty hard on mics. I knock them over with my upright, I trip on cables and pull them over, etc. It's one of the big reasons I probably won't get this Heil, too. Looks durable but probably wouldn't stand up to an upright like a Shure. But in the category of vocal mics I work with on stages (under $300), it's the best I've used.

fokof · #8 02-23-2009, 12:03 PM

Cool

Just that the tittle of the thread is ; " Best all around mic ever"
That's a very "hard" statement

I would put the 421 long before that.
Can be used as a kick , tom , bass ,vocal , horns , my sisiter...

JimmyM · #9 02-23-2009, 12:07 PM

Ya, I already addressed that I should have added "live" to the thread title. And now I'd have to add "under $300." Anyone got any more qualifiers you think I should have added to the thread title?

GregShadoan · #10 02-23-2009, 03:37 PM

Mic preference is always a "hot button" issue in the pro sound world. For example, I am not a big shure fan for vocals. That contradicts about 75% of the real world. At the same time, I really like the beta57 for vocals (poor mans 105) :-) My main A2 loves the audix om5's. Easy to mix in monitors. SM58's are probably the most widely used mic for vocals in the world. Doesn't make the best. I happen to hate the beta58's, but love the beta57. Weird... There is no single mic "best" for any one person/purpose. Everyone has their own favorites. A good freind of mine, likes the 105, says everything else sounds like **** :-)) Les Claypool uses an SM57. Robin Zander uses a Beta57. Some people never stop trying new mics, looking for the ultimate mic for them. Depends on the music too. Some work better for quiet stage volume, while others work better for loud stage volume. The "best mic under 300 for live" is a myth. Have fun looking though ROFL.

TimmyP · #11 04-02-2009, 11:04 PM

I've not tried the PR35, but the PR22 sounds very good, as do the KMS105, VX10, and likely a few others. However these mics also pick up much more stage wash, and in some cases are unusable without so much EQ that the sonic benefits are gone. That's why I use the OM7 - it sounds better than the commonly used dynamics, and if it will not do the job (there's too much stage noise), nothing will. The 767a seems good as well, but I need to use it more to know for sure.

kalle74 · #12 04-04-2009, 04:08 AM

the best live mic?

hard to say, depends on the application... 421 stands high in my books.

the best live vocal mic?

Sennheiser 800 and 900 series (having tried nearly all of them, my faves are 865 and 935) are really good, as are some Audix models. Haven´t tried the PR35, but if it´s close to PR30, it should be one awesome mic... the KMS105 sounds great, but the bleed from other instruments on small stages is a serious issue. SM58´s and 57´s are durable as hell, but in all honesty sound like c**p, and the bleed sounds even more so...

fokof · #13 04-08-2009, 05:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kalle74

the KMS105 sounds great, but the bleed from other instruments on small stages is a serious issue.

One of the advantage of the KM105 is his supercardioid patern wich doesn't pickup everything else on stage. You probably tried a KM104 , wich is cardioid.

TimmyP · #14 04-08-2009, 05:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fokof

One of the advantage of the KM105 is his supercardioid patern wich doesn't pickup everything else on stage. You probably tried a KM104 , wich is cardioid.

THe 105 may be a super, but it's certainly a wide one (hyper and super denote the type of lobes, but not the size of the lobes).

Mads · #15 04-08-2009, 07:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fokof

One of the advantage of the KM105 is his supercardioid patern wich doesn't pickup everything else on stage. You probably tried a KM104 , wich is cardioid.

IMO:
Standing at FOH I would like to say that a KM105 picks up a lot of the stage.

But then again the 105 is not for every voice and every setting.
But I've used it on a jazz trio where it really suited the female vocalist and the others were very much aware of stage levels.

Greyvagabond · #16 06-05-2009, 01:40 PM

A little off topic, but I've got to say, the Shure SM58 Beta is the best vocal mic for Female singers I've heard! She used to use a $250 AKG condensor built for live applications, but it would always feed back, and when it didn't, it was very...whispy, and not warm. I got a Beta of a TD'er (after being frustrated withe AKG) for $80, and we sound SOO much better. She is way louder at rehearsal, too!

4Mal · #17 06-07-2009, 12:26 PM

we all have different voices, resonances, anaomolies in our voices...is it any wonder that we all have different vocal mic preferences ? At volume I like the Beta 58 on my voice. I can work with the sm-75 too. I dig the Oktava 319 in low volume settings like my acoustic band.

Mike151 · #18 08-15-2009, 09:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4Mal

we all have different voices, resonances, anaomolies in our voices...is it any wonder that we all have different vocal mic preferences ?

Excellent point. I haven't had alot of experience with setting up a PA before recently and I was sound checking our singer's mic before he got there. Thought I had it sounding pretty good with no feedback and then I asked the drummer to check it. His voice made it sound tinty and it fed back immediately.
Back to topic: We seem to constantly have issues with not being able to turn the vocals up loud enough to hear ourselves and when we do, we get feedback. We don't have a sound guy and I don't try to tell the guitard how to mix the board. I just say "I can't hear myself when I sing" and he says "you can't whisper, you have to sing loud." Well when I sing loud, I lose my ability to sound half way decent.
So,,,, my question here is, do you think the Heil PR 35 would help eliminate the feedback that we get when turning up to higher volumes so I don't have to scream into the mic? If so, I'm going to buy one TODAY!

JimmyM · #19 08-15-2009, 01:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike151

Excellent point. I haven't had alot of experience with setting up a PA before recently and I was sound checking our singer's mic before he got there. Thought I had it sounding pretty good with no feedback and then I asked the drummer to check it. His voice made it sound tinty and it fed back immediately.
Back to topic: We seem to constantly have issues with not being able to turn the vocals up loud enough to hear ourselves and when we do, we get feedback. We don't have a sound guy and I don't try to tell the guitard how to mix the board. I just say "I can't hear myself when I sing" and he says "you can't whisper, you have to sing loud." Well when I sing loud, I lose my ability to sound half way decent.
So,,,, my question here is, do you think the Heil PR 35 would help eliminate the feedback that we get when turning up to higher volumes so I don't have to scream into the mic? If so, I'm going to buy one TODAY!

Any mic will cause feedback if it's turned up loud enough. That's the nature of the beast. The PR35 is very good at rejecting it but it's not a miracle worker. Best way to do it is keep your FOH speakers in front of the band and use monitors or side fills pointing toward the band but not into any mics.

D.A.R.K. · #20 08-15-2009, 02:38 PM

the heil stuff is really great, lots of folks are going to their camp at the moment. as stated, it definitely comes down to the individual voice and how each mic reacts to that voice.
funny how proximity used to be considered a bad thing, with over emphasis on lows being to outcome...
now, due to the nature of the beast (the marshall stack, for example)
mics are being designed for this purpose.
i'm really into the beyerdynamic stuff right now, despite having a nice selection of sennheiser mics available for free through tour support....
i find the m88 is the shizz with all 3 female vocalists i mix for,
and the heil, sennheiser and sure mics just didn't cut it for them.
i've used different condensers including the 105 as well (i find it picks up a hell of a lot of stage sound, like most condensers), but if you visit a couple hundred different places a year with different systems you might find that vocal condensers can be problematic.. one bad connection or slight short in a cable can ruin your day pretty quick. you loose an overhead on the kit, not many will notice... you loose the main vocal, everyone wants to kill you, including the artist.
i usually leave the condensers to stationary uses...
anyway, glad you found one you like jimmy!