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  #1  
Old 08-16-2010, 01:36 PM
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I turned off my bass......nobody noticed!

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I just had what I think was the worst gig of my life. I could go on and on about the hundreds of things that went wrong or bothered me but I want to focus on one thing that I feel is just rediculous.

I'll do a little set up so you know where I am coming from.

Incoming Wall Of Text!!!!!!!

I play in a three piece cover band. (We have four members but one is a singer/part time keyboardist, so I consider it three peice.) We play a mix of new and older rock toons. Any thing from AC/DC to Paramore, Foo Fighters to Deep Purple. We have three singers. Myself (the bass player, male), the guitarist (male), and a female vocalist (the guitarists wife.) We all sing back up for each other. The songs are split pretty even at 1/3 per singer.

I feel we have some of the best talent in the area. I am not saying we are awesome, just above average for what we do. I think everyone has good tones for their instruments. We know how to sound good together (so I thought!) and no one is a diva. We all work together very well and have for a long time. We are all very close friends and have been for years.

A few months ago we added another member to our band by hiring a full time sound man. (Previously, we (I) ran everything from stage. We own our own P.A.) Everyone really likes him and it has taken a large load off my shoulders having someone there that can do the dirty work. The other band members often rave about how good we sound now and I love being able to concentrate on singing and playing and not sound problems/issues.

O.K., thats the background, here is the issue.

I became concerned that I (meaning my bass not vocals)have not been in the mix during our last few shows. I thought maybe I was getting a little too much bleed though from the stage volume. No big deal, I'll turn down. I started looking at the board closer on the next few gigs. It looked fishy to me. I asked, "Am, I too loud on stage?" The sound man says no. My band-mates say "No, turn it up a bit." They can't hear me, but only if I ask.

So to test my theory, on the last gig, I shut the volume controls on my bass guitar off during a few songs. ( No signal to the board, no signal to my amp!) These were not your typical root note bashing song, but song that I think had good bass lines that are important to the song or walking bass lines that should be missed if gone. The songs would/should have sound very sterile if the bass was not there.

Nobody noticed! Not my drummer, not the guitarist or other singer, not my wife or my daughter who were both in the audience and seated directly in front of me, and most imprortant, not the sound guy! However, later in the night, my guitardist stepped on his cord and pulled it out from the jack. Everyone noticed that!

I pride myself on being a good solid bass player. I know my job. I try to never overplay anything. I have good timing. I pay attention to the drummer and his lead. I know that the bass guitar is not the "sexy" intrument. I make sure my tone is "right" for the song,"right" for the band, and "right" for the room. I stay out of the guitar players frequency bed. (But I do not always get the same treatment.) I do my best to compliment the drums.

I do not know what to do at this point. I am screaming mad about this and I do not think I can even discuss it with my bandmates without it becoming a full blown fight.

I refuse to be just an average player. I practice long and hard. I have hundreds of gigs and experience under my belt. If I am not going to be heard, or worse, not missed when I am gone, I do not see the need to be in this band.

A three peice band with no bass guitar? NO! NO! NO! How can no one notice that one of the three is missing unless everone is used no not hearing me in the first place?

I must have miss-judged my ability and worth somewhere along the line. It's the only explaination that I can come up with.

Anyways, I am at my lowest point. I feel disgusted and depressed. I may be looking for something new.

  #2  
Old 08-16-2010, 02:03 PM
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Just read your post and don't have a clue as to what you're talking about...and we do want to help.

As Joe Friday use to say: "just the facts, ma'am".

Riis
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  #3  
Old 08-16-2010, 02:09 PM
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i don't see why you can't talk to your band and the sound man and have your bass turned up
  #4  
Old 08-16-2010, 02:12 PM
Day Day is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zooberwerx View Post
Just read your post and don't have a clue as to what you're talking about...and we do want to help.

As Joe Friday use to say: "just the facts, ma'am".

Riis
His post seemed pretty clear to me. Turned his volume down and no one noticed.
  #5  
Old 08-16-2010, 02:12 PM
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Hmm. I play in a 4 piece and if I turned my bass off we wouldn't get two bars before someone would be looking at me with a *** look. I don't know what to tell you, but there sure needs to be a band meeting with the sound guy.
  #6  
Old 08-16-2010, 02:14 PM
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I wouldn't even waste anymore time with them (but I quit a band during the middle of a two weekend recording session because instead of asking me to lay down a simpler bass line for one song....the lead guitarist recorded a new bass line while I wasn't there.....dropped them like a hot effing rock).

I don't know.....maybe you probably should say something in a few days after you've cooled your jets. That's probably what I should have done. YMMV.
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Last edited by bazzanderson : 08-16-2010 at 03:24 PM.
  #7  
Old 08-16-2010, 02:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zooberwerx View Post
Just read your post and don't have a clue as to what you're talking about...and we do want to help.

As Joe Friday use to say: "just the facts, ma'am".

Riis
How do you not have a clue what the OP is talking about? It's pretty clear to me. He turned his bass off, and no one could tell the difference. He feels pretty undervalued and underappreciated as a result. Are you sure you can read?

As for the OP, I'm sorry about what happened. It sucks to play with musicians who don't listen to anything but themselves. The sound guy doesn't seem to listen very well either. Move on, is my advice. These types of musicians don't usually change in my experience. For god's sake if you are going to bring it up with them do not get all pissed off and angry. That will make you feel even worse, and won't resolve anything.
  #8  
Old 08-16-2010, 02:24 PM
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ouch...I would talk to them and get to the bottom of this. At least you'll have some sort of closure instead of letting things just hang in air.
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  #9  
Old 08-16-2010, 02:27 PM
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Show up with a bass without strings and no cable to plug in. Or better yet use a wii guitar hero ax and see if they notice.
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  #10  
Old 08-16-2010, 02:28 PM
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Hilarious!


Quote:
Originally Posted by Ric5 View Post
Show up with a bass without strings and no cable to plug in. Or better yet use a wii guitar hero ax and see if they notice.
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  #11  
Old 08-16-2010, 02:28 PM
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Location: Wisconsin
Ok. Some seams confused about this.

I turned myself OFF! On stage, while playing. No signal whatsoever. Not to my amp, not to the P.A. No one noticed! Not the sound guy, not my band mates, not my family in the audience.

I don't know how to be more clear.

Bass to me is only behind vocals and drumming in importance when playing live music. I don't think I am being arrogant in saying that.

How can no one notice if it is gone? Am I, as a bass player, just super sensitive to the lower frequencies of the bass guitar?
  #12  
Old 08-16-2010, 02:33 PM
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So where is all the low end coming from? If you were playing songs where the root of each guitar chord is played by the bass, for the most part, this is easy to believe. Too much low end coming from the guitar rig. EDIT: I see you have keys. That's where I'd look first. Keys players are notorious for 1) playing too much and 2)too much low-end in their sound.

Last edited by dmusic148 : 08-16-2010 at 02:36 PM.
  #13  
Old 08-16-2010, 02:35 PM
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No one noticed because it wasn't in the mix in the first place, and your stage volume was low enough that it wasn't feeding the room.

And obviously, none of your bandmates care about it.


.
  #14  
Old 08-16-2010, 02:38 PM
Day Day is offline
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Yup sounds like a combo of all of the above. Not in the PA mix, Keys and Guitar taking up too much of the low end. I'd talk to the guys and let them know what happened at least.
  #15  
Old 08-16-2010, 02:40 PM
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People are right, there is either too much low from other instruments, you're not loud enough to begin with, or your amp has got smiley-face syndrome..

Your sound guy is supposed to be putting each instrument in their place (sonically) and making sure everyone can be heard. Its either the PA is too small and adding your bass in causes everything to get flubby, or the sound guy has no idea what he is doing at all.

Your post was clear, some just don't like reading more than a paragraph on a forum...
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Last edited by JackANSI : 08-16-2010 at 02:43 PM.
  #16  
Old 08-16-2010, 02:42 PM
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I don't think it's personal and I don't think you are being undervalued. I think they are just brain dead. (a little) There is no cure other than moving to a place where musicians take the time to listen to each other.
  #17  
Old 08-16-2010, 02:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dmusic148 View Post
So where is all the low end coming from? If you were playing songs where the root of each guitar chord is played by the bass, for the most part, this is easy to believe. Too much low end coming from the guitar rig. EDIT: I see you have keys. That's where I'd look first. Keys players are notorious for 1) playing too much and 2)too much low-end in their sound.
No keys where being played in these songs. It must have been a combo of the kick, low tom and guitar cabs. Still unbeleivable that no one can notice when the bass line is missing from songs that are bass line dominant! (Meaning I was not following the guitar player, I had my own stuff going on.)
  #18  
Old 08-16-2010, 02:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dmusic148 View Post
So where is all the low end coming from? If you were playing songs where the root of each guitar chord is played by the bass, for the most part, this is easy to believe. Too much low end coming from the guitar rig. EDIT: I see you have keys. That's where I'd look first. Keys players are notorious for 1) playing too much and 2)too much low-end in their sound.
+1. Problem may not be your lack of volume but rather the "frequency wars" which occur @ ~ 125 hz. A good soundman can fix it at the board but has virtually no control over your backline.

Riis
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  #19  
Old 08-16-2010, 02:48 PM
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I was going to say, next time turn WAY up. I looked at your profile so see what amp & cab you use. Are you using the Carvin Red Eye 2x10 Combo into the PA? May be they have never really heard you and have gotten use to playing over you. Time for a SVT & 810, they will know when you drop out then.
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  #20  
Old 08-16-2010, 02:52 PM
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Turn your amp up onstage. If it's inaudible to the audience, and the soundguy is not doing his job by mixing you in, then you need to turn up!
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