Mic with low proximity effect?

**butchblack** · #1 07-30-2011, 12:52 PM

Hi

Our keyboard/accordion player tends not to eat his mic when singing and as such quite often his vocals are way down in the mix. Any suggestions on a reasonably priced mic that doesn't have a pronounced proximity effect? Sub $200 would be good. We've tried telling him to get closer to his mic, but that usually works for a song or 2 at best.

projectMalamute · #2 07-30-2011, 01:01 PM

If he's not close to the mic you shouldn't be having problems with proximity effect. Just the opposite.

walterw · #3 07-30-2011, 01:23 PM

Can't fix bad technique with a different mic.

Try turning down his monitor to where he either gets up on the mic or he doesn't hear himself.

**butchblack** · #4 07-30-2011, 05:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by projectMalamute

If he's not close to the mic you shouldn't be having problems with proximity effect. Just the opposite.

The problem we have is that the proximity effect kicks in 2-3" closer then he normally is to the mic.

**butchblack** · #5 07-30-2011, 05:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by walterw

Can't fix bad technique with a different mic.

Try turning down his monitor to where he either gets up on the mic or he doesn't hear himself.

True, but he's also the band leader, so I think we're relegated to making sure he can get close enough to his mic and reminding him to get closer. Maybe it's time for one of those wireless headset mics.

Jimbob Jones · #6 07-30-2011, 05:32 PM

See if you can find an old Shure PE-25.

testing1two · #7 07-30-2011, 06:12 PM

The Heil PR35 is the very best mic I've heard in terms of proximity effect. It also has a switchable 2 stage high pass filter so you can contour the low end to the singer or to control plosives. It's around $250 and I recommend getting a "shock mount" mic clip because it's a little sensitive to handling noise but once you do that the mic absolutely kills.

staindbass · #8 07-31-2011, 06:53 AM

only omnidirectional mics have no proximity effect. all cardioids have it. best thing to do is to take bass/low end off the mic so it sounds normal when he is close to it.

JimmyM · #9 07-31-2011, 08:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by staindbass

only omnidirectional mics have no proximity effect. all cardioids have it. best thing to do is to take bass/low end off the mic so it sounds normal when he is close to it.

+1. Singers who sing far from their mics are completely irritating. You have to jack up their mics so loud that it picks up bleed from everything and makes EQing difficult at best. He needs to get on it, then EQ around his voice instead of making him adjust to another mic. It'll be same problem, different mic.

JACink · #10 07-31-2011, 08:48 AM

How about a headset mic?

(if he doesn´t like the "look" of it, it would become a good threat to help him get closer to the mic, tell him "it's either get closer or this!")

JimmyM · #11 07-31-2011, 09:01 AM

Headset mics can be more trouble to deal with than handhelds because you can't work them. They're either right up on your mouth or they're too far away. I tried it a couple times and it sucked. Having said that, Ted Nugent likes his

JustDavid · #12 07-31-2011, 09:12 AM

Sounds like a technique issue.

Or does he back off because he's worried about proximity effect?

What MIGHT help is a windscreen foam, & get him always touching the foam. Proximity effect should then be much more constant & can be EQ'ed out. Shares some of the problems that JimmyM pointed out for headset mics, but it seems like it might trade a larger problem for a smaller problem.

TimmyP · #13 07-31-2011, 04:55 PM

He's likely one of those who complains that he can't hear himself, then when you turn him up he backs off the mic more and thus still can't hear himself. Turn his monitor down and force him closer. Don't take no for an answer.

stflbn · #14 07-31-2011, 05:01 PM

EV ND767 mics have a switch for rolling off low end if wanted. They're neodymium mics and have a very clean tight low end.

EV ND757a and ND757b are older designs that are harder to find and even better IMHO.

Jazzdogg · #15 07-31-2011, 05:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JimmyM

+1. Singers who sing far from their mics are completely irritating. You have to jack up their mics so loud that it picks up bleed from everything and makes EQing difficult at best. He needs to get on it, then EQ around his voice instead of making him adjust to another mic. It'll be same problem, different mic.

+1

Might also want to verify that the singer's monitor mix has not been compressed.

ggunn · #16 07-31-2011, 06:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by butchblack

Hi

Our keyboard/accordion player tends not to eat his mic when singing and as such quite often his vocals are way down in the mix. Any suggestions on a reasonably priced mic that doesn't have a pronounced proximity effect? Sub $200 would be good. We've tried telling him to get closer to his mic, but that usually works for a song or 2 at best.

Proximity effect is an EQ, not a volume effect, and from context it appears to me to be unrelated to your problem.

All dynamic microphones tend to have a fairly high SPL threshold, meaning that they are relatively insensitive to faint sounds. This makes them good for live situations, because it makes them less prone to feedback than, say, a condenser mic, which has a lower SPL threshold. It also means that you need to be right up on them when you sing into them in a live situation.

Your singer needs to improve his microphone technique.

walterw · #17 07-31-2011, 07:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jazzdogg

Might also want to verify that the singer's monitor mix has not been compressed.

that would cause the opposite problem, the singer pushing too hard due to the sound not getting louder and blowing out his voice, as well as wanting more monitor to make up for it until it started feeding back.

hmm, could one bad idea fix another?

sneak a little compression into his monitor, so he'd naturally respond by getting up on the mic and singing louder?

MNAirHead · #18 08-01-2011, 06:00 AM

OPINION.

In this situation, When in the sound guy's seat... I'll give the singer a foam wind screen... and tell them to always be in tontact with the foam.

Unfortunately what you're asking to do will cause other (bigger and more expensive) issues

I'd only help the singer with a proximity mic if it was a zero sound (all IEM and DI) band... there are then ways to tweek the gear to solve this anohter way.

Tim

**butchblack** · #19 08-01-2011, 12:19 PM

We improved the situation last night by setting his mic on a boom stand, extending the boom all the way out and telling him he needed to get closer to the mic. Not perfect, but much better.

ggunn · #20 08-01-2011, 06:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by butchblack

We improved the situation last night by setting his mic on a boom stand, extending the boom all the way out and telling him he needed to get closer to the mic. Not perfect, but much better.

You had that poor guy trying to play accordion and sing into a mic on a straight stand? No wonder you were having problems!