Mic'ing a kickdrum

[greenboy]

I've also found that a drum that might sound nice tuned the way it is actually needs to be tuned higher (maybe as much as a fourth) when mic'd, with even tension on each peg, and that it should be damped a little more than it would be when played acoustically. Damping usually includes the inside as well as the beater spot.

Also helps to get the mic stand on foam to isolate a little better what comes up through a bad stage's floor and into the mic.

[D.A.R.K.]

Originally Posted by greenboy

I've had to make do with very little at times. Two-band channel EQ, I boost the bass way up to catch the head - and the treble quite a way up too, to catch the beater. Then I pull the channel gain/trim down far enough to compensate for the extra gain the EQ boosts are making.

With three-band channel EQ I cut the midrange a lot (how much depends on center frequency and width/Q of circuit, and then boost the low band and the treble band to the point where the curve is accentuating the deisired frequencies and minimizing the un-needed ones as much as possible, again making sure the trim is down far enough to not distort from the net gain from EQ boosting.

sounds like it's be very "metal" tone- wise.
that's a ton of eq off the bat....
i rarely remove mids, given a choice, and never add highs unless the music calls for it.
boosting the bass in that manner could easily make the feedback problem worse... especially without (ugh) gating.
i like you original idea of getting the source together...
instead of cutting mids, adding a bit of absorbent material to the inside of the kick(a small towel or t shirt) will cut down on upper mid clack and basketball tone.
for more attack i'd move the mic closer to the beater.
for more lows either drop the tuning, or move the mic away from the beater.
sometimes it's best to have the mic just outside the hole in the kick head, to cut down on odd mid frequencies and to get the most out of the front head... this will give you the full picture, but this will also cost you a bit of attack.

[greenboy]

Got your mind made up do you? Fine. But unless the kick drum sound you want is like a marching band boomy huge one, you don't need much mids. Doesn't matter what sytle you are using it for, the general process can be used regardless, with slightly less cut or boost for some and not others.

In fact what I outlined is what is happening in a lot of kick drum mics that have a tailored response - they've already removed the mids, and kept the head's main impact and the beater sound. Look up some kick mic spec sheets. What I outlined is for when you have a problem drum and a mic that's NOT tailored specifically.

[greenboy]

More insight, from http://www.peavey.com/support/techno...ncellation.cfm:

"It is not always easy to get a great sound from a kick drum; however, most people reproduce the characteristic kick drum sound established in an LA studio by New York drummer, Steve Gadd. You can hear similar kick drum tunings in most genres of music today, and the reason is very simple. It fits, and it does not step on the vocalist or rhythm instruments. The sound consists of the fundamental frequency and the second harmonic that is one octave above of course, but subsequent harmonics are suppressed. This is what the proper use of the pillow in the kick drum results in. (If you would recall the early sound of John Bonham´s kick drum sound in Led Zeppelin. It rang quite a bit, and just wasn't tight by today's standards.)

We used to have a product called the Electric Pillow, which was a kick drum conditioning filter, that employed a special filter attenuating the region where most of the ring came from. This filter can be simulated via an equalizer. If you would like to dry up and tighten a kick drum in a mix, insert an equalizer into the kick channel, roll it off below 40 Hz; boost it +4 to +6 dB at 80 Hz; and leave 100, 125, and 160 Hz flat (0 dB). Set 200 Hz to -3 dB, 250 Hz to 6 dB. Cut 315 Hz through 500 Hz completely (-12 dB). Set 800 Hz to 6 dB, and leave 1 kHz through 5 kHz flat. Then cut 6.3 kHz to 4 dB, 8 kHz to 8 dB, and cut 10 kHz, 12.5 kHz and 16 kHz all the way (-12 dB)."

[D.A.R.K.]

all that would be great, if the source was the same every time.
it's not. it is interesting to see, a great wealth to read, and definitely worth a try for sure.
and actually, my mind is quite open, and i've never turned down an idea in the 15 years i've been touring internationally as a professional foh engineer, using all the mics i can get my hands on and ears to, thank you.
i like the discussion, lots of great points in here- but have no desire to get in a pissing match or other such foolishness on an internet forum.
i think the op owes it to themselves to try everything that has been suggested in this thread (starting with the free stuff), study the info. and see what works best for them.

[greenboy]

I'm not trying to get in a pissing match, but I've had to make do a couple times with two or three bands of channel EQ, two or three minutes, and an old vocal mic. If you only have that, and you can make a crappy kick drum practically sound like one that's actually had some prep and gear put behind it, it's worth knowing for anyone who is just starting out with little gear.

[lorenk]

Originally Posted by greenboy

I've also found that a drum that might sound nice tuned the way it is actually needs to be tuned higher (maybe as much as a fourth) when mic'd, with even tension on each peg, and that it should be damped a little more than it would be when played acoustically. Damping usually includes the inside as well as the beater spot.

Also helps to get the mic stand on foam to isolate a little better what comes up through a bad stage's floor and into the mic.

+1

Solid advice, definately have to agree with everything Greenboy has said.

Personally, I'd only buy the gate if all the other techniques available (and there are a ton when it comes to drums and muting/damping them) failed. In my experience though, one of thsoe techniques will work. Just need to do some trial and error.

[Lync]

As much as it is a PIA using the Bose systems, since we do our own sound, they do rock for drums. Especially the kick. The tonematch mixer has a built-in "kick gate" which works wonders.

I agree though...to get a good kick sound amplified, you have to set it up a bit different than optimizing it for just acoustic use.