1st Gig w/ the Fretless = Horrible!!

[D K]

I got my 1st Fretless Monday -Played a gig tonight with it - Disaster!! - I could not keep my intonation straight to save my life.

For all you fretless players - any words of wisdom on how to get better other than spending a lot more time with it which is a given?

I loved the sound I just could not keep in tune

[ElMon]

Originally Posted by D K

I got my 1st Fretless Monday -Played a gig tonight with it - Disaster!! - I could not keep my intonation straight to save my life.

For all you fretless players - any words of wisdom on how to get better other than spending a lot more time with it which is a given?

I loved the sound I just could not keep in tune

When you practice a fretted bass, pay extreme care to the accuracy of your left hand positions, and the fluidity and economy of each movement. You can get away with a lot of sloppiness and hammer-ons on a fretted bass that you simply cannot with a fretless. Also, get a phrase looper, play scales on the fretted, and try to match it with the fretless.










Oh, and practice your @$$ off!

[middlebit]

Hey DK, I would recommend you practice your fretless in the same position you will be gigging in. Sounds weird, but it means if you're gonna be standing up rather than sitting down on the gig, this is also how you should practice. The reason being that you'll have less control over your (board) hand when you're standing up, plus it will be at a different angle to the board than when you're sitting down, so you might as well get used to switching between them.

Also, I would advise you to practice with backing whenever possible. Something like Band in The Box will do nicely - it will reveal any intonation problems so you can deal with them immediately.

[SmittyG]

I did my fretless stage a few years back and at the time I got some good advice from Dann Glenn (yeah, I know) on getting my intonation together: Practice your intervals. Start with your octaves, then your fifths, then thirds and minor thirds, sevenths. The idea is that you know these intervals through the hours and hours you have played them on a fretted bass and your ear will tell you when something isn't quite "right". But, otherwise, as you have already figured out, the only way to get it down is to put in the time.

[BassChuck]

Originally Posted by D K

I got my 1st Fretless Monday -Played a gig tonight with it - Disaster!! - I could not keep my intonation straight to save my life.

Well.....

I've played fretted for about 35 years now. Two years ago I decided I was going to buy a fretless. Before that I practiced and giged being very conscience of my left hand position, keeping very close to the fret and not taking my fingers too far off the fretboard, keeping real economy of motion with my LH. Then I bought a fretless and practiced with a tuner, and with my eyes closed. After about a year of working an hour an day with it, I felt ready for a gig. I took both the fretless and fretted and started with the fretless, thinking that I would change if things with bad. (BTW this was a sight reading gig, I'd never seen any of the charts before, and sight reading in tune is about the hardest thing you can do with a fretless). Things turned out OK and I even got to keep the gig, so I'm doing that every week now, but I don't bother to take the fretted.

Fretless takes a lot of work to be right in tune, and you have to keep with it. If I miss a day or two of practice, I have some make-up work to do. But for me its worth it. I feel more like a musician with a fretless in my hands.

[22pauld22]

a pretty good trick with fretless (other than locking up your fretted bass for three months) is trying to pitch in your head .. sing if you can the same note .. you do this when your playing any instrument that you actually pitch .. like brass and woodwind .. if you don't hear the note in your head you can't pitch it .. you have to do the same with the fretless if you can you have already won ..

the other great tip that has lready been metnioned is that when your playing fretted play the same way as close to the fret as you can ..

but really sing man sing
it will help your singing too ahhaha

good luck
Paul

[tkozal]

Before I played out with my fretless, I did enough rehearsals such that the band couldn't tell if I was playing fretted, or fretless...then I felt I could play out with it, and started sliding and mwaaahhhhing

[D K]

Originally Posted by tkozal

Before I played out with my fretless, I did enough rehearsals such that the band couldn't tell if I was playing fretted, or fretless...then I felt I could play out with it, and started sliding and mwaaahhhhing

Point taken - Alot of work ahead of me!!

[Brad Johnson]

The primary question to me is "why" you couldn't keep it in tune. First and foremost on a gig, you have to be able to clearly hear yourself. Could you?

[Brad Johnson]

Originally Posted by middlebit

Hey DK, I would recommend you practice your fretless in the same position you will be gigging in. Sounds weird, but it means if you're gonna be standing up rather than sitting down on the gig, this is also how you should practice. The reason being that you'll have less control over your (board) hand when you're standing up, plus it will be at a different angle to the board than when you're sitting down, so you might as well get used to switching between them.

Also, I would advise you to practice with backing whenever possible. Something like Band in The Box will do nicely - it will reveal any intonation problems so you can deal with them immediately.

I do this, with the caveat that I have the bass in the same position standing as seated. How? I always try to play with a strap.

[D K]

Originally Posted by Brad Johnson

The primary question to me is "why" you couldn't keep it in tune. First and foremost on a gig, you have to be able to clearly hear yourself. Could you?

Hey Brad,

I think keeping it in "tune" was a bad choice of words/description - This was more of an intonation problem - The tunning of the Bass was fine - After 20 years of playing I have become pretty obssesive about checking tuning

Sorry about that - I think this is about woodshed time to be honest and I am not sure that with my recording, playing and work schedule that I am going to have it - we'll see........

[Brad Johnson]

Originally Posted by D K

Hey Brad,

I think keeping it in "tune" was a bad choice of words/description - This was more of an intonation problem - The tunning of the Bass was fine - After 20 years of playing I have become pretty obssesive about checking tuning

Sorry about that - I think this is about woodshed time to be honest and I am not sure that with my recording, playing and work schedule that I am going to have it - we'll see........

I took keeping it in tune to be in reference to your intonation, so we're on the same page.

Again, could you hear yourself? Were you comfortable or were you constantly thinking "OMG, I'm playing a fretless!! "



Both of these figure prominently in getting good results live with a fretless. You need to hear yourself clearly (while of course not going overboard and drowning others out) and above all you need to relax, be comfortable. The shed time goes a long way towards reaching that comfort level.

I also believe that you have to have the pitch in your head first. You can then use that as a reference for where you should be and before long you'll practically subconciously make adjustments... if you don't nail the pitch right off the bat.

[chicagodoubler]

A couple things.

Do you play along with recordings on the fless? Try one of the easier Jaco tunes off Metheny's Bright Size Life, or even Continuum. But learn the solo, too....

Ok technique stuff.

If you don't have a lined fless, it's gonna be alot harder. If you have a different scale length on your fless, ditto.

Practice also with a synth or sequencer to sharpen up your ears to the real world of "correct" intonation.

Also, it's best to start gigging with the fless as a back up- try it just on balads and slow tunes where you can really stare at the board, and not worry about licks etc...

Plenty on Jaco's instructional video about this, as well. If any of y'all ain't got it yet, run to the store today!

[D K]

Originally Posted by Brad Johnson

I took keeping it in tune to be in reference to your intonation, so we're on the same page.

Again, could you hear yourself? Were you comfortable or were you constantly thinking "OMG, I'm playing a fretless!! "



Both of these figure prominently in getting good results live with a fretless. You need to hear yourself clearly (while of course not going overboard and drowning others out) and above all you need to relax, be comfortable. The shed time goes a long way towards reaching that comfort level.

Very good points

1). It would definitely be a stretch to say I was comfortable as this was a new Bass - so that probably does figure prominently in the equation

2). I did'nt feel the "Oh my God, I'm playing a Fretless" thing until I started noticing how frequently I was "missing" - Then - Definitely

#). Was I hearing myself well enough? I always think it could be louder but we were at a private function so I had to keep my stage volume fairly conservative - Definitely could have been a factor - Good points all

[Brad Johnson]

Understood... and even at low volume, you need to be at a certain point where you can clearly hear yourself.

What I tried to do from the beginning was to play fretless like an electric bass first. To use slides as an effect, not a correction. Nobody's 100% dead on all the time but you can definitely strive for it.

Just pick up the bass and play. Play songs you'd normally play on fretted and try not to sound like a fretless. Once you can control that, the rest is easy IME. Once you get comfortable, the fun starts. Slides, false harmonics, dissonant double stops, it opens up more ways to play bass. Enjoy.