Analyze the double thump (video)

[i like tictacs]

Can one of my good TB brethren be so kind as to tell me what I'm doing wrong/right in this video? I don't know, it seems very forced and craptastic. I'm having much difficulty with faster thumping parts, maybe you can tell me what I'm doing wrong.


It's a yousendit file, so just right click and download where it says : click here to download the file. That's all you have to do, it just download automatically, you can close your browser window after that.



http://s3.yousendit.com/d.aspx?id=3C...C822C64ED15DB1

[geoffkhan]

Yeah, I see what you mean. It's just going to take practice.

When doing fast triplets and runs, I notice my wrist barely moves -- it's more controlled by my forearm, so my wrist and fingers can remain really relaxed.

Also, in the first part of the video it appears as if you're not letting your thumb hit the string and go past the string correctly. It's almost like your hitting the string and then pausing a second and then letting your thumb go past. It should be all one fluid movement -- practice hitting the string with as little thumb contact as possible: so your thumb only brushes the string on the way down. Okay, I'm exaggerating it, but you get the idea.

Hope this helps some, but overall it looks like your slapping is coming along nicely!

[Elliott]

This is first video I've seen at Talk Bass - a great tool, 'cause now I can see what you are talking about, rather than trying to guess from the words. i wish every post had a video. Good job.

Your thump sounds real good. If you are over 21, a shot of tequila sometimes help technique!

[geoffkhan]

As a sidenote, I think the best thing about your slapping is the right/left hand sync, which is very well done. Keep up the good work!

[Mike Flynn]

Sorry this video I did is a bit dark but this is something I did about 10 months ago - it's me just wanking about with some of the double thumb stuff:

<a href=http://www.munkio.com/music/G%20Jam%20Bass%20Solo.mov>Double Thumb Slap Vid</a>

I think it's just a case of working up the three and four finger picks on one string - get your index and middle finger pops happening as well as I think you'll find this really works for more groove orientated stuff - keep practicing your scales and arpeggios and get that single string up and down stroke groove stuff working as well and you should get close. If you can try and work out some of the Flecktones tunes - playing along with those gets you into putting this stuff in context - I know it's hard but keep going and you'll get it - it's taken me the best part of ten years to really start nailing it - bear in mind Victor's been at it sine he was about 6 years old - he's almost 40 now so take a long term view of it, as well as the rest of your playing.

Good luck

[i like tictacs]

Thanks guys - and thanks munki. Like I've said in the past, you've got chops you should be proud of. I'll get another video up sometime next week so we can chart my progress :-p

[Figjam]

Originally Posted by urb_munki

Sorry this video I did is a bit dark but this is something I did about 10 months ago - it's me just wanking about with some of the double thumb stuff:

<a href=http://www.munkio.com/music/G%20Jam%20Bass%20Solo.mov>Double Thumb Slap Vid</a>

I think it's just a case of working up the three and four finger picks on one string - get your index and middle finger pops happening as well as I think you'll find this really works for more groove orientated stuff - keep practicing your scales and arpeggios and get that single string up and down stroke groove stuff working as well and you should get close. If you can try and work out some of the Flecktones tunes - playing along with those gets you into putting this stuff in context - I know it's hard but keep going and you'll get it - it's taken me the best part of ten years to really start nailing it - bear in mind Victor's been at it sine he was about 6 years old - he's almost 40 now so take a long term view of it, as well as the rest of your playing.

Good luck

Sick man.

[sargebaker]

munki, it's OFFICIAL! Your are my TB GOD!, I need to go practice, I couldn't double thump if someoen held me at gunpoint and said double thump! I have no thumb joint movement.

[geoffkhan]

Hmm... I thought in double-thumping you weren't supposed to move your thumb. I move my thumb minimally, and I find most of the motion comes from the wrist and arm.

[sargebaker]

Originally Posted by geoffkhan

Hmm... I thought in double-thumping you weren't supposed to move your thumb. I move my thumb minimally, and I find most of the motion comes from the wrist and arm.

Hrm, according to Alain Caron it's the opposite, but he'S double jointed or soemhting of the likes.

[geoffkhan]

Originally Posted by sargebaker

Hrm, according to Alain Caron it's the opposite, but he'S double jointed or soemhting of the likes.

It's important in any instrument to take the "work load" off of your fingers whenever possible and redistribute it to your wrist and arm (or even shoulder in piano).

[TOOL460002]

urb munki (or anyone else who knows)- okay- i can the tip of my thumb nail to hit 2-1 down 1 up, or hit 3-1 down 1 up 1 down, or 4-etc- but for the most part what i can do with the technique is more akin to just fast picking- or if you just hit each note 2 times- it sounds kinda like a delay kinda thing.

anyway- what you're doing is obviously some playing technique combo of double thumbing, pointer and middle finger popping and left hand hammer-ons to do something that sounds more like sweep picking or something. any pointers or ways to begin approaching the style? any songs or vidoes that are maybe an easier, simpler example of the overall technique?

also- someone somewhere said victor does a lot of quadruplets that are thumb down thumb up pointer pop middle pop. is that combo at all essential to what you're doing? i can double or triple rake up on a pop easy- but it's tough to smoothly link that to a double thumb. should i just practice more or is this not how to do it?

thank you very much for your time and help.

[rusmannx]

whoa.
that's quite a video munki.
any chance you would be interested in making some instruc. vids?
i can host them for you if you want to get something going.

seriously though.... whoa.

[Alvaro Martín Gómez A.]

I always thought that only Victor could play like that. I've listened to many double thump players, but no one gets as close to Victor's style like you, Munki. Excellent job!

[Mike Flynn]

Originally Posted by TOOL460002

urb munki (or anyone else who knows)- okay- i can the tip of my thumb nail to hit 2-1 down 1 up, or hit 3-1 down 1 up 1 down, or 4-etc- but for the most part what i can do with the technique is more akin to just fast picking- or if you just hit each note 2 times- it sounds kinda like a delay kinda thing.

anyway- what you're doing is obviously some playing technique combo of double thumbing, pointer and middle finger popping and left hand hammer-ons to do something that sounds more like sweep picking or something. any pointers or ways to begin approaching the style? any songs or vidoes that are maybe an easier, simpler example of the overall technique?

also- someone somewhere said victor does a lot of quadruplets that are thumb down thumb up pointer pop middle pop. is that combo at all essential to what you're doing? i can double or triple rake up on a pop easy- but it's tough to smoothly link that to a double thumb. should i just practice more or is this not how to do it?

thank you very much for your time and help.

Basically yes, get your thumb strokes, down then up, happening in combination with one and two finger pops, then you should have pretty much the complete right hand thing down. I was only using thumb and one pop for years, I first got the thing happening by doing the down - up thumb stroke and a single pop, and creating triplets, which is a nice effect - especially if you fret an octave on the neck - a closed octave - not an open string and the seventh fret - then move that around like a jazz guitarist, that can sound really cool - the other thing I started doing was doing this but going T - T - P - lower octave to higher ocave - then bring the thumb over to pluck three notes on the G. That creates a stream of notes all together.

In terms of bringing in the second pluck - Victor himself explained it to me - this is key to getting some of those solo groove things happening (i.e. Me & My Bass Guitar), but because I learnt this style on my own, without following any really strict method, I do a lot hammer-on combos integrated in with the thumb, pick and open, hammer, pluck style - so I can end up sounding pretty insane - but really it's all in the picking - what the left hand is doing is often very simple by comparison - it boils down to coordinating the two - which takes a while - sorry! I also have light strings and a very low action - I have tried it higher but I hate it - this style is a lot easier with a nice slick action and bright, nickel / steel strings.

I have thought about doing some instructional stuff - I am also free for lessons here in London (I have onely two students so far) but the whole video thing is a bit of a pain - I might do a few short examples at some point but I have a lot of other stuff to do first, I'll keep you all posted.

Thanks for the compliments, it's taken me years to get this stuff happening at this level, patience is a virtue is all I can say, so is a lot of practice - just go for it!

M

[Whafrodamus]

I was never really instructed in this, I just listened to it and worked it out. With the regular slap pop method, the mentality is "slap, pop, slap, etc...", With double thumping, you really have to look at bass as multiple instruments. You have a percussive thing going on along with the melody. The percussion is mainly your two popping fingers along with the up-pluck (which could also work melodically). Your thumb movement (mainly the down pluck) plays the melody of the groove. So you got to think like a drummer (So stop thinking), and think like a bassist.

[Ozzyman]

Great video Munki. It didn't have really any musicality, but you said you were just wanking so it's excusable. You have a solid slap technique (my slap sucks but I never work on slap) and your speed is fast for thumbing.
It'd be nice to hear a video of your playing when playing a real song, hehe. Munki you definately have talent

[TOOL460002]

urb munki- thanks for the starting point- huge help. trying to keep my right hand both precise and loose at the same time appears to be what i need to work at for now. and i shouldnt have cut my thumb nail so short the other day. okay- back to practice.

[Osama_Spears]

links not working

[Mike Flynn]

Originally Posted by Ozzyman

Great video Munki. It didn't have really any musicality, but you said you were just wanking so it's excusable. You have a solid slap technique (my slap sucks but I never work on slap) and your speed is fast for thumbing.
It'd be nice to hear a video of your playing when playing a real song, hehe. Munki you definately have talent

OK, sorry if some of you already heard this when I posted it in the 'Recordings' forum but here's a little more melodic double thumping MP3:

<a href=http://www.munkio.com/music/Victor/Plaintive%20Pulse2.mp3>Plasma</a>

And here's a little video of me trying to play Donna Lee using
this style to solo with - I don't like this clip, due to the crapness of my tone, (I'm running through the home stereo, cos my amp is at a friend's house) and some seriously silly over-playing, but it gives you a good idea of some of the integrated hammering on stuff I do:

<a href=http://www.munkio.com/music/Victor/Bass%20Loops.mov>Donna Lee</a>