bass line to "Planet Earth"...pick technique

[hernameisrio]

So one of my bands is covering Duran Duran's "Planet Earth" and the bass line is killing me. Obviously the notes are easy, but the picking technique is...I'm just not quite getting it. I get it, but only on everything but the A string, and then it's hard to keep up. I've obsessively watched every video I can find on YouTube of various people trying to play it (apparently I'm not alone in having trouble with this one!), of John Taylor playing it, but I feel like I'm still doing something weird/wrong and it just sounds stiff. As a guitarist, I've never gotten much into really fast picking, so maybe that's part of it and I'm just not comfortable yet? This is the only song I use a pick on and it just doesn't feel right. It's not that I can't keep up the tempo, it's more just getting that sort of galloping feel, which I think might have more to do with my fretting hand and my fingers not hammering on the strings fast enough or something. Anyone have any ideas?

[jgroh]

I did see some old video of JT showing about 3 seconds of how he played the bassline in PE. He used a pick but I have played it with my fingers as well. Maybe get some software to slow down the song without changing the pitch and just work on it at a slower pace and then increase it slowly.

[hernameisrio]

I actually have a better time of things playing with my fingers, but I want to do it "right" the way JT does. I think part of what's so maddening about it, is that I feel so ridiculous about not being able to nail such a simple bass line, and it's also sorta painful to work through it slowly. Basically I just sit in my apartment with headphones like an idiot and keep at it. I don't get how after playing for three months I was able to play the bass solo in "Rio" and yet I can't freakin get "Planet Earth"! How does THAT work?!

[dmusic148]

I just gave it a go and yeah, it's pretty hard to execute well. It's all about keeping the rest stroke clean, and never rushing.
I'm not a great pick player, but I can do it quite well with fingers. Turning up amp gain and playing lightly seems to be the ticket.

[jgroh]

Honestly if its easier with your fingers, use them. JT says in the video that he wanted to use his fingers but at the time he wasnt technically proficient enough so he had to use a pick. I dont know if he still uses a pick these days on it either (he may).

[hernameisrio]

Oh I saw that video, he said he wasn't using his fingers "at least not yet" (!!!)...so weird to think of JT first starting out, and lookit him now. <3 Anyway, I'm going to slow it down and see where that gets me. The chorus of "Hold Back The Rain" has a similar feel to it at a slower tempo, so maybe I'll try that one. I also feel like it's weird that I managed to get the bass solo in "Rio" after only a few months...it really doesn't seem THAT hard, it's just the same riff over and over. Still bad-ass though!

[jgroh]

The rhythm of the bass is 1 and A, 2 and A, 3 and A, 4 and A...sometimes its easier to count it out and play to it than play with the song (you may already know this)

[dmusic148]

Don't feel bad, 'Rio' is way easier.

[bucephylus]

That is a pretty common rhythmic figure; I call it the horse gallop. One of the challenges is that having three notes in the basic figure, it requires either a recovery or an asymmetric approach. I just take it as it comes at that tempo and live with the asymmetric strokes. One thing that helps is to avoid string crossings and take the whole line on the A string.

BTW, the Tchaikovsky William Tell Overture is the same figure but at an even higher tempo, and the has to worked out on the bow, which is quite the technical challenge to keep it clean.

At faster tempos, the trick is to choke your stroke down to the minimum motion. You can actually keep a faster tempo by eliminating the wasted motion. Keep the stroke lengths short.

That studio recording is quite masterfully played; especially the chorus part has a really nice funky feel to it. Not something I would have associated with Duran Duran. One wonders if the player was coached or somewhat ghosted by a more experienced studio cat at the time.

GL

[Skitch it!]

Originally Posted by bucephylus

That is a pretty common rhythmic figure; I call it the horse gallop. One of the challenges is that having three notes in the basic figure, it requires either a recovery or an asymmetric approach. I just take it as it comes at that tempo and live with the asymmetric strokes. One thing that helps is to avoid string crossings and take the whole line on the A string.

BTW, the Tchaikovsky William Tell Overture is the same figure but at an even higher tempo, and the has to worked out on the bow, which is quite the technical challenge to keep it clean.

At faster tempos, the trick is to choke your stroke down to the minimum motion. You can actually keep a faster tempo by eliminating the wasted motion. Keep the stroke lengths short.

That studio recording is quite masterfully played; especially the chorus part has a really nice funky feel to it. Not something I would have associated with Duran Duran. One wonders if the player was coached or somewhat ghosted by a more experienced studio cat at the time.

GL

+1

As for the coaching mentioned, there is pause for thought there actually

You could even try using the open D instead if you find that easier for yourself, experiment with the positioning a little.

[sammyp]

it's the same as an Iron Maiden gallop ...funny you should mention it i was just jamming to it with my fingers and it is pretty tough ...

the pick pattern is down - down up down/ down up down ....

3 options -

1. learn the pick style

2. the pattern with 2 fingers

3. the modern metal gallop with 3 fingers

if you can do it with your fingers you should proudly do so IMO.....

[Mekanamom]

I agree- use fingers.

JT does still use a pick on that song... Or at least he did a few days ago at a show. It's the only song he played with a pick (at the show, at least).

Quite a lot of his baselines are pretty funky; he cites Bernard Edwards as his primary influence. I just spent a chunk of time listening to Chic, and wow! I can totally see it.

[grendle]

It's a triplet gallop but the rest in it is opposite most rock stuff, interesting with the octives he throws in there. Try to start with an up stroke instead of a down stroke. It will put you with more of an "on time" feel. You can do all down strokes if your comfy with it. The standard down up down dosent feel right to me there.

[sammyp]

Originally Posted by Mekanamom

I agree- use fingers.

JT does still use a pick on that song... Or at least he did a few days ago at a show. It's the only song he played with a pick (at the show, at least).

Quite a lot of his baselines are pretty funky; he cites Bernard Edwards as his primary influence. I just spent a chunk of time listening to Chic, and wow! I can totally see it.

because of JT i'm getting into Bernard Edwards ...wow, he's got some tough stuff ...he was so deadly!

[hernameisrio]

Same here, I love Chic...I'm practicing this line both ways and am just gonna see which one comes to me first. Saving my pennies to see DD a second time later on this month. <3

[21niko21]

Originally Posted by grendle

It's a triplet gallop but the rest in it is opposite most rock stuff, interesting with the octives he throws in there. Try to start with an up stroke instead of a down stroke. It will put you with more of an "on time" feel. You can do all down strokes if your comfy with it. The standard down up down dosent feel right to me there.

I'm going to try the upstroke to start with. I've been trying to play this for a few months. I had it up to 90% speed for a bit, but never got it to 100% clean. Out of the Duran lines I've tried to play it's the hardest, and that includes Rio and Girls on Film. Although, I suck with a pick.

[grendle]

Originally Posted by 21niko21

I'm going to try the upstroke to start with. I've been trying to play this for a few months. I had it up to 90% speed for a bit, but never got it to 100% clean. Out of the Duran lines I've tried to play it's the hardest, and that includes Rio and Girls on Film. Although, I suck with a pick.

I played it the other night after reading this. Yeah imo starting with an up stroke for the gallop seems natural and puts you on an up stroke for the octives as well. Funny never really listened to DD bass lines before, there's some tough stuff in there lol, cool!

[sammyp]

Originally Posted by grendle

I played it the other night after reading this. Yeah imo starting with an up stroke for the gallop seems natural and puts you on an up stroke for the octives as well. Funny never really listened to DD bass lines before, there's some tough stuff in there lol, cool!

i am a JT freak....being a guitarist for 25 years and a practicing bass player for 1 1/2 years JT is the only real influnece i have although i've done a pile of digging into bassdom this past year ..

here are some great JT tunes to check out:

Rio
My Own Way
New Religion
Girls on Film
New Moon on Monday
Hungry Like the Wolf
A View to a Kill

[winterburn69]

I now don't feel so bad for not being able to pick up Duran Duran songs easily. It's not just me, it IS hard stuff! I can play Hungry Like the Wolf, Wild Boys and most of The Reflex. Also wanna learn Planet Earth, A View to a Kill and Girls on Film.

[nattiep]

I think he still uses a pink on Hold Back The Rain live as well.

Anyone here learn anything from Duran's new album yet? That stuff is FUN. Best album they've put out since Rio.