Choppy Sound While Playing Smooth & Fast?

[BELLATOR]

Does anyone ever notice a choppy sound when they are playing 16ths at 200bpm even when they are playing the notes consistent, smooth, and fast? I notice this on the A, D, and G strings but not on the B or E strings. I'll notice some notes on some strings sound slower and choppier than they are actually played. For example, when I play 16ths at 200bpm without an amp the notes all sound consistent and smooth. Maybe it's just an EQ issue but I also find it hard to EQ some of this sound out of the mix. If anyone has had similar issues, please feel free to share them.

[JimmyM]

What do you mean by choppy? Do you mean fret clanking?

[BELLATOR]

What I mean by choppy is it sounds like I'm playing a lot slower and more inconsistent than I actually am (with a pick).

[john turner]

post an mp3 to see what you are talking about.

16ths at 200 bpm is over 13 notes a second. if you think it sounds choppy it probably means you are not playing them consistently and cleanly.

[meev992]

Originally Posted by BELLATOR

What I mean by choppy is it sounds like I'm playing a lot slower and more inconsistent than I actually am (with a pick).

If u have problem with consistency, use a .5mm and pluck really close to the bridge

[BELLATOR]

Sorry, I can't post an mp3 because I don't have the means. What I meant by "choppy sounding" is the 16ths sound smooth, consistent, and fast without an amp or through a practice amp when I play with a pick. However, when I play through my 2X12 rig, the 16ths sound inconsistent even though the notes sound consistent when I hear the pick plucking the strings. This is not really about my technique so I guess my post is in the wrong forum. I think it's an EQ issue because the technique is fine without an amp and with a practice amp but not with my other rig.

[meev992]

if that's true, perhaps it has something to do with the speakers.

but either way, techniques have to coincide with the electronics too, so perhaps some adjustment/improvement to technique is necessary.

since u mentioned practice amp, I would guess it has something to do with speaker size.

....if the higher pitched notes are the ones that sound okay while the lower ones don't, i'd put my money on the fact that the speaker can't keep up with the low notes.

[cnltb]

...you may also not be playing quite as smooth and consistent as you think, and this is what the amp is revealing to you.
It may just be amplifying flaws which are hidden when no amp is used.
I have experienced that a number of times.
That funny noise you are describing may of course be caused by any number of other things.

[BELLATOR]

Originally Posted by meev992

....if the higher pitched notes are the ones that sound okay while the lower ones don't, i'd put my money on the fact that the speaker can't keep up with the low notes.

The lower notes on the B and E strings are all fine but when I start playing a D on the A string is where it starts getting weird. I'm using Avatar speakers right now and I'm starting to think alternative speakers may be needed

[BELLATOR]

Originally Posted by cnltb

That funny noise you are describing may of course be caused by any number of other things.

Care to discuss some of these other things?

[meev992]

Originally Posted by BELLATOR

I'm using Avatar speakers right now and I'm starting to think alternative speakers may be needed

PERFECT....

excuse to go on shopping spree, oh yes

[cnltb]

Originally Posted by BELLATOR

Care to discuss some of these other things?

When posting my answer I was thinking of the right hand mostly, but the left( fretting hand) has a lot to do with it all as well.
As john turner has stated 16th at 200bpm is VERY fast.
Your cabs may be too slow or their voice may simply a little on the muddy side(many bass cabs I have tried were part of this group),your amp may be set slightly muddy.
The distance at which the pickup beneath the strings has also an impact on the clarity of the tone.
My gues is still, , however the first I stated.
I would practise practise practise and that may just sort it out.
In what musical context are you in fact applying this 16th at 200bpm speed??

[Tenma4]

16ths at 200 bpm... I don't think my metronome even does that before 11am...

[BELLATOR]

I know 16ths at 200bpm is fast. I don't have any trouble playing them this fast or consistently all over the board. It's not my first time This thread was more about the sound I was hearing for this particular rig. I wasn't sure where to post this so I started with the "technique" thread. Anyway, I messed around with EQ and picks for about an hour or so and I think I've sorted the problem out. I used a thinner pick yesterday and the sound got much smoother. I'm not a fan of thinner picks but it helped. I usually have the EQ on the amp set flat and the EQ isn't even engaged. I use the active EQ on the bass for EQ mostly. I also know that my cabs are not the best. That will also have to be remedied. Cnltb, the musical context I am applying 16ths at 200bpm is black metal and death metal.

[Rattlehead]

Originally Posted by BELLATOR

Cnltb, the musical context I am applying 16ths at 200bpm is black metal and death metal.

Like he (or she) needed to ask!

(well it isn't unheard of in other genres, but not nearly as common)


Anyway this is the addition I'd like to make to this thread.
If I were you I would try something. Play on your practice amp normally. Then crank the high end. See if you notice any differences in how clean and consistent the sound is. If there is, then this is probably a technique issue, since you'll find that it is occuring on more than one amp. The high end really helps bring out technique flaws that you don't notice are there when EQ'ed normally. If this is the case, then cranking the highs will also help you to hear that 'inconsistency' on the lower strings too.

From my experience, playing clean 16ths at 200bpm on the higher strings was fairly easy, but the notes would lose definition on the lower strings, so I couldn't reach nearly that speed on the B without it getting real sloppy. Of course most people can't tell that it's sloppy until you crank the highs and they start hearing everything that's going on. Even I can hear the less noticeable flaws way better when playing loudly with highs cranked.

I've since entirely revamped my technique, and am nowhere close to those tempos, but my point in saying this is that maybe you're not hearing whatever it is you are hearing on the low strings because whatever it is you are hearing is in a higher frequency and not coming out on the low strings, and until you crank the highs you'll never know if the low strings are doing it too. Sounds funny but should make sense.

Of course much of what I said might be negated by the fact that you're playing with a pick - I don't really know much about playing with a pick. As far as I can tell the only 'technique' issues you can have with a pick are a) scraping sounds coming from not having the pick perpendicular to the string, b) strings plucked too hard and hitting the frets, and c) inconsistent attack power, either for all plucks or just between the up and downstrokes. So it could just be amp/EQ problems as you say.

Another thing is that higher pitched passages often sound slower than they are to me, so maybe the same is true for you. There are a lot of crazy violin pieces that I never realize are fast until I try to do them on bass and go .


Wow. I can't make a short post, even when I try. Sorry.

[meev992]

Originally Posted by BELLATOR

I used a thinner pick yesterday and the sound got much smoother. I'm not a fan of thinner picks but it helped.

I never even considered thin picks until last year, when I was watching Pick-Bassists. Their movements were indicative of using a thinner pick, so I decided to give it a go. Interestingly enough, using a thinner pick enabled me to be faster with my usual 2mm Custom printed Steve Clayton's. Definitely cleans up the sound, that's for sure...with a touch of natural dynamic control? I don't find myself getting distorted farts when I'm using a thin pick.

and just as a digression, has anyone seen/tried out the "Wedgie 1mm flex pick?" Supposedly it's thinner and more flexible where the pick tapers away from the grip side.

[BELLATOR]

Originally Posted by Rattlehead

Like he (or she) needed to ask!

NICE! \m/

When I've been playing 16ths at 200bpm, especially one note for a count of four, I've noticed the choppy sound at the D on the A string and some of the higher notes but not on the E or B strings. When I tweaked the EQ the other day, the sound diminished when I cut the low end slightly. The choppy sound I was hearing was actually a light repeated thud while picking fast. Basically, I had a touch too much low end for some notes so they weren't sounding like I wanted them to. I've tried different picks and they have really made a difference too. Tortex picks were a little bit too hard for fast picking and produced more noise than other picks. Anyway, thanks for all your input guys. A lot of your suggestions helped me get rid of that unwanted choppy thud sound.

[meev992]

Originally Posted by Tenma4

16ths at 200 bpm... I don't think my metronome even does that before 11am...

My hands are more like HAM before 11am

I don't play at my full speed until I've had my wheaties

[El Bajo]

16ths at 200!!!! it just becomes one continous tone like so ____________________________________!!!!

[nemo]

Originally Posted by john turner

16ths at 200 bpm is over 13 notes a second.

The E and B fundamental sound is in range about 32-50 Hz. YOU play with 13 Hz frequency - doesn't it make for some sort of frequency interference problem? Just purely unscientific guess..