Does this mean Hammer on?

hdracer · #1 06-15-2010, 09:20 PM

I am trying to figure out this song and I am not sure what this means. I circled the area I am talking about. Do I hold the B & hammer on the C# then strike the C#? The song sounds like it is hammered on but not struck. I keep losing my beat count.

jordie65 · #2 06-15-2010, 09:24 PM

i believe its a grace note

JimmyM · #3 06-16-2010, 01:47 AM

a grace note is more of a quick slide than a hammer-on.

Jazz Ad · #4 06-16-2010, 01:52 AM

No hammer here. Fret the B and slide to C# while striking the note. You must hear the B but very shortly.

somegeezer · #5 06-16-2010, 02:10 AM

Very short slide. Also... Why do people actually write in that key? It's insanity.

James Judson · #6 06-16-2010, 02:17 AM

The U shaped symbol tells you to play the two notes as one. In five line staff I'm not sure what tells you to hammer on a note but this could be a hammer on. I would be more inclined to slide between the two notes.

I would read this as 1). play a B 2). then play B sliding to a C#.

I'm confused as to why this piece is written in the Key of C# with 7 sharps and why not Db with 5 flats.

Also in the Key of C# the B is sharped as well but the notation says to play B natural and of course the B stays natural thoughout the rest of the measure.

Just a couple observations that maybe a sight reader better than me can clear up.

JimmyM · #7 06-16-2010, 03:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by James Judson

The U shaped symbol tells you to play the two notes as one. In five line staff I'm not sure what tells you to hammer on a note but this could be a hammer on. I would be more inclined to slide between the two notes.

the slide is correct. the hammer on could be correct, but pretty much everyone does a slide and that is more correct than a hammer.

Quote:

I'm confused as to why this piece is written in the Key of C# with 7 sharps and why not Db with 5 flats.

the best thing you can do is not even worry about it. simply deal with it as written. i do agree that Db is a less unwieldy key to use than C# imho, but this piece is written in C# so you can either rewrite it completely or you can deal.

Quote:

Also in the Key of C# the B is sharped as well but the notation says to play B natural and of course the B stays natural thoughout the rest of the measure.

Just a couple observations that maybe a sight reader better than me can clear up.

well the first thing we need to clear up is your use of the term "sight reader" when "reader" is more appropriate. sight reading is playing through a chart for the first time. anything else is known simply as "reading."

Chris K · #8 06-16-2010, 03:41 AM

IMHO it's neither hammer nor slide. It's a grace note known as acciacatura. Since there's a bow, it should be played as a bow, implying (IMHO again) fingering with two fingers. For a slide, mostly a slash-like sign ( / ) is seen between grace note and principal note. Those should be played with one finger.

Another important issue is wether the grace note is to be played ON the beat or right BEFORE it, landing on the beat with the principal note. The choice here is style-dependent, even within the area of classical music.

Disclaimer: for certain instruments/styles the meaning of musical signs may differ.

JimmyM · #9 06-16-2010, 03:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris K

IMHO it's neither hammer nor slide. It's a grace note known as acciacatura. Since there's a bow, it should be played as a bow, implying (IMHO again) fingering with two fingers. For a slide, mostly a slash-like sign ( / ) is seen between grace note and principal note. Those should be played with one finger.

Another important issue is wether the grace note is to be played ON the beat or right BEFORE it, landing on the beat with the principal note. The choice here is style-dependent, even within the area of classical music.

Disclaimer: for certain instruments/styles the meaning of musical signs may differ.

exactly. i would buy into your argument if it was a piano. but let's face it...it's not going to work on bass as it does on piano.

Chris K · #10 06-16-2010, 04:10 AM

It's general notation and it also works for bass, provided you finger it in the 'correct' way. A trained ear will hear the difference between a bow and a slide.

Only now it occurs to me that some 'hammering' IS involved (hence perhaps the confusion of the OP), since you are to pluck or pick the grace note with your right hand. fingering the grace note with one finger, and hammer the principal note with the next finger.

Baron Von Vik · #11 06-16-2010, 04:12 AM

I'm sure there's a tab for that song somewhere. Should do the trick.

JimmyM · #12 06-16-2010, 04:23 AM

tab...bah!

anyway, with all due respect, chris...if i see something like that on a sheet of music, i'm sliding.

hdracer · #13 06-16-2010, 08:35 AM

Thanks for all the input. I am trying to learn things the "proper" way. As it was written. I find it is the best way to learn technique's that I may not be very good at & to improve my reading. If I use a slide it only sounds right on my frettless. Perhaps I need to work on my fretted slides. The song is in 4/4 time. As far as beat count would it be 1 B-C#, 2 rest, & F#,3 G#, & B, 4 rest, & B ? Using a hammer on sounds good on my fretted Jazz.
Here is the song, This part is played during the verse, "Hard luck & trouble....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=umh83nDbawA

Chris K · #14 06-16-2010, 09:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JimmyM

tab...bah!

anyway, with all due respect, chris...if i see something like that on a sheet of music, i'm sliding.

As long as you don't slide on your DB acrobatics, it's fine with me.

Leftybass12 · #15 06-16-2010, 09:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hdracer

I am trying to figure out this song and I am not sure what this means. I circled the area I am talking about. Do I hold the B & hammer on the C# then strike the C#? The song sounds like it is hammered on but not struck. I keep losing my beat count.

It's a grace note

hdracer · #16 06-16-2010, 11:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Leftybass12

It's a grace note

Am I correct in thinking a grace note can be played using a slide or hammer on or pull off?

Bassguy87564 · #17 06-16-2010, 11:31 AM

I would say yeah but just don't make it to (here is my new word) slidey. A grace note is meant to be a very quick note and im sorry JimmyM would give very good advise in all the post I read but im going to have to agree with ChrisK here but I think that might just be cause I do DB as well. With the music that hdracer put up i would say a hammer on is more fitting. If you look at the notes around the highlighted area if you slide it will take you out of position for the f#. To tell you the true it really doesn't matter what I just said thats just my personal input on how I would look at it if I was sight reading but it just depends on the sound you like most in that section. If you want to get it just like the original get the original recording and check out what the bass is doing at that part and try to match his tone and style.

hdracer · #18 06-16-2010, 11:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bassguy87564

I would say yeah but just don't make it to (here is my new word) slidey. A grace note is meant to be a very quick note and im sorry JimmyM would give very good advise in all the post I read but im going to have to agree with ChrisK here but I think that might just be cause I do DB as well. With the music that hdracer put up i would say a hammer on is more fitting. If you look at the notes around the highlighted area if you slide it will take you out of position for the f#. To tell you the true it really doesn't matter what I just said thats just my personal input on how I would look at it if I was sight reading but it just depends on the sound you like most in that section. If you want to get it just like the original get the original recording and check out what the bass is doing at that part and try to match his tone and style.

That is my thought, a slide would take you out of position for the next note, although this song is played slow 98 bpm and it can be done. I posted a link to the song so you can hear it in post #13

m_bisson · #19 06-16-2010, 01:09 PM

I was always taught that grace notes are accented separately from the main note. You should hear both notes one after the other, but they are so close together that there is no easy way to write it using normal notation.
Think of the pink panther theme... that could be written using grace notes.

somegeezer · #20 06-16-2010, 09:15 PM

I think a hammer-on would imply 2 seperate notes though, where the tie actually makes them into 1 note. To me, that says slide. Also, it shouldn't matter if it is fretted or fretless, seeing as it should be fast enough to not hear any note between the 2 in the first place. In other words, it should sound fretted even on a fretless, if that makes sense.