Does the pocket come before the groove? or are they the same thing?

JAUQO III-X · #1 09-14-2007, 09:06 PM

Is there really a difference?

blankstare77 · #2 09-14-2007, 09:38 PM

I believe that they are mutual in many respects.

You can't have a solid groove without being in the pocket.

Conversely, you can't REALLY be in the pocket without having a solid groove.

It comes down to a semantic discussion, unfortunately. What do you consider a groove and what do you consider the pocket?

Mike Money · #3 09-14-2007, 09:40 PM

I always understood the pocket to be after the beat.

Its soooooooooooo far after... but its so close... its hard to explain.

The best line I can think to describe it is P-Funk by parliament.

The line is so far off on the down beats, yet its so on.

DWBass · #4 09-14-2007, 09:57 PM

I liken them to be the same. Without the pocket, you can't hold no groove! Hmmm........where have I heard that before?? My philosophy.........find the pocket and the groove will surely follow!

BillytheBassist · #5 09-14-2007, 10:00 PM

For me, the pocket is a space to put a groove. Pocket first... then the groove.

DWBass · #6 09-14-2007, 10:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BillytheBassist

For me, the pocket is a space to put a groove. Pocket first... then the groove.

Word to your....................

Matt Dean · #7 09-14-2007, 10:24 PM

To groove is to play in the pocket through time... the deeper the pocket the deeper the groove. I think I'm say'n the same thing as Billy...

JimmyM · #8 09-14-2007, 11:36 PM

This thread makes my brain hurt. I've never really thought about it. I just want the check to clear

Deacon_Blues · #9 09-15-2007, 02:58 AM

I also agree with Billy on this.

905 · #10 09-15-2007, 03:54 AM

Did the chicken come first, or the egg?

Or are they the same thing?

To me, when a player is holding a groove, they're in the pocket.
Conversely, when a player is in the pocket, they're holding a groove.

phat daddy · #11 09-15-2007, 04:04 AM

So far I like the way 905 has put it best. To me holding a pocket is in equivalence with holding a groove, even though the grammatical definitions aren't the exact same. Pocket and groove symbiotically coexist.

PocketGroove82 · #12 09-15-2007, 04:13 AM

Call me an idiot...but I've played in the pocket and felt the groove while playing with the Guitar Hero game.

...semantics are a !@#$%

Kalyptic · #13 09-15-2007, 04:54 AM

"Yo Victor, whatsever you do i want you to remember this here.You cant hold no groove if u aint got no pocket" Oh and the egg came first

John Wentzien · #14 09-15-2007, 04:56 AM

I used to be in a band named "Pocket",and it grooved hard!
When the drummer and I were deep in the pocket groovin', we used to call it "diggin' the trench".

user101 · #15 09-15-2007, 06:30 AM

whats a pocket?

Audiophage · #16 09-15-2007, 07:29 AM

Thats the new thing for pants, pockets with grooves. They'd hold my wallet much better.

JAUQO III-X · #17 09-15-2007, 07:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JimmyM

I just want the check to clear

thumpbass1 · #18 09-15-2007, 08:45 AM

This is a great question! Is there a difference between the
pocket and the groove or are they two different parts of
a whole? The question stretches ones thoughts as if they
were confronted with some arcane theolgical or philosophical
debate.
My advice is to get thee to a drummer who has a zen like
mastery of the groove and pocket and play with them as
much as possible. I'm greatful that I did get to play and
practice with some very good drummers who did understand
the groove to where it was an instinct for them.
You won't learn groove from just jamming with digital drum
beats or a metronome as useful as these tools can be.It's
the human element that makes the whole 'feel' of the groove-
pocket come together as you develop the instincts to know
how to approch how you come in the beats.
Great question to ponder.

martyman5000 · #19 09-15-2007, 08:55 AM

I went to an audition and the drummer said "I've never played with a "In the pocket bassist"...I still have no idea what he meant

is it being able to get into a groove?

markjazzbassist · #20 09-15-2007, 10:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blankstare77

I believe that they are mutual in many respects.

You can't have a solid groove without being in the pocket.

Conversely, you can't REALLY be in the pocket without having a solid groove.

It comes down to a semantic discussion, unfortunately. What do you consider a groove and what do you consider the pocket?

+1

i was going to say the exact same thing. they are definately dependent on each other.

all i gotta say is that when i find that pocket, all i wanna do is get all up in it. i wanna sleep there, i wanna eat dinner in the pocket, i wanna get down with my lady in the pocket.

i just love that pocket man, never wanna leave.