Fretting hand dexterity - Page 2

callmeMrThumbs · #21 05-01-2006, 08:16 AM

Well...I don't know how much I'll help, but...take it for what it's worth.

The two biggest things I saw, were your pinky and your thumb - obviously the strongest and weekest fingers on your hand. Your pinky has a very common problem, which is to spring back and curl up while it isn't fretting. Try and keep your pinky steady, straight and close to the fingerboard. That'll help keep your fingers where they need to be for the next note (don't expect your pinky to fix itself...trust me, it won't). Your thumb seems to want to drift of to your left...away from the hand. If you could keep it directly underneath the center of the palm, you'll get more strength between all fingers (not just the index, which you seem to be focusing on now). It'll also help keep your knuckles parallel to the fingerboard and your fingers perpendicular to it...making one happy technique.

I skipped over a few things I saw, but you should have enough to work on now.

Guys, what else did I miss?

Doesn't look too bad, though...keep practicing!

-Josh

MichaelScott · #22 05-01-2006, 12:50 PM

Yeah I agree with CallmeMrThumbs- Your thumb and your pinky are the problems.

Your thumb should be positioned on your neck opposite of your middle finger- yours is opposite your pointer finger. Putting your thumb there denys your pinky strength of the hand and it makes it really comfotable to lift you pinky and ring fingers way off the boardd and curl. Putting your thumb in the right place will give your hand more power and also help your hand maintain it's proper position.

Your pinky keeps lifting off of the finger board and curling. Try to keep it down so that it floats only a few cm off of the finger board. You really have to concentrate on this or it won't happen.

Try repeating the F,F#,G,G#,C lick with your hand in the correct position and your pinky floating above the strings. Play it really slow, don't worry about speed just worry about proper placement of your thumb, pinky, and fretting.

Pinky placement is something that most bass players struggle with- If you can afford to the best way to become a great player is to get private lessons. If you can't afford it pick up the book "Bass fitness" it has tons of chromatic exercises that stress pinky strength- but it is just a book so it can't really help you out with placement that much.

Bassist4Life · #23 05-01-2006, 09:34 PM

These are a couple images from Adam Nitti's website. They demonstrate good left hand position.

I agree with the other posts that your left thumb position is making it hard for your pinky to do its job. Also, your pinky does stray away from the fingerboard a little bit.

Something else I noticed (and it's a little difficult to fully see) is how you have your left wrist bent. It looks a little bit like this:

This creates tension. Tension is bad.

Check out Adam's website. Good stuff.
http://www.adamnitti.com/bass_player_03.shtml

Good luck. Keep us posted on your progress.

Joe

Bassist4Life · #24 05-01-2006, 09:45 PM

After watching your video a few more times, I think that you might be able to come up with a better fingering solution. Shifting to your pinky on the A string seems a little unstable. Establish a new position so the D is part of it. Since you are focusing on your thumb, you may already be working on a new fingering for your new and improved technique.

When you play the ascending R-5-Octave patterns, you could try the following:
Root=1st finger
5th=3rd finger
Octave=pinky (instead of your 3rd finger)

Give it a shot.

Joe

PS. I'm impressed at how fast you came out with a video of your playing for us. Way to go!

KuMBye YamALaWd · #25 05-01-2006, 10:19 PM

Spikeh;

I agree with Bassist4Life about the "better fingering solution";
It looks to me like getting your 3rd (ring) finger to the "C" on the A string isn't actually the problem;

I think the problem comes AFTER you've gotten your 3rd finger on the C --> you're back at the beginning of the pattern with your 4th (pinky) finger on the "D" (5th fret of A string)...

...so you're 3rd finger has just played C (on the A string) and your 4th finger goes to D (on the A string)...

..THERE's the problem! you're trying to move quickly between the 3rd & 5th fret, using your 3rd & 4th fingers >>> which is requiring a 1-fret position shift - there's not much space to stretch between your ring finger and pinky!

Perhaps you could try putting the position shift in earlier;
I would suggest playing the last "1234" pattern with a shift up on fret after the FIRST note (1st fret E-string)

...so you'd be playing BOTH the first & second frets with your 1st (index) finger;

Yes, that makes it more difficult to play those first 2 notes, but it lands you in a much better position to play the
G#->C ->D (ie. your 3rd, 2nd and 4th fingers)

Either that or grow an extra finger (extra thumbs don't count)

Spikeh · #26 05-02-2006, 01:34 PM

I love you guys

Fiddling around with your suggestions now and going on that site. Changing my wrist position is a little difficult, but I'm sure it'll pay off... I'll keep you posted (and probably post a new video soon).

Spikeh · #27 05-02-2006, 01:48 PM

Hmmm... I'm immediately noticince the following:

* My arm is tensing right up
* My thumb seems waaaaay too long to position my hands like in this position:

Especially when I'm on the E string... I seem to have to bend my thumb when I'm up there, to keep all my fingers on the fretboard.

I'll keep trying... give me a day or so and I'll try to get a vid up again.

steve66 · #28 05-02-2006, 05:22 PM

i see a problem with the fingering on the E string. You can benefit from pivoting.

A --5-5-55-5------------3-3-----3--
E -----------44332211111---1234----

Fingering 4 4 44 4 332211111113 311234

Keep Thumb between 1and 2nd fret and pivot to the D with your pinky

Jay Terrien · #29 05-02-2006, 06:06 PM

It's unfair to compare your hands to Adam Nitti's. At birth, "adamantium" was installed in both of his arms, rendering him AWESOME in any given situation. Except, being around a large magnet or an MRI tunnel.

http://www.shadowsofnamek.com/forum/...d.php?p=496656

Let me ask you this, have you experienced any true IMMEDIATE pain or tension while playing thus far?

Keep in mind that there are many types/shapes of necks out there. Some might be great for your body type, some may not. Try everything and find the right piece of gear that fits your body, your musical pursuits, your budget, and your "look" (kidding). There's a reason why I look so awesome when I play a BC Rich Warlock........ LOL!

Lastly, go to Adam's site for sure!!! I highly recommend his teaching philosophy and unique perspective.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bassist4Life

These are a couple images from Adam Nitti's website. They demonstrate good left hand position.

I agree with the other posts that your left thumb position is making it hard for your pinky to do its job. Also, your pinky does stray away from the fingerboard a little bit.

Something else I noticed (and it's a little difficult to fully see) is how you have your left wrist bent. It looks a little bit like this:

This creates tension. Tension is bad.

Check out Adam's website. Good stuff.
http://www.adamnitti.com/bass_player_03.shtml

Good luck. Keep us posted on your progress.

Joe

MichaelScott · #30 05-02-2006, 07:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spikeh

Hmmm... I'm immediately noticince the following:

* My arm is tensing right up
* My thumb seems waaaaay too long to position my hands like in this position:

Maybe you would feel more comfortable with a thicker neck?

Visit your local music shop and try some P- Basses to see if your had is more comfortable with more wood under it.

steve66 · #31 05-02-2006, 08:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by steve66

i see a problem with the fingering on the E string. You can benefit from pivoting.

A --5-5-55-5------------3-3-----5--
E -----------44332211111---1234----

Fingering 4 4 44 4 332211111113 311234

Keep Thumb between 1and 2nd fret and pivot to the D with your pinky

I just got done playing the riff with the above fingering. I would suggest that the left fret hand 11234 ,should use right hand fingering as follows: F, F# both notes with the first finger, G second finger, G# first finger, D second finger..

callmeMrThumbs · #32 05-02-2006, 08:46 PM

What's that saying... "You can catch a boy a fish and he'll be full for a day. You can teach a boy how to fish and he'll never go hungry." ...My point is we've got two different topics here. We're discussing proper hand position and on the other hand we're talking about fingering positions for a particular lick. To me, those are just notes on a page that could be played ten different ways by ten different bassists. I think we just need to emphasise proper playing position so that he can play what he wants to play without hurting himself.

Anyway, I watched your video a half-dozen more times and I learned the part and played around with it a little bit...came up with a cool melody and harmonies...I've obviously never heard the song before. Where was I...OH! I was wondering if you have a hitch-hiker's thumb at all (mine's as bad as Jaco's...hence the name "Mr. Thumbs). If you do, that'll help...um..."shorten" your thumb up a bit to help straighten out your wrist. If you don't, then you'll probably end up having to do something with your arm...most likely pulling it further back. Also, make sure you take care of those octaves like Bassist4Life mentioned. Your pinky (when it gets stronger) will be much more convenient and effective than your pesky ring finger (by the way, how do you even play it like that!!!). Okay...I'm done talking now. Gotta go practice.

-Josh

Spikeh · #33 05-03-2006, 05:01 AM

My thumb is perfectly straight... not bent in the slightest... I don't know a single person who's got a thumb like mine, or hands as big as mine either... they're huge!

Thanks for all the suggestions - but I think MrThumbs is right... there are a million ways to play it, but I need to get my hand's position right. I DID find it easier and it felt less stressfull when I played with my wrist straighter... it was also easier to control my pinky. I REALLY concentrated last night to keep my pinky near the fretboard, but it still flew off in random directions depending what I was doing.

I'll try to get a video online tonight and show you the size of my hands / my thumb too. All of your advice has helped me a lot so far, I just need to keep practicing. It's good to have someone point out what I'm doing wrong and give me some good constructive critisizm. THAT'S why I like this board so much

Spikeh · #34 05-03-2006, 05:04 AM

We're in the middle of recording the song too... so when we have the full version online I'll post the link

It's one of those epic full on rock songs with a 10 bar solo, heh. I love playing it... makes me rock so hard

Spikeh · #35 05-03-2006, 11:15 AM

Here you go... this is my "progress" if you can call it that. Notice my pinky when I don't need to use it... still flailing around even though I'm trying not to!

Also notice my wrist position... feels better. Also, the way I'm playing the riff... (3rd finger plays the 3rd and 4th fret of the E on the way back up the neck).

Any more pointers? I'm gonna keep trying to improve... also brought my strap a little further up.
http://spikeh.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/f...-D/jamming.wmv

callmeMrThumbs · #36 05-03-2006, 06:42 PM

Sweet. Long ways to go, but you can only get to Mecca by walking on your knees

Seriously though...don't get frustrated; good technique doesn't just come to you over night. Heck...I'm still working on mine! Keep praciticing, and don't give up!

-Josh

PS. By the way, your right hand must be pretty good because you're getting a nice punchy sound and your time is GREAT!

Spikeh · #37 05-04-2006, 02:21 AM

I'm comfortable with my right hand technique at the moment - nothing hurts and I don't feel limited right now (with speed or reach etc). I'm sure that'll change as I get faster / busier though.

I rest my thumb on my neck pickup (sometimes move to the bridge if I want a deeper sound) and use 2 (sometimes 3) fingers to pluck with - want to get that to 3 / 4 constantly, but at the moment it's onyl LIMITING how fast / accurate I can play when I try! Got some nice calluses building up too(after a few weeks of constant blisters a few months back!).

My slap / popping needs some work, but that's getting better as the days go on... I've only been playing properly for a year!