G Major Vamp Situation

[Thunderthumbs73]

I'm playing a mid/up tempo song with rock drum patterns. When there is the breakdown section, everyone drops out but the bass (me) and drums. Then we do this G major vamp/funk thing.

I can't say that I find vamps on one chord too interesting, but I'm thinking about ways to approach it to make it sound better.

I've been doing this funk thing, ala Mark King/Level 42, but that isn't holding my attention too much. I also throw in a quote (or three) from a famous bass line (Owner of a Lonely Heart) or some other rather famous bass line but played in G.

I tend to feel that since the drummer is playing this basic rock part, I need to keep emphasizing the lowest G on the E string. I've been thinking about doing something like a upper register solo section with a scan vocal solo at the same time, ala Oteil Burbridge, but still I feel tied to G major, and that low G.

Should I give up keeping the solo as a vamp strictly in G Major, and just build something around a different set of changes? Should I ask to change the solo format, and ask to solo through the changes like other instrumentalists have the opportunity to do on other songs in the set?

I do a bit of taping/two-hand stuff, but still am reluctant to not keep the whole proceedings tied to that low G, especially as the drummer never lets go of that funk/rock beat.

The other part of it is the "entertainment" value- I know people love to see the bass guy (sometimes) go crazy and do all that gee-wiz slappy stuff, and I enjoy that too, but to a point. The audience would prefer the slappity-slappity to "Giant Steps" and of course it seems to me, the drums would have to be very different, and swing- which is very different than the funk/rock groove established, and that which we come back to after my solo/vamp thing.

I find in terms of soloing, I'd probably solo over a set of changes and something with some musical meat which I can grab on to, or react to, as opposed to a comparatively blank musical canvas of a G (major) vamp.

Just some thoughts.

I think I'm a decent player, and I have lots of experience playing funky stuff (know most of that level 42 stuff very well) and jazz/improv., but I'm always leaving that section feeling less than pleased with what I've done.

Are there good and diverse players out there who get a bit of cold feet with a vamp section, even though that may theoretically or potentially be an open canvas, and the one moment in a show where they have to step out?

I know there's lots of thoughts here. Thanks for wading through it.

Thanks.

[MarkTAW]

Can't you play over changes that you define? Or have the guitar player do a Steve Cropper-esque hit at the top of each bar.

As soon as you play a root and a fifth you've defined yourself as being in a new chord.

Also, remember that the solo is your opportunity to show every girl in the audience that YOU are the reason they're shaking their booty, so "whatsever I play, it's gots to be funky."

[Thunderthumbs73]

Originally Posted by MarkTAW

Can't you play over changes that you define? Or have the guitar player do a Steve Cropper-esque hit at the top of each bar.

As soon as you play a root and a fifth you've defined yourself as being in a new chord.

Also, remember that the solo is your opportunity to show every girl in the audience that YOU are the reason they're shaking their booty, so "whatsever I play, it's gots to be funky."

Sure, I can play over changes I define. I don't need another instrument to quietly pad the chord for me, though that is sometimes nice as it helps things from seeming so empty without having to overplay so much to fill the space left by the band that dropped out. It is hard to describe the situation, especially as it's an original song.

I suppose I need to narrow it down to whether or not people vamp on one chord for like 5 minutes. Or not. And why? Or why not?

I think a solo can be for a lot of different reasons. Booty duty can be one of them, but at least IMO, not the only possibility or rationale for soloing, and jazz players come to mind, LaFaro, for instance.

Your last paragraph speaks to being funky, which implies, in my mind, an approach which is much more in line with "rhythm guy" doing slap bass stuff, than something more melodic. I think of it as if I have to keep the booty shaking during my own solo, then I'd better not try to legitimately outline and play through changes and melodies for "Giant Steps" as that would very likely be a groove killer. It seems the need to keep a vamp in G would be your ultimate position.

Would you dissagree?

I guess I feel like my solos in this section are flashy licks pasted together in various ways, if reasonably competently and seamlessly. I am on the fence if this particular vamp section could or should be a place where I should try to advance the ball and make more real MUSIC out of it with something more akin to a good sax solo, and that kind of lyricism.

Sorry if I seem to be challenging you. I'm not. It's a hard question to answer, IMO, and I'm just trying to get to that answer, somehow.

[MarkTAW]

People generally don't vamp on a single chord for 5 minutes because a single chord doesn't have enough tension & release to keep the audience interested for 5 minutes (and wow 5 minutes? Out of a ~40 minute set? That's not a vamp that's a song).

Challenge yourself, see how far from G you can get - convincingly get into G# - and then find a way back. Jerry Garcia, who played hundreds of shows a year, would challenge himself and keep things interesting by playing little games like only playing quarter notes (no eighth notes) for one set, or only playing in thirds and so on.

It really sounds like you need some sort of structure and you're at a bit of a loss for structure. Plan certain destinations within your vamp to keep it moving and improvise between them.

[Thunderthumbs73]

Originally Posted by MarkTAW

People generally don't vamp on a single chord for 5 minutes because a single chord doesn't have enough tension & release to keep the audience interested for 5 minutes (and wow 5 minutes? Out of a ~40 minute set? That's not a vamp that's a song).

Challenge yourself, see how far from G you can get - convincingly get into G# - and then find a way back. Jerry Garcia, who played hundreds of shows a year, would challenge himself and keep things interesting by playing little games like only playing quarter notes (no eighth notes) for one set, or only playing in thirds and so on.

It really sounds like you need some sort of structure and you're at a bit of a loss for structure. Plan certain destinations within your vamp to keep it moving and improvise between them.

Thanks man. Despite appearances, I DO appreciate your thoughts. Yeah, I think you hit the nail on the head. Tension. The drums are barrelling along, and the other members get up and grab a drink while I'm doing my thing.

On one hand, I appreciate the time, and the confidence that I can and do fill it, and not fall completely on my arse. On the other hand, I tend to feel the more chords that can be used, the better, and I am capable of, and have done much more rewarding solos, albeit in a different environment.

You know what, I might just see if I can throw the changes to Bruce Hornsby's "The Way It Is" in there. They're both in G, and I know the chords, and the melody, the piano part, and that may be able to take me some place satisfactory.

This whole thing does make me come to an interesting point: Perhaps bass players have it real good. Bass players can play funky bass lines and also melodic solos, but you'll likely not find trumpet or sax players quoting or mimicing funky bass lines.

Regarding finding structure- much like a composer, I DO find a blank page rather scary sometimes, despite its greatest potential.