Good chops, not enough rhythm

[Masterbasser71]

From what I'm told, and I feel very ashamed to admit it especially as a bassist is that my chops are in good shape. I can do all those fancy tricks like funk slap, tapping, and three-finger playing. Bass soloing. Unfortunately I have been told by superiors that I'm a good player and all, but its obvious that I'm lacking rhythm and timing. Is this unheard of? Is this horrible if you're a bass player. What would you guys do to help me "feel" the music. To gain rhythm, to be able to play with the drums. Etc etc.
4 years of playing and I'm not very good with rhythm, yeah there's something wrong with me. HELP!

[ImaStupidBaby]

play simple. always keep in mind its not WHAT you play its what you DON'T play. lock in with those drums. don't worry about the fancy tricks, worry about what that kick drum is doing.

[Crazyeelboy]

Masterbass71 - this is a common but critical problem. Rhythm and timing are essential parts of effective bass playing (bassism?). The good part is that you can fix it.

Here is some friendly advice:

1) Go minimal. Cut out the clutter and for now, stick to the very basic elements of your bass parts. Focus on the timing of the basic elements only.

2) Listen. Listen closely to any music you hear to see how the timing of the instruments is coordinated. Expand your horizons to listen to many types of music and focus on how the timing and rhythm is different.

3) Play with others. Play with other musicians as much as possible and focus on coorindating your timing with them.

4) Take up reggae. Reggae bass parts are minimal on notes and maximum on rhythm. Try playing some reggae songs and you will quickly feel the power of timing - you get the timing wrong and it all falls apart.

5) Take lessons if you need to.

[Masterbasser71]

thanks a lot you guys.

[JimK]

Originally Posted by Masterbasser71

...but its obvious that I'm lacking rhythm and timing. Is this unheard of? Is this horrible if you're a bass player. What would you guys do to help me "feel" the music. To gain rhythm, to be able to play with the drums.

It's not unheard of...I've heard many guys with great "Music Store/NAMM Show" chops that couldn't cut it in a band environment.
I would get a couple of decent drum books & learn what is expected from a drummer....where the kick & snare might be typically played in a wide variety of styles/genres. Maybe hook up with a good drummer that is versed enough to teach you a few things.
You (& me both) need to work on internalizing "the time". In other words, don't do as I did for many, many years...I depended on the drummer to keep me in-place. I had a rude awakening when I played with a guy who was skilled enough to move things around within the bar or who could go polyrhythmic at any given time(in short, "1" became almost impossible to find).

Originally Posted by Masterbasser71

4 years of playing and I'm not very good with rhythm, yeah there's something wrong with me.

Four years is not really that long a time...face it, a few are born with great time, most need to constantly stay on it.

[SBassman]

Originally Posted by Crazyeelboy

4) Take up reggae. Reggae bass parts are minimal on notes and maximum on rhythm. Try playing some reggae songs and you will quickly feel the power of timing - you get the timing wrong and it all falls apart.

Excellent suggestion.

[SBassman]

And,

Don't forget about practicing with a metronome or drum machine. Some will tell you that it's better to just practice with People, but really, it's Best to do practice time both with People and the Drum Machine.

You can't lock with a drummer if you can't lock with a drum machine. Spend time with it daily, and in some time, you're going to feel and hear the improvement.

[bassybill]

Some very good advice already in this thread.

A good way to work on this is to play along with records that are powerful rhythm wise, yet simple, and you really focus on playing everything ABSOLUTELY on the money. Examples - Don't Stop 'Til You Get Enough, or Wanna Be Startin' Something by Michael Jackson. Repetitive riffs that lock in totally solid with the beat; if it's just slightly off, the whole effect is just lost somehow. Put your CD on repeat with the 2nd of these tracks and play along with it for half an hour or so. After a bit of this, you'll just start to feel when you're spot on, or even microscopically out. It's hard to put into words, but you'll know the difference when it happens. Then you work on translating that solidity to your own playing.

It's almost a "state of mind " type thing. Sometimes when I'm playing with a band I just sense that it isn't really "happening". I try to focus and psych myself for a second and really listen to the drummer and hey presto, the groove's back! Best of luck, hope this is useful for you.

[terrelli721]

Originally Posted by Masterbasser71

From what I'm told, and I feel very ashamed to admit it especially as a bassist is that my chops are in good shape. I can do all those fancy tricks like funk slap, tapping, and three-finger playing. Bass soloing. Unfortunately I have been told by superiors that I'm a good player and all, but its obvious that I'm lacking rhythm and timing. Is this unheard of? Is this horrible if you're a bass player. What would you guys do to help me "feel" the music. To gain rhythm, to be able to play with the drums. Etc etc.
4 years of playing and I'm not very good with rhythm, yeah there's something wrong with me. HELP!

Hey we all have that problem even now so don't feel bad. I'ts great that you can do some of the nice extra things but the rythmn is the place to be. I strongly recommend listening and playing to some of the most effective but basic bass lines you can. Here's a few mandatory one's that you should be able to play. Fleetwood Mac "Dreamers", anything by the Meters, James Brown "Payback", The Brand New Heavies "Brother,Sister". These songs are very easy and simple to play, but full of rythmn and will keep you nodding the head.

[steveksux]

Record yourself playing some of this stuff against a metronome. Then listen to it. See if it still grooves. If you're struggling to keep in time with the metronome, you can't groove. The answer is lots of time playing with metronome. Playing with records is good too, but its easy to make the mistake of thinking you're grooving when its really the guys on the record.

Nobody to hide behind when its you and the metronome.

Randy

[BassChuck]

Excellent suggestions here. Good bassists should never stop working on timing.

Timing is everything. Frankly I don't think its possible to say that someone has good chops if the timing is off. I understand that someone could play a lot of fast notes, but 'good chops' means putting the notes where they belong.

[SBassman]

Originally Posted by steveksux

... its easy to make the mistake of thinking you're grooving when its really the guys on the record...
Nobody to hide behind when its you and the metronome.
Randy

Quote of the week.

[mrcircle]

My first bass teacher had me set my metronome at a medium-slow tempo and attempt to clap along with the beat. As long as I could hear the metronome, I was off the beat. Only when my handclaps hit dead on did they mask the metronome, so I got immediate feedback. My time improved quickly when I practiced this every day.

[fcleff]

Originally Posted by mrcircle

My first bass teacher had me set my metronome at a medium-slow tempo and attempt to clap along with the beat. As long as I could hear the metronome, I was off the beat. Only when my handclaps hit dead on did they mask the metronome, so I got immediate feedback. My time improved quickly when I practiced this every day.

It's amazing what you can do to improve your playing without ever touching your instrument. There are lots of variations on this. Many can even be made up.

[Corona_Clyde]

Dude-that is insane. Your problem is the exact opposite of my problem. I got rythm, but not enough chops.