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  #1  
Old 12-23-2007, 09:54 PM
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Hardcore Slap

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I'm in a hardcore band were I pretty much play roots the whole time but the guitar parts aren't very technical either. I want to write a song that incorporates slap or is entirely slap. The problem is...slap is funky and i don't know how to fit it into a hardcore style. I love playing slap but it just doesn't seem to fit. I dont want it to sound funky but i want to utilize the power, complexity, and rhythm of slap in a more hardcore style. Any suggestions? Any songs or videos i can look to for help?

note: our style is similar to "The Devil Wears Prada"
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  #2  
Old 12-23-2007, 10:05 PM
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hahaahh, finally, a man after my own heart.
actually just got the latest Devil wears prada CD

being in Louisiana, you ever checked out iwrestledabearonce ?
there pretty much amazing lol.

Anyway on topic.
i play bass in a more Jonbenet/Norma Jean type band,

ive thought of slapping before, and since the whole hardcore genere is kinda agressive, Mids are always your friend.

as long as you crank those mids, everyone will hear yo' Funky goodness.

cant really suggest anything here, i only know from experience.
slap = agressive
midrange = agressive

so slap + midrance = Agressive x2

You'll definatly stand out.
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  #3  
Old 12-23-2007, 10:06 PM
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Bro', write to the song and what it is calling for. Writing a song around a tecnique can be a slippery slope because your not only cutting yourself off from discovering the true potential of a song but might also be percieved as just stroking the old ego and show boating.

In my experience using slap in any style should be more about the percussive element yet also tying in to the chordal structure being used. As where funk may use a more backbeat type feel you may want to think more in terms of using the tecnique as more an accent to set a mood or add another percussive element to the song. If you guys are doing more of a Prada type of hardcore I notice they use alot of diminished chords and more of a minor feel. So, look to those chordal structures and try to "see" the drums being played out on your fretboard using that structure.

Your right. Utilizing slap in a tasteful way is very tough in our genre. However, a great slap line combined with a good sense of what the song is calling for will definitely land you in a very cool cadre of bassist that are capable of doing so!

Good luck and happy writing!
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  #4  
Old 12-23-2007, 10:50 PM
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You can fit anything into anything man be creative it will work if you make it work.
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Old 12-23-2007, 11:01 PM
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Nicka is right, i am in a hardcore band and there are a lot of things i could be doing, but i don't because it would take away from the song as a whole.
  #6  
Old 12-23-2007, 11:03 PM
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thanks for the help. if a song does in fact evolve from this and we record it, ill be sure to send u guys a link.
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  #7  
Old 12-24-2007, 09:39 AM
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check out Mudvayne. Ryan Martinie is always slapping, popping, and tapping.
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  #8  
Old 12-24-2007, 09:48 AM
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Just go with it and see if it helps or hinders the sound in general. I actually learned how to slap in a hard rock band because it helped me to be more percusive/stand out in various parts where I was either on my own or was under a guitar solo. As much as ppl around here dislike Fieldy, I think it's his slap tha made early Korn great.
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  #9  
Old 12-24-2007, 09:51 AM
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slap is not funky. it's a technique. learn to use it well, apply it correctly when needed.
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  #10  
Old 12-25-2007, 02:40 AM
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Ryan Martinie of Mudvayne slaps alot and it sounds METAL, not funky. Just listen to how he uses it and see if you can use that as a guide. It seems like to me he uses it to get a good metallic sound from his low notes and to get the higher ones to stand out. That along with raking chords very agressively.
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  #11  
Old 12-28-2007, 02:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by elpelotero View Post
check out Mudvayne. Ryan Martinie is always slapping, popping, and tapping.
Ryan also said in recent(not VERY recent.. but post-slap happy days) interviews that he was going to slow down on all that and focus more on what the song NEEDS and not just using it everywhere.
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  #12  
Old 12-28-2007, 02:06 PM
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someone said ryan said he slapped very little on l.d. 50...i find that hard to believe.
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  #13  
Old 12-28-2007, 02:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rockwarnick View Post
slap is not funky. it's a technique. learn to use it well, apply it correctly when needed.
+1

Funk's about the feel, not how you get there.
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  #14  
Old 01-01-2008, 09:25 AM
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Kripes man, I've played slap Black Sabbath. Slap is not FUNKY by itself, BUT it lets you time and pulse the song while you play riffs or a melody, that what slap does, its allows you to funkify ANYTHING.

EG, I dont dig shred, not hate, but jsut cant hear much musicality, but, as long as there is a drum groove, I can hear slap lines to the bass parts. Even simple things like plucking on the snare beat, double tumbing the kick drum, etc.

Some metal doesnt not have a pulse, which I would define as a "syncopated rhythm". Its harder to provide a slap bass line , which incorporates the pulse of the song, if the song is Soul less". Slap , done PROPERLY ( and it often is NOT),

You boys post up an metal mpeg with some syncopated rhythm, and I'll slap it silly.

The metal I cut my chops on is early Sabbath ( I started playing in '70). I can through proper slap riffs into most of those tunes, and some I can slap every bar.

I particularly like slapping the bass solo " Basically"

Aw Geezer would be proud. Its VERY musical.

Use your imaginations. Start with a "pulse", a rhythmic pulse. Start playing that pulse on your bass, ghosting (muting) it. Just feel it, the pulse and then let the melody come to your open mind. Your drummer should accent the pulse on the slap line.

Metal is only harder since, 1.) the bpm is usually north of 100, and 2.) often straight time w/o syncopated time accents. You gotta make your own man!

lesson5 sabbathbassicallybackslap.wav - 3.31MB

There's an old lesson. Its the only file not in th e .aud format. Sounds like a 10 yr old, yup I know. Time is, I guess south of 80, maybe 65 bpm, way slowed down. Wasnt labled and time wanders, yes I know...but think of every articulation of the bass along with a crash, pop or kick on a drum kit, speed it up to 100-120 bpm ( ++ once you're good enough), as a backdrop to where the guitar stops "chunking" and takes off on high to a "searing" solo riff.

( guess yall know what a terrible player I am now) )

Another area where slap would work MINT in metal is in very fast passages. One of the most beautiful mechancial aspects of Vic Wooten's slap ( at the top of the game, iner alia) is the near 300 bpm articulations you can pull off between hammer ons, plucks thumps and flcks.

Now, when you do all that on a bass you LOSE that hard driving 4/4 pulse of most metal ( I;m ignornat on metal, so pardone my attemps here ) , so the drummer REALLY has to step up and either more heavily suppsoer the background 4/4 pulse OR competely fall into the same patterns your playing.

So , to sum. Good slap bass articulates the pulse of a tune, uisng ghosting thumb/plucks , and kinda always has that running in the background between runs. In the context of metal, the drums have to be wired into that pulse, to either step along side it and support simple time without stepping in it, or envelope tehmselves into the pluse froming a drum/bass lines that would effing SCARE msot metal heads as it resonated their backbones down to their chi.

Sooooooo GET ON IT mullet..... craft some slap metall that will make me listen to , adn appreciate, metal again.

You guys you tube DOUG JOHNS use " buzzjohns ". A couple of lessons you'll find. Doug should be having this discussion, not me. Check him out. Bet Doug would know exactly how to make metal slap scream. I'll see if I can link you to a "heavy" tune of Dougs.





Peace. Out.
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Last edited by BuffaloBass : 01-01-2008 at 10:13 AM.
  #15  
Old 01-01-2008, 10:09 AM
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Here mullet, spend 6 minutes with this cat... change his major chords to minors and see if it dont get your creative mind FLYIN'...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CfCjqcWl4uQ

Remember you'll have to be hearing the drums as well as the bass in your song as you compose......

Ya gotta make the bass sound like this though....

http://cdbaby.com/mp3lofi/dougjohns-17.m3u
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Last edited by BuffaloBass : 01-01-2008 at 10:22 AM.
  #16  
Old 01-02-2008, 07:47 PM
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IMO Slap is not necessesarily funky, but all the percussive sounds (aka the THUMP) do make people want to nod their heads with the groove, I find. And as we all know, funk is all about the groove.

And lets be honest here...how often do we ever hear a (good) slap riff that isnt funky?

I suggest listening to really early chili peppers. Flea's early slap work is heavily influenced by hard punk. Really simple stucture, but the speed is challenging. So it ties in with lots of hardcore/metal stuff.

Couple of songs to get you going, the bass is perfect to introduce you into really hard, fast slap. I'll provide the album they are from as well:

a) Blackeyed blonde - Freaky Styley
b) Get up and jump - self-titled (RHCP's first album)
c) Nobody Weird like me - Mother's milk (definetly the craziest slap-riff of them all)
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