Hip-Hop?

[phillipmorephil]

I'm not exactly sure where to put this, so I figured Technique to be adequate.

A friend of mine is recording some hip-hop music, raps and beats and whatnot, and asked me to play bass on some tracks.

I have a fair notion of theory, but I don't quite know how to make my bass fit into the hip-hop genre. Do you cats know of anything, anything at all really, that would help me fit into the mold a bit more?

Thanks,
Phil

[J. Crawford]

You said the term cats! I thought I was the only one anymore.. no chance youre usually a jazz type bassist? If so, that explains it.

But I like either digging in super hard with short, staccato notes, or really thumpy tones with foam under the strings and fingerstyle.

But thats just me.

[bassdoubler]

well Phil, it depends on the style of hip-hop you're being asked to record, but to me, hip-hop is all about filling space with the "less is more" approach, and giving enough space for the lyrics to be heard while making the track groove. Not always easy. I suggest listening to the Roots album, Illadelph Halflife to hear how Hub makes this happen in 3 notes or less. Genius if you ask me.

[HaVIC5]

Simple, repetition and some hardcore groove. Three things you need to keep in mind.

[Joe.shaffer]

Simple lines with a good groove. I always play something that is close to a dub style line.

[Dogbertday]

Yeah it's all about a groove where either exactly the same thing or small variations can last forever and make whoever's rhymin' feel super comfortable.

a hip trick I picked up is that you only play durring half of one of the verses (other than the first verse)... just leave the drums and other nuance sounds going. People dig this and don't know why.

[ugly_bassplayer]

Listen to some Hip hop.
Since a lot of lines originate from other styles (sampled bass lines are from EVERY GENRE of music from funk to world beat.) you need to listen to where they came from also.
Alot of the bass in hip hop is done on keyboard also.
As for hip hop listening , here are a couple of must listen records to get you started:

-a tribe called quest : midnight marauders & the low end theory.
-anything by The Roots
-anything by eric b. & rakim
-wu tang; 36chambers
-Public enemy:nation of millions.....
-anything by gang starr
-Pete rock & cl smooth ; mecca & the soul brother, retrun of the mecca
-Nas: illmatic
-EPMD;strictly business & unfinished business
(probably forgetting a couple, this is off the top of my head.)
cheers

[Billy Low]

Quite honestly, I would suggest you tread lightly and ask your friend to give you an example of what he's looking for. Understand that hip-hop is close to forty years old, has been under many transformations, and has been an artform that has (from it's enception) borrowed basslines from all genres...you would really do yourself as well as hip-hop a great disservice to try create what does not exist.

Not trying to rain on your parade, but I really would just suggest you ask what they are looking for. As stated before on TB (by notable bass players from hip hop recordings) Hip-Hop Basslines do not exist.

[Intenzity]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9d9eydCfTdw

Watch the Youtubes of this entire show for the crash course maybe. Lots of stylistic ground covered, believe me.

[Armbruster]

(this is all IMHO, do whatever you please.)

Hip-Hop's pretty simple in the general sense. I like to think of it as reggae music when you're playing it on bass. Here's a few tippers into writing or jamming with a Hip-Hop beat:

First off, use ONLY bass and treble. Cut most to all mids. You need to sound like just notes, not aggressive. No slap here, buddy.

• Keep it SIMPLE!

Nobody at all wants to hear riffs whatsoever in Hip-Hop. Nobody. This isn't the music to show off with on bass.

• Go offbeat, but stay with the beat.

I'll try to show an example here. Let's say our Hip-Hop riff goes like this, alternating licks:

#1: G Dsharp A
#2: A Dsharp G

Played as 'bum bum bum *pause* let note ring *pause*' and 'bum bum bum *pause* let note ring *pause*' back down.

Or, as confusing as it is to explain time verbally through text, this is how it'd sound:
bum bum bum /PAUSE/ buuuuuuuuuuuum bum bum bum /PAUSE/ buuuuuuuuuuuuuum

Now, you'll have the vocalist, which is the key to playing these.

For example, here's an example from The Root's 'You Got Me':

LET NOTE RING Somebody told me that this planet was small PLAY RIFF HERE #1
LET NOTE RING we use to live in the same building on the same floor PLAY RIFF HERE #2
LET NOTE RING and never met before PLAY RIFF HERE #1

You're doing a walk up and down within lines of the verse.

A lot like Reggae music! You keep a lot of that style while still retaining the Hip-Hop feel.

• Stay LOW!

I rock a 6-string, but I don't dare to go near the high C, or even D. A's most likely the max I'll do. But if I do need a higher note, I'll play it closed on the A. It just keeps it all on a deep, closed sound that Hip-Hop's noted for.

• Keep it MINIMALISTIC

I'll take an example here from Everlast's 'What It's Like'.

Even though this song's brilliant in so many ways, Mr. Irish Bass Player's not the most creative, but that does benefit him in a way within the song.

It's basically D (played on the A!!), D#-E C D.

Listen to the song on YouTube (hopefully you've already downloaded it), and you'll hear the bass come in. He keeps it alternating with as little change as possible throughout the whole song. Needless to say- creativity in Hip-Hop bass isn't needed! You're just keeping the low-end with the beat, adding that extra oomph that good Hip-Hop needs.

IMHO, all Hip-Hop needs real basses. All this Three 6 Mafia bull****'s stupid, using freaking computers to create subsonic woofer notes.

Well, that's all I know. Good luck.

[bass12]

Originally Posted by Armbruster

First off, use ONLY bass and treble. Cut most to all mids. You need to sound like just notes, not aggressive. No slap here, buddy.

• Keep it SIMPLE!

Nobody at all wants to hear riffs whatsoever in Hip-Hop. Nobody. This isn't the music to show off with on bass.

One of the cool things about hip-hop music is that it can take from anything, so forget about the "can't do this" and "use only these frequencies" suggestions. No slap? Go take a listen to Doug Wimbish's lines on early Sugar Hill recordings such as "That's The Joint" and "Freedom" (and there are some tasty FILLS in there, too). And what about any of the numerous tracks that feature sampled slap lines? A lot of guys seem to get hung up on Hub, as if he's the only bass player to ever grace a hip-hop recording. Hub's great, but his is only one approach and shouldn't be taken as the gospel of hip-hop bass. I'd say as long as it grooves and sounds right in the context of the song don't worry too much (and yes, check out some of the great artist suggestions made by others on this thread).

[Entwistle]

hey i have a problem when recording bass for hip hop wonder if anyone can help.

alot of the time when i get the beat to record the bass over, the sample is not in tune, as in because its come from a record with like variable speed and pitch knobs, as well as the samble unit which can manipulates the speed/pitch.

how do you guys get your bass in tune to something thats not like standard notes is what im asking lol.

[superfunk47]

Don't be fooled - there are no rules (especially not about what frequencies to use...).

There are suggestions people can make, though. Mine would include:

Less is more

Repetition, repetition, repetition

Know when not to play

Timing, timing, timing

Most importantly, and this pretty much sums up the others in one:

Groove is everything.

If you can groove, hip hop will be very natural.

Good luck!

[JimmyM]

Originally Posted by Entwistle

hey i have a problem when recording bass for hip hop wonder if anyone can help.

alot of the time when i get the beat to record the bass over, the sample is not in tune, as in because its come from a record with like variable speed and pitch knobs, as well as the samble unit which can manipulates the speed/pitch.

how do you guys get your bass in tune to something thats not like standard notes is what im asking lol.

You tune your bass to the track.

[milothefultz]

POCKET.

Find it. Live there.

Know when not to play, +1 superfunk.

[Entwistle]

Originally Posted by JimmyM

You tune your bass to the track.

yer but i mean how. alot of the time a note in the sample isn't long enough to work it out.

[JimmyM]

What you have to do is get the pitch of the sample in your head and tune to it. Or just have the guy play the sample over until you get a string tuned to it, then tune your other strings to the one string you've got.

This is why it's so dangerous to totally rely on tuners and not know how to tune your bass without one. That's a pretty elementary skill, and it really shouldn't be an issue for someone doing sessions to tune to a track that's not square on A=440. Fortunately, you know how to do it now, so you're allowed to do this session

[Billy Low]

Originally Posted by Armbruster

(this is all IMHO, do whatever you please.)

Hip-Hop's pretty simple in the general sense. I like to think of it as reggae music when you're playing it on bass. Here's a few tippers into writing or jamming with a Hip-Hop beat:

First off, use ONLY bass and treble. Cut most to all mids. You need to sound like just notes, not aggressive. No slap here, buddy.

• Keep it SIMPLE!

Nobody at all wants to hear riffs whatsoever in Hip-Hop. Nobody. This isn't the music to show off with on bass.

• Go offbeat, but stay with the beat.

I'll try to show an example here. Let's say our Hip-Hop riff goes like this, alternating licks:

#1: G Dsharp A
#2: A Dsharp G

Played as 'bum bum bum *pause* let note ring *pause*' and 'bum bum bum *pause* let note ring *pause*' back down.

Or, as confusing as it is to explain time verbally through text, this is how it'd sound:
bum bum bum /PAUSE/ buuuuuuuuuuuum bum bum bum /PAUSE/ buuuuuuuuuuuuuum

Now, you'll have the vocalist, which is the key to playing these.

For example, here's an example from The Root's 'You Got Me':



You're doing a walk up and down within lines of the verse.

A lot like Reggae music! You keep a lot of that style while still retaining the Hip-Hop feel.

• Stay LOW!

I rock a 6-string, but I don't dare to go near the high C, or even D. A's most likely the max I'll do. But if I do need a higher note, I'll play it closed on the A. It just keeps it all on a deep, closed sound that Hip-Hop's noted for.

• Keep it MINIMALISTIC

I'll take an example here from Everlast's 'What It's Like'.

Even though this song's brilliant in so many ways, Mr. Irish Bass Player's not the most creative, but that does benefit him in a way within the song.

It's basically D (played on the A!!), D#-E C D.

Listen to the song on YouTube (hopefully you've already downloaded it), and you'll hear the bass come in. He keeps it alternating with as little change as possible throughout the whole song. Needless to say- creativity in Hip-Hop bass isn't needed! You're just keeping the low-end with the beat, adding that extra oomph that good Hip-Hop needs.

IMHO, all Hip-Hop needs real basses. All this Three 6 Mafia bull****'s stupid, using freaking computers to create subsonic woofer notes.

Well, that's all I know. Good luck.

Wow.

To think that all of these years I wasted listening, analyzing, dj'ing, producing, cataloging hip-hop music that is it...I really missed something here....

[sir juice]

if in doubt, just lock with the bass drum, can't go wrong

[Armbruster]

Originally Posted by Billy Low

Wow.

To think that all of these years I wasted listening, analyzing, dj'ing, producing, cataloging hip-hop music that is it...I really missed something here....

Haha, it's just my $.02. We all have different philosophies, that's mine.