How to achieve James Jamerson Style and Sound?

[urpo]

I was just listenin' to James Jamerson and that hit me hard. Can anyone help me on achieving the sound and techinique close to his (on top of the index finger only)? Should I get thick strings or what would help?

[JTE]

A decent Precision bass, a set of flatwounds (and the LaBellas he used do have a different character than GHS Precision flats, and the popular TI flats are totally different), and a decent amp with some compression. Most of his tracks were direct through a tube compressor to the tape, not an amp so a B-15 isn't required.

But most of it's attitude, the attack of his fingers on those strings, and the way he created the lines. Plus, the Motown mixes left a lot of sonic space for him which wouldn't happen if you are working with someone who's going for a John Bonham drum sound. There is something about articulating those lines with one finger but it's not critical either. So, put some flats on a P bass, dial up a sound that's not too heavy on the highs (but don't choke them out either), and get a copy of Dr. Licks' book/CD combination "Standing In The Shadows of Motown" and start learning the lines.

John

PS- BTW, that's the transcription of the bassline from Gladys Knight's version of "I Heard It Through The Grapevine" from "Standing in The Shadows of Motown" in my avatar...

j

[Skitch it!]

Check out this guy's vids, very close approximation.

YouTube - Jamerson Bassline - All That Love..Verse 2

[SMILEYSIXX]

I don't think he used compression himself, something like that may have been mixed in later. Get LaBellas and break them in ALOT. I heard he opened his tone and volume completely and set his bass and mids all the way up and his treble at midway. And yes, btw, you NEED a precision.

[SteveC]

Originally Posted by JTE

...and get a copy of Dr. Licks' book/CD combination "Standing In The Shadows of Motown" and start learning the lines.

I need to "revisit" that book.

[Winnb]

Get an old P-bass
Put nasty flatwounds on it.
Get a P.O.S. amp from the 60's.
Ask God to give you Jameson's talent.

[Nickthebass]

Originally Posted by JTE

A decent Precision bass, a set of flatwounds (and the LaBellas he used do have a different character than GHS Precision flats, and the popular TI flats are totally different), and a decent amp with some compression. Most of his tracks were direct through a tube compressor to the tape, not an amp so a B-15 isn't required.

But most of it's attitude, the attack of his fingers on those strings, and the way he created the lines. Plus, the Motown mixes left a lot of sonic space for him which wouldn't happen if you are working with someone who's going for a John Bonham drum sound. There is something about articulating those lines with one finger but it's not critical either. So, put some flats on a P bass, dial up a sound that's not too heavy on the highs (but don't choke them out either), and get a copy of Dr. Licks' book/CD combination "Standing In The Shadows of Motown" and start learning the lines.

John

PS- BTW, that's the transcription of the bassline from Gladys Knight's version of "I Heard It Through The Grapevine" from "Standing in The Shadows of Motown" in my avatar...

j

+1 to all of this but I would add a kicker as well.

Part of the reason Jamerson played the way he did is because he played jazz and was heavily influenced by those great upright players. This shows through in two ways for me, aside from his tone.

1) His style was harmonically much more sophisticated than most other pop bass lines of the time. He was outlining the harmony and leading the listener through the changes.

2) His use of open strings. This is (I think) a particular device used by upright players to make position shifts easier. Quite a number of Motown tunes were in flat keys (Bb and Eb for example) and yet Jamerson would happily use an open A or D as a passing note.

For example if he wanted to get from an Ebmajor chord to an Abmajor his last note before the Ab could well be an A natural. This note is "wrong" in strict terms in that it's not really part of Eb chord. Playing that note does two things though. Firstly it could allow you to shift from 1st position (Eb at the first fret on D string) to 4th position (Ab with the first finger on the E string). Secondly it provides a moment of tension and release in the part as you sit on this "wrong" note and then move off it to a "right" note.

This device of approaching from a semi-tone above or below is often used in jazz. In my example above the bass part outlines what is known as a "tritone substitution".

When I was 16-18 I had a teach who made me play jazz standards all the time (we did almost nothing else). By doing this he was trying to teach that skill that Jamerson learnt of walking the listener through the changes.

I would totally agree that buying "Standing in the Shadows of Motown" is a great thing to do. I would very strongly suggest that alongside this you get hold of some jazz standards and learn to swing through them playing arpeggios particularly. Do it just playing 4 quarter notes per bar and focus on leading the ear in a nice way from one chord to the next.

When you sit and play the Motown parts you will hear all that stuff in there...just with much funkier rhythms.

If you want to learn his style don't just learn his parts you have to learn the stuff that he learnt too.

Good luck

PS: When I am Emperor of the Universe copies of that Motown book will be given out free when you buy a set of strings.

[Top_Ten]

Doing the "hook," playing a P-bass with flats, etc. is all good, but for me the real challenge to playing like Jamerson is getting that relaxed and in the pocket feel on his often fast and technically challenging lines.

I've spent a lot of time with the Standing in the Shadows book, and I am able to learn the parts and play the right notes in time, but I find it really hard to make it sound the way Jamerson sounded. He just grooved so hard and made it all sound so effortless. That's the really hard part.

Not to mention that he didn't just learn those amazingly creative and musical bass lines from a book, he made them up, probably on the spot in a lot of cases. That's the other crazy part.

[Jim Nazium]

Originally Posted by Winnb

Get an old P-bass
Put nasty flatwounds on it.
Get a P.O.S. amp from the 60's.
Ask God to give you Jameson's talent.

+1
The sound is easy to duplicate. The style can be imitated with a moderate amount of effort, especially with the help of transcriptions. But can you imagine posessing the creativity to come up with a line like "Darling Dear", when your contemporaries are all playing roots & 5ths? The guy was a genius.

[urpo]

Wow, thanks!
Going to order a set of flats next I think, been lookin' for those awhile anyways.
I've played for 3 years but hadn't started hauling influences until now, trying to get them from different genres and players. Guess I'm looking for my own style.

[basslinejam]

Every post here is adding more and more insight. We can never have too many Jamerson threads on Talkbass. It brings out the best.

[Skitch it!]

As much as James got his sound and style with a consistent one finger tech, and slightly overdriven tube compression and as the guy's have mentioned above, his penchant for old flats together with his astounding harmonic and rhythmic complexity. I find his left hand V.difficult to imitate, the dexterity and fluidity is incredible, plus the rhythmic feel is so syncopated, reversed, changed et al, the open string technique from double bass tech for positional changes and non-diatonic tension and release. A true genius we're talking here.

[RedLeg]

P bass, flats, mile high action. Ability to play every chord change forwards and backwards with a complete mastery of 16th note subdivision and the talent to lay some of the tastiest licks ever recorded.

That should cover it.

[ugly_bassplayer]

I'm a huge Jamerson disciple, he's my main influence on bass.
I've been through the entire Motown book at least 2 or 3 times plus a couple of trancriptions.

Yes the Pbass & flats are important to the sound.
But IMO the feel & groove of Jamerson are the main things (way more than gear), listen & play as many of his lines as possible, study the transcritions.....immmerse youself in his playing.

[RedLeg]

Originally Posted by ugly_bassplayer

I'm a huge Jamerson disciple, he's my main influence on bass.
I've been through the entire Motown book at least 2 or 3 times plus a couple of trancriptions.

Yes the Pbass & flats are important to the sound.
But IMO the feel & groove of Jamerson are the main things (way more than gear), listen & play as many of his lines as possible, study the transcritions.....immmerse youself in his playing.

this is the gospel truth. transcribe, play along, use amazing slowdowner and repeat as many times as humanly possible.

[ugly_bassplayer]

Originally Posted by RedLeg

this is the gospel truth. transcribe, play along, use amazing slowdowner and repeat as many times as humanly possible.

Thank you buddy.

[JTE]

Originally Posted by SMILEYSIXX

I don't think he used compression himself, something like that may have been mixed in later.

He most generally plugged into an interface that had a separate VU meter for each input. He and the guitarists would plug into that, set their own gain (and by setting it high, they'd overdrive the tubes). According to the "Standing In The Shadows Of Motown" book (page 83) Mike McLain, a Motown engineer says "From that point, the engineers would usually tailor his sound a bit more by adding a Fairchild limiter... and one or two Pultec equalizers." This seems to be right after the interface panel and before the tape deck, not mixed in later, but as you say, not something Jamerson set up himself either.

John

[chadhargis]

Originally Posted by Jim Nazium

+1
The sound is easy to duplicate. The style can be imitated with a moderate amount of effort, especially with the help of transcriptions. But can you imagine posessing the creativity to come up with a line like "Darling Dear", when your contemporaries are all playing roots & 5ths? The guy was a genius.

Top that off with the fact that he was drunk or stoned off his keester while playing most of that stuff (as admitted by the members of the "Funk Brothers" in the Dr. Licks book).

Rick James said it best:

YouTube - Rick James "Cocaine is a hell of a drug"

[Russell L]

I have found that playing in the groove is the best way to get the articulation needed to play like Jamerson. But, I never tried to sound like him, or even play like him. I only had to learn the tunes. At that point, I learned the notes, the licks, etc., but I met him in spirit only after I got into the feel of the groove. It's as simple as that, to me. Then, when in the groove the licks were no longer difficult to play. Those 16ths and odd fingerings were no longer something to be worked out, but rather something to to be alive with. Maybe that all sounds mystical, but I swear it's the truth. But, you have to know how to get there with that feeling of the groove (those of you who have been there know what I mean).

Otherwise, I aspire to sound like no one else, but myself.

[NCD]

I've heard lines like Jamerson's in my head for years and I'm sure it's due to growing up when that music was big. Once you get used to thinking that's the way it's supposed to be, your brain just keeps moving in a similar direction.

Jamerson did many things all at once and understanding how they all build up to form the sound is the biggest thing you can do to develop your own similar style.

1) Many said he came from Jazz but the key thing to understand about WHY that makes a difference is to understand walking lines and Jazz syncopations. Put the syncopations aside for a moment and learn to walk. Go far, far beyond root-fifth into double chromatic approaches, upper dominant approaches, scalewise approaches, etc.

2) Now take that to another level by using the octave of the upper fifth or the lower octave of the scalewise approach to really open up the range of notes at your disposal. Learn to walk over a two octave range or even three so that you're all over the fingerboard but it still sounds good.

3) Remember, Jamerson was playing a MELODY within the bass line. He was using all the knowledge of walking and that massive range of available notes (above) in order to weave his own separate melody that ran underneath of the rest of the song.

4) Timing... this is where it gets wild. They said you couldn't watch Jamerson's foot because he was tapping some off the wall temp that had nothing to do with the song you were playing and if you watched his foot, it would throw you off time. When he was asked about this, Jamerson freely explained that he heard the time of the drummer, tapped a different time with his foot and... now for the part that proves he wasn't human... he compared the two timings in his mind and looked for the places that they intersected. The points where they intersected made up the timing that HE played.

This rhythmic gymnastics he did in his head is what was responsible for the incredible syncopations and hesitations. If your brain is wired like a normal human being's, then I wish you the best of luck trying to employ his method!

As for the lines, a great many were just improvised but they never sounded bad because when you understand walking as thoroughly as he did you can belch out whatever you want as long as you follow the patterns of a good walking line and it will sound good.

But what made his lines great is that they also formed an independent melody all their own.

Recommendation: Start with the book "Building Walking Bass Lines" by Ed Friedland. Once you've done that course book, work what you've learned over a 2-3 octave range and use it to make MELODIC lines.

Once you're comfortable with that, you'll understand how the rest of it all works. But understanding it and DOING it are two different things... and many mortal humans have been chasing the Jamerson sound for their entire lives.