I need help with picking!!!!

[HoosierBassist]

Hey,

Sorry if there is a thread about this somewhere else. I am kinda a newbie on talkbass. I just bought a Fender Rumble 75 yesterday. 215$ new. sweet deal. Got a Sterling RAY34 about a month ago. Great bass. I am starting to get into "Pop-punk" music. (Green Day, Blink 182, Sum 41)

Especially Blink 182

I have been playing bass about 2 years, have always played with my fingers. I have just started trying out a pick. I think I like the Dunlop Tortex .60mm best, although I use a variety of picks. For the type of music I want to get into, i wanna use a pick for tone, and speed. Take for example, 3 blink 182 songs-Anthem Part 2, Josie, and Online Songs. I really want to learn to play these, but I can't get fast enough. What do i do? How do I hold the pick? I am left Handed, playing a right handed bass. I think part of my speed weakness may be since i am a lefty not a righty... I want to know how to correctly hold the pick. I also think readers of this post should listen to the bass part of these songs. How do I pick that fast and not get tired?

Thanks.

Austin

[Bread Knife]

I'm far from an expert on pick-playing, but hopefully I can help a bit.

To hold the pick, you want it between your thumb and index finger. I usually have my index finger curled up so it doesn't stick out further than my thumb. Grip the pick tightly enough that it doesn't go flying, but don't put a death grip on it! That will cramp up your hand quickly.

As far as speed goes, you just need to practice. There is no shortcut. Well, there is a shortcut in that you can cut the strums in half by picking on the upstroke and the downstroke. I think Hoppus might only do downstrokes, which is a major pain for anything remotely fast. Anyway, if you practice picking slowly you will speed up as it becomes more familiar to you.

Lastly, I like your taste in equipment! I play a Stingray and use the exact same picks (though I prefer fingerstyle playing).

[tylerwylie]

Originally Posted by Bread Knife

I'm far from an expert on pick-playing, but hopefully I can help a bit.

To hold the pick, you want it between your thumb and index finger. I usually have my index finger curled up so it doesn't stick out further than my thumb. Grip the pick tightly enough that it doesn't go flying, but don't put a death grip on it! That will cramp up your hand quickly.

As far as speed goes, you just need to practice. There is no shortcut. Well, there is a shortcut in that you can cut the strums in half by picking on the upstroke and the downstroke. I think Hoppus might only do downstrokes, which is a major pain for anything remotely fast. Anyway, if you practice picking slowly you will speed up as it becomes more familiar to you.

Lastly, I like your taste in equipment! I play a Stingray and use the exact same picks (though I prefer fingerstyle playing).

Get a metronome! Measure yourself and watch yourself improve as you practice picking. The Ray34 is one hell of a bargain, it's almost as good of a bargain as the G&L Tribute L2000! Still can't go wrong with the Ray34, different vibe than the G&L. If you're digging your instrument, your style, and your gear and want to get a better sound without changing instruments the Ray34 almost begs for the Nordstrand MM 4.2 pickup upgrade. That's for another time, we're talking about picking here!

[Growly Lytes]

Try some of those ones that have grooves in them for your thumb & finger.

[sammyp]

FWIW ..i've been a lead guitar player for 20 odd years ....IMO a 60mm pick is way to weak ...you need a 1mm i dare say.....

[tylerwylie]

The thinner picks will be harder on the wrist as well. Go thicker!

[fearceol]

Originally Posted by tylerwylie

The thinner picks will be harder on the wrist as well. Go thicker!

+1.

Here is a link to Carol Kaye's lesson on pick playing. See "tips" 26& 27.



The Official Carol Kaye Web Site

[DeclanG]

I always go with .73 or .88 picks as they dont bend too much yet arent rock hard. A lighter pick will usually slow down your playing also as it bends too much and also runs the risk of hitting the next string when it clicks back to a straight position (if that makes sense!). For fast picking you dont want to have to move your wrist too much in either direction so the thicker the better but personally i find the .73mm perfect for me but i definately wouldnt go below that.

[Bread Knife]

For the record, it is nonsense that a thinnish pick will hurt your wrist or slow you down. I've never run into either problem and I've been playing the .6 mm tortex picks for years. Really not an issue.

I will say that I did once accidentally buy some really thin picks that were hard to play, but c'mon - they were so thin they were transparent! That's hardly normal.

[Tampabass]

serious question here, from a non-picker (just so you know I'm not just bashing).

I understand the idea of using a pick to achieve a certain type of tone (although, personally, I prefer the tone produced by fingers). But ... you mentioned "speed" as one of the reasons you want to pick. Can you really gain more speed with a pick than with fingers?

[Hutzbordello]

it really differs from player to player

if your slow with your fingers obv youll be faster with a pick. or look up the fastes fingers vs pick

also just take things slow with learning a new technique so you can build muscle memory. think of it as slow drying concretet that doesnt quite dry

[Deathblade Eric]

Originally Posted by HoosierBassist

...I have just started trying out a pick. I think I like the Dunlop Tortex .60mm best, although I use a variety of picks. For the type of music I want to get into, i wanna use a pick for tone, and speed. Take for example, 3 blink 182 songs-Anthem Part 2, Josie, and Online Songs. I really want to learn to play these, but I can't get fast enough. What do i do? How do I hold the pick? I am left Handed, playing a right handed bass. I think part of my speed weakness may be since i am a lefty not a righty... I want to know how to correctly hold the pick. I also think readers of this post should listen to the bass part of these songs. How do I pick that fast and not get tired?

Thanks.

Austin

1. As mentioned already, hold it between your thumb & first finger - firmly but not in a Vice Grip.
2. It's All In The Wrist. Don't go for the 'Sawing A Log' tactic of playing from the shoulder (like Cliff Williams, Phil Lynott & Dee Dee Ramone), & definitely don't copy the guitarist's tactic of just using the thumb & forefinger - both of these will limit your speed & dexterity and the latter method could possibly set you up for an injury.
3. Is your bass in the right position? Stuff how your heroes might wear it, you're built like you - you're a one-off - so adjust the strap until everything is comfortable.
4. You might want to use a slightly stiffer pick than that for a decent tone, but a softer one will help while you're building speed.
5. Left handedness has nothing to do with it.
6. Practice has everything to do with it.

Here's a short film of a Senior Citizen with a (pretty much) model pick technique:

YouTube - Motorhead - Going To Brazil

He's 65 you know.

Originally Posted by Tampabass

Can you really gain more speed with a pick than with fingers?

In theory, with enough practice, all things are possible, but whilst I dare say it's possible to play a 2-hour set of this kind of thing with your fingers...

YouTube - Motorhead - Overkill (live) Full HD (contains Strobe Lighting)...

It'd probably leave you a cramped & crippled wreck

Pete.

[MEKer]

Originally Posted by DeclanG

I always go with .73 or .88 picks as they dont bend too much yet arent rock hard. A lighter pick will usually slow down your playing also as it bends too much and also runs the risk of hitting the next string when it clicks back to a straight position (if that makes sense!). For fast picking you dont want to have to move your wrist too much in either direction so the thicker the better but personally i find the .73mm perfect for me but i definately wouldnt go below that.

Roger that! I've played pick for over 30 yrs and find floppy picks DO slow you down because trying to speed play with them is not very precise and when playing slowly you need to cup them to get any bite, as compared to a .73mm. YMMV but definitely up your pick thickness to .73 or .88 and then PRACTICE. BTW: You will probably find the .73's wrap around the the string more quickly (up and down) than the .88's.

In the end-----practice, develop your technique and the right pick for you will make itself known to you.

Also-Satriani's new bassist, Allen Whitman, uses a pick. Fantastic guy.

[ThorGodOfBass]

I'm actually in the same position as you. A southpaw on a right handed bass. The upside to this is that you'll find notes and have generally easier, stronger left hand technique (duh) but, the downside being your picking skills (I pick mostly as well) are naturally going to lag. A good way to get over this is to play simple metal, or punk, like what your doing. Although, youl realize as you go that blink182 and greenday, are far from truly fast. But, it'd a good start. Anyway, what I did was start off learning "proper" punk technique :P that is, all down picks. Jason newsted style! It will burn your arms and shoulders like hell. But, once your fast enough to hammer 'em out without screwing up, you can add in up picks. And then everything will feel relatively comfortable. The idea though, to train harder then you play. Go after songs that are faster and faster, try to keep pushing to use only down picks. Once you've got it down, add the ups. It will atleast get you more comfortable with it. Also, go this with those picks. Atleast 1.5mil is best. Bellow that and youl have a hard time hitting the string.

[MEKer]

Originally Posted by ThorGodOfBass

I'm actually in the same position as you. A southpaw on a right handed bass. The upside to this is that you'll find notes and have generally easier, stronger left hand technique (duh) but, the downside being your picking skills (I pick mostly as well) are naturally going to lag. A good way to get over this is to play simple metal, or punk, like what your doing. Although, youl realize as you go that blink182 and greenday, are far from truly fast. But, it'd a good start. Anyway, what I did was start off learning "proper" punk technique :P that is, all down picks. Jason newsted style! It will burn your arms and shoulders like hell. But, once your fast enough to hammer 'em out without screwing up, you can add in up picks. And then everything will feel relatively comfortable. The idea though, to train harder then you play. Go after songs that are faster and faster, try to keep pushing to use only down picks. Once you've got it down, add the ups. It will atleast get you more comfortable with it. Also, go this with those picks. Atleast 1.5mil is best. Bellow that and youl have a hard time hitting the string.

Pay absolutely no attention to what I bolded. Don't know if it was said in jest or just inexperience. And again, I personally say that with over 30 years experience.

Also, I would advise learn up and down at the same time. Begin building muscle memory immediately along with the full control of the techniques.
In the end-do what you want, man.

[jasper76]

Speed comes with practice at slower tempos, built up over time.

That said, in the meantime....this always comes across as a copout, and maybe it is, but remember, you don't have to hit every 16th note to play fast.

As fast as you can play now (which will most certainly improve with practice, practice), you can play twice as fast if you skip some 16th notes, and just play 8th notes, instead.

May not be what you're going for, but it can work. I do this often when the band kicks something off during practice that is too fast for me to play note-for-note. I dare say I can play pretty fast, but like everyone else, I have an upper-limit.

[rockstarbassist]

Endurance only comes with practice, as does speed. I played mainly fingers only for a long time, but the last 2-3 years have been pretty much pick only and my speed and endurance is as good as I need it to be, so I've been working on other techniques like power chords, string skipping, etc. and those are as good as I need them to be also. It really takes time and playing along with what you want to play musically until you get there.
I use .88 or 1.00 Dunlop Tortex picks, also.

[mpdd]

fwiw i noticed i can play a lot faster with the pick standing up than i can sitting down

[MEKer]

Originally Posted by jasper76

Speed comes with practice at slower tempos, built up over time.

That said, in the meantime....this always comes across as a copout, and maybe it is, but remember, you don't have to hit every 16th note to play fast.

As fast as you can play now (which will most certainly improve with practice, practice), you can play twice as fast if you skip some 16th notes, and just play 8th notes, instead.

May not be what you're going for, but it can work. I do this often when the band kicks something off during practice that is too fast for me to play note-for-note. I dare say I can play pretty fast, but like everyone else, I have an upper-limit.

Absolutely excellent tip for all bassists--not just pick users! And its no cop out---its part of technique for both finger and pick players. And quite often will sound better in the song. Go, Jasper76! And welcome to TalkBass!

[DeclanG]

Originally Posted by mpdd

fwiw i noticed i can play a lot faster with the pick standing up than i can sitting down

Me also. Fastest way to play with a pick is using just the wrist which is alot easier for me standing. When sitting i tend to move from the elbow alot more also which slows it down a bit.