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  #1  
Old 09-21-2006, 08:27 PM
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Lifted-Off Notes

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Hi, I'm starting to learn and practise pull-off notes. I remember once someone said that to play clean pull-off notes, you don't just simply lift your finger...

Can you guys give me some tips on how to achieve a clean pull-off note?

Thanks!

Edit:
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Last edited by Cubeface : 09-22-2006 at 07:15 AM.
  #2  
Old 09-21-2006, 09:57 PM
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Pull the string to the side a little as you do it. That little pluck helps a lot. By the way, we usually call them "pull offs".
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  #3  
Old 09-22-2006, 09:16 AM
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I am not sure what lemur said is quite understandable.

With your fret hand, when you pull off the fret, pull your finger down towards the ground at the same time, kind of plucking the the string with your finger that you are pulling off.

It takes quite a bit of getting used to, but once u get it down, it sounds GREAT!
  #4  
Old 09-22-2006, 09:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cubeface
Hi, I'm starting to learn and practise pull-off notes. I remember once someone said that to play clean pull-off notes, you don't just simply lift your finger...

Can you guys give me some tips on how to achieve a clean pull-off note?

Thanks!

Edit:
Cubeface,

Maybe it's only me, but I see a Lifted-off note as something different than a Pull-off note.

A Lifted-Off note is created by lifting a fretting finger off the string and allowing the string to ring, still fretted by another finger lower on the neck. There is no additional articulation by either hand.

A Pull-off is exactly as the other folks have been describing. You're actually pulling off the string, giving it a flick with the tip or side of the fretting finger that is being removed.

Pull-offs have the potential to be louder or more accented than Lifted-Off notes since they get some help from the pull-off action. Also, a pull-off can be used to go from a fretted note to an open string (a common technique for walking bass lines).

These are two useful but different techniques. You should learn to do both.

I hope this helps.

Tony
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  #5  
Old 09-22-2006, 01:10 PM
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Tony, I don't really see the differnce in what you are saying.
Basically you either "flick" while pulling off, or you don't. It all depends on what sound you want. I think it is all the same thing, and just expirament with it. "Flick" hard for certain things, and not so hard or not at all for others. It is both the same, the only thing that changes is how hard you "flick" the string.
  #6  
Old 09-22-2006, 02:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PrimusNut
Tony, I don't really see the differnce in what you are saying.
Basically you either "flick" while pulling off, or you don't. It all depends on what sound you want. I think it is all the same thing, and just expirament with it. "Flick" hard for certain things, and not so hard or not at all for others. It is both the same, the only thing that changes is how hard you "flick" the string.
Primus,

Yes, the difference between the two techniques is that one has additional articulation from the fretting hand, and the other doesn't.

That's what makes them different. The two techniques produce a different sound. As a result there are two different names.

Hey, this is nothing. If you play a classical string instrument there are more than a dozen different types of bowing techniques (all with their own names).

Cheers!

Tony
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  #7  
Old 09-22-2006, 02:47 PM
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+1 Tony. If you examine how you play today carefully you will realize that you do "lift offs" all the time in your playing. These are really the fretted equivilent of a fretless player sliding a stroked note up to a next note on the same string to an unstruck finish. There is also the opposite where rather than "lifting off the note" you are fretting the next note on the same string without hammering on or striking the string again, sort of a soft note if you will.
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Old 09-22-2006, 07:59 PM
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I understand what you mean, Tony, and i wasnt trying to bash your post, rather, trying to bash whoever started calling the 2 dif things. lol

12 dif techniques? wow, i get confused playing how i play.
  #9  
Old 09-22-2006, 09:40 PM
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Lifted-Off & Pulled-Off are not the same...

Quote:
Originally Posted by PrimusNut
I understand what you mean, Tony, and i wasnt trying to bash your post, rather, trying to bash whoever started calling the 2 dif things. lol
Well... actually, that would probably be me, since I coined the phrase "Lifted-Off Notes" in my book Slap It! more than 25 years ago. Maybe the name existed before, but I hadn't seen it anywhere. I had to come up with a way to describe what I was doing in my slap technique.

I was going to use Pull-Off, but then I realized what I was describing was different than a Pull-Off (but we've already covered that).

Quote:
Originally Posted by PrimusNut
12 dif techniques? wow, i get confused playing how i play.
Yes, more than 12, and that's only bow techniques. It doesn't include other articulations techniques without the bow.

Cheers!

Tony
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  #10  
Old 09-22-2006, 10:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tony Oppenheim
Well... actually, that would probably be me, since I coined the phrase "Lifted-Off Notes" in my book Slap It! more than 25 years ago. Maybe the name existed before, but I hadn't seen it anywhere. I had to come up with a way to describe what I was doing in my slap technique.
Very interesting, Tony. I always thought you used the term "lift-off" (L) to avoid confusion with popped notes, which would share the same notation with "pull off" (P).
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  #11  
Old 09-23-2006, 02:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alvaro Martín Gómez A.
Very interesting, Tony. I always thought you used the term "lift-off" (L) to avoid confusion with popped notes, which would share the same notation with "pull off" (P).
Alvaro,

Hi! Nice to hear from you again!

I went thru a few different lettering schemes, but a Lifted-Off note was always an "L" (once I decided to use letters) since it didn't conflict with anything.

...but you know, I wasn't going to use letters at all originally.

I thought about adopting bow markings from my string bass studies. If I remember correctly the idea was to use only three markings:

Down bow for a down stroke with the thumb
Up bow for an up stroke with the thumb*
A Staccato or Accent mark for a popped note

Hammered and Lifted notes would be indicated only by a slur, they wouldn't get a special slap marking.

I remember that this system appealed to me because it was all standard notation, but then there was a problem because of Hammered-On Dead Notes and Double Plucking or Popping.

Consider a Dead note on the E string played with the Thumb followed by a Dead note also on the E string that was Hammered-On (a Left Hand Slap). It wouldn't make sense to use a Slur because since the dead notes would be the same pitch it would read as a Tie rather than a Slur, which would be confusing since there would be two articulations. I didn't want to use a standard notation symbol in a way that conflicted with what every musician was taught.

On the other hand, instead of T for thumb, I wondered if it should be S for Slap (it is called "Slap Bass" after all), but then what would I use for a Slide, so I ruled that out.

Also, before I decided to mark every note I thought about using S for Snap (rather than P for Pop), but again, when I decided to mark every note I needed that S back for Slide again.

Anyway, I kept coming back to the system I'm still using today.

T = Thumb
P = Pop (usually first finger, but can be a double stop)
H = Hammer
L = Lift
S = Slide

In order to incorporate other techniques I've also added the following for some of my newer slap lines:

U = Upstroke with Thumb
P2 = Pop with second finger only
P3 = Pop with third finger only
PO = Pull-off (and here I'm referring to the left hand pull off)

Anyway, that's where it stands for me these days.

Cheers!

Tony


* Those of you who are familiar with my stuff know that Slap It! doesn't have any double thumb lines, but I went to school at Berklee with a bunch of great slap players who all had incorporated double thumb into their playing, so I figured I'd have to account for it in my notation system even if I was double thumb challenged myself
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  #12  
Old 09-23-2006, 02:34 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tony Oppenheim
Alvaro,

Hi! Nice to hear from you again!
Same here, Tony. Thank you for your insight!
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  #13  
Old 09-24-2006, 08:57 PM
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Cool, thanks everyone for the tips. Thank you Tony for posting on my tread! Much appreciated! (p.s. I bought your book, I think you know where I am in it )

Now I have to practise practise and practise
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