Long time busy players (not in terms of work), how do you reel it in?

rob_d · #1 08-20-2010, 05:39 AM

I've been playing for a long time and studied a lot of the fingerstyle funk stuff as I was developing (Rocco, Jamerson, Pastorius, etc...). I also liked a lot of the more technical/progressive rock. The thing is as I'm getting older I find myself more attracted to "simpler" music. I hate to use the phrase "more mellow," so I'll use simpler instead. But I think you get the drift.

I guess my point and my question is this:

For those that have played a busier style for a long time where it is sort of ingrained in you, have you ever tried consciously or unconsciously to mellow your sound out? Kind of lay it back I guess? It's something I've been mentally focusing on as I play gigs lately, and I've found it to be quite rewarding when I've hit that level of just being simple enough to fit in. The space you create is very rewarding when you hit it right.

Too funny. I just realized that most people are on this forum are asking about how to gain chops and I'm asking how to lose them!

The Bassmonkey · #2 08-20-2010, 06:34 AM

By busy bassist i generally think straight to lots of fretwork and wandering basslines. If i want to mellow or play more simply, i just play less notes. Hit the root notes, a couple of funky fills here and there, and mybe some octave work to keep it interesting.....hmmm ok so not so simple afterall....sorry

crobasster · #3 08-20-2010, 07:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rob_d

I've been playing for a long time and studied a lot of the fingerstyle funk stuff as I was developing (Rocco, Jamerson, Pastorius, etc...). I also liked a lot of the more technical/progressive rock. The thing is as I'm getting older I find myself more attracted to "simpler" music. I hate to use the phrase "more mellow," so I'll use simpler instead. But I think you get the drift.

I guess my point and my question is this:

For those that have played a busier style for a long time where it is sort of ingrained in you, have you ever tried consciously or unconsciously to mellow your sound out? Kind of lay it back I guess? It's something I've been mentally focusing on as I play gigs lately, and I've found it to be quite rewarding when I've hit that level of just being simple enough to fit in. The space you create is very rewarding when you hit it right.

Too funny. I just realized that most people are on this forum are asking about how to gain chops and I'm asking how to lose them!

You're becoming true player.

Bruce Lindfield · #4 08-20-2010, 08:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rob_d

I've been playing for a long time and studied a lot of the fingerstyle funk stuff as I was developing (Rocco, Jamerson, Pastorius, etc...). I also liked a lot of the more technical/progressive rock. The thing is as I'm getting older I find myself more attracted to "simpler" music. I hate to use the phrase "more mellow," so I'll use simpler instead. But I think you get the drift.

I guess my point and my question is this:

For those that have played a busier style for a long time where it is sort of ingrained in you, have you ever tried consciously or unconsciously to mellow your sound out? Kind of lay it back I guess? It's something I've been mentally focusing on as I play gigs lately, and I've found it to be quite rewarding when I've hit that level of just being simple enough to fit in. The space you create is very rewarding when you hit it right.

Too funny. I just realized that most people are on this forum are asking about how to gain chops and I'm asking how to lose them!

This happened to me and I had a complete change of heart from playing loads of notes to trying to play as few as possible!

But there was definitely a trick there!

So what caused the shift, was taking up acoustic Double Bass !!

This really makes you think differently about every aspect of your playing!

Billnc · #5 08-20-2010, 10:43 AM

Other things become more complex as we progress, nuances, rythmic placement, the ability to play notes other than the root and make things work etc. I save the fancier stuff for fast unison lines or the like. My goal has always been to play as tastefully on bass as Jim Hall does on guitar. He's no speed demon, but he's one of the best guys on the planet. Of course I've got a long way to go.

scatbass · #6 08-20-2010, 10:50 AM

I was pretty much the same way - started on Rush/Maiden, etc 20 years ago. These days I almost prefer to play the laid back 4 chord songs. It might just be a natural evolution as a musician?

codeinedreams · #7 08-20-2010, 06:50 PM

I think about that a lot. I let the song dictate how busy I play. sometimes overall tone is more important than busy fretwork, and some songs or parts of songs call for longer sustained notes. interpreting the mood of the song is definitely key to knowing when to back off. also knowing what to accent is important - like, if the singer is singing an important melody and you want the listener to focus on that, then that would be a time to back off and play in a way that supports that melody instead of adding counterpoint or flashy playing that takes away from it. what helped me was to listen to recordings of myself playing with the band. that way you can step outside of yourself and analyze objectively what's working and what isn't. -unless you just want to kick back in general, in that case, go for it

JimmyM · #8 08-20-2010, 11:04 PM

i realized that i would get fewer gigs if i didn't know when to say when. when i was 19, there was this popular working rock band in town that their bassist recommended me to as a sub on some gigs, and the guitarist said to me before he hired me, "i hear you're really good but you overplay." i told him i liked to play busy, but i could reel it in if i needed to. he ended up calling me every time the other guy was out.

DWBass · #9 08-20-2010, 11:17 PM

What's a 'long time' for you? Most old school players don't play busy, IME. I've been playing since 1972 and have also done a ton of studio work which lends itself to playing straight and steady.

bigsack · #10 08-20-2010, 11:36 PM

i think it all depends on the music you play.
i never liked busy players in rock music.
then again i don't like a bass player who play simple
lines in jazz.
every song you play should be like food.
i usually like to be the stake,
big simple and heavy on your digest system

Billnc · #11 08-21-2010, 09:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigsack

i think it all depends on the music you play.
i never liked busy players in rock music.
then again i don't like a bass player who play simple
lines in jazz.
every song you play should be like food.
i usually like to be the stake,
big simple and heavy on your digest system

may your bass playing never cause a farty digestive problem!

laklandplayer · #12 08-21-2010, 10:07 AM

Become a student of ALL of the different musical styles and analyze function of the bass in each style. This will help you learn what to play in the proper context. All styles have a "basics" on which to build from. The rest is up to your ability, creativity and musicianship.
Done in earnest it will eventually broaden your musical horizons and your ability to cover more diverse gigs.

eli · #13 08-21-2010, 12:48 PM

WOW, this is a fascinating thread. I do think it has to do with musical maturity (not necessarily chronological maturity).

My "aha" moment came when I went to see a band with two guys from my high school, some 15 years after high school. The band was a rockabilly band, and the bass player was "the" bass player from my graduating class. He was very technically facile, and clearly was able to do pretty much whatever he wanted to. But what he played was basically improvising the whole time, and he never really settled into playing a repeating line that is a hallmark of much of that type of music. That's when it hit me: playing "fancy" isn't necessarily playing "good". I still tend towards busy, but I have a much clearer sense of playing for the groove and the style of the music at hand.

Billnc · #14 08-21-2010, 01:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eli

WOW, this is a fascinating thread. I do think it has to do with musical maturity (not necessarily chronological maturity).

My "aha" moment came when I went to see a band with two guys from my high school, some 15 years after high school. The band was a rockabilly band, and the bass player was "the" bass player from my graduating class. He was very technically facile, and clearly was able to do pretty much whatever he wanted to. But what he played was basically improvising the whole time, and he never really settled into playing a repeating line that is a hallmark of much of that type of music. That's when it hit me: playing "fancy" isn't necessarily playing "good". I still tend towards busy, but I have a much clearer sense of playing for the groove and the style of the music at hand.

I think that's key to the whole thing. No matter how busy the line, there must be a sort or theme built on repetition. Just as the melodic line repeats but is subject to interpretation, the bassline may also. You can get fancy within the framework, the danger of the less mature player is getting fancy and random. I've always prefered a melodic bass line that can stand on its own, yet supports the song. All parts of a song should be interesting.

stratovani · #15 08-22-2010, 07:29 AM

How do I reel it in? Simple. I switch to my P-Bass. Its longer scale and wider neck makes it difficult for me to be really busy, so my basslines tend to be simpler. But when I want to cut loose, I switch to my Hofner Icon. Its lighter gauge strings, shorter scale and narrower neck makes it much easier for me to play fast and busy.

eli · #16 08-22-2010, 09:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stratovani

How do I reel it in? Simple. I switch to my P-Bass. Its longer scale and wider neck makes it difficult for me to be really busy, so my basslines tend to be simpler. But when I want to cut loose, I switch to my Hofner Icon. Its lighter gauge strings, shorter scale and narrower neck makes it much easier for me to play fast and busy.

That is just what Paul McCartney said... about those two instruments EXACTLY. You're in fine company!

LilRay · #17 08-22-2010, 09:53 AM

Funny you post this. Here's my situation; I've been playing close to 20 years, not professionally but seriously (min 2 hrs daily). All along I thought I was a fairly decent player, until I joined TB

. I know there'll always be guys with more ability and or talent, BUT as far as me personally, I started posting sound clips to share here.

In doing so I realize a lot of the things I've played for years although funky etc, were severely out of time or not clean.

I've since "rebooted" with the focus being "clean" rather than fancy or busy.

Clean trumps busy all day everyday IMO.

God Bless, Ray

BassChuck · #18 08-22-2010, 10:31 AM

Concentrate as much on the tone as the notes. Try limiting yourself to 'x' number of notes a measure. Pay close attention to how your line interacts with the lead line, and/or how it interacts with rhythm guitar or keys. A well chosen note is as effective as a well played phrase.

Reallize that what you are doing is all about the music and not you. Take pleasure from being part of the team.

Jefenator · #19 08-22-2010, 10:51 AM

What did it for me was listening to vintage New Orleans R&B. That music sounds SO good to me and the bass parts are SO simple.

Without that crucial motivation, I'd probably still be that guy who gets fired all the time.

hennessybass · #20 08-22-2010, 11:09 AM

Music is just like visual art... there is positive and negative space. Think of a black and white drawing or a photograph. The object is positive, and background is negative. Negative space is essential to create contrast for the positive space to stand out. One of the first things you learn about photography is don't have a cluttered background - it makes for a bad photograph. Apply this same principal to music. Positive space is the notes you play, and negative space is the rest or silence.

The notes you don't play are just as important (if not more important) than the notes you do play!!!