To look or not to look

[tobie]

As a 1-month rookie I still look quite a bit at the left hand during play. Not only to check that my fingers stay close to the strings, but also to know where I'm fretting. I have never seen a 'pro' look at the neck during play, but how do I get there? I've tried not to look at occasions, with mixed success.

Does it come naturally with time, or should I intentionally work at not visually monitoring the left hand?

[PoundinThunder]

i look, i dont have to, but i do. maybe its habit. but i like to see where i want to go. i did a lot of eye to ear connecting when i first played and i know what the note will sound like if i look at a certain fret based on octaves and stuff. i have very little formal training (i learned the cycle of fifths and how to play hound dog" lol then i stopped going to college :/

dont forget about your right hand tho.

edit- i look when i am soloing or something along those lines. but i dont look when i am playing a song i wrote or know well.

[DeanT]

It'll come naturally over time, after you get more familiar with the fretboard and where your fingers should be.

But don't worry about it. There's no shame in looking if you want to/have to. Even the pros do it sometimes. If you feel more comfortable looking at this point, then do it. In time you will find that you are looking less and less.

[KsToaDangr]

Originally Posted by tobie

As a 1-month rookie I still look quite a bit at the left hand during play. Not only to check that my fingers stay close to the strings, but also to know where I'm fretting. I have never seen a 'pro' look at the neck during play, but how do I get there? I've tried not to look at occasions, with mixed success.

Does it come naturally with time, or should I intentionally work at not visually monitoring the left hand?

think about it this way: most "pro" musicians have played the same songs over and over again for a long while. If you're just learning a song, you're probably going to have to look at what you're playing for a while. As you start to get more comfortable playing, your fingers will start to know where they need to be, and you'll be able to look at the crowd instead of the FB.

[onlyclave]

Originally Posted by KsToaDangr

think about it this way: most "pro" musicians have played the same songs over and over again for a long while. If you're just learning a song, you're probably going to have to look at what you're playing for a while. As you start to get more comfortable playing, your fingers will start to know where they need to be, and you'll be able to look at the crowd instead of the FB.

Most "pro" musicians have to read charts on the fly and you can't see the chart if you're staring at your hand. Sometimes they only get one chance to play it so they don't have the luxury of playing it over and over.

It's not a skill that will just come with time; you have to force it to happen. Visualizing the fingerboard as you're practicing is the first step to doing this.

There is no rule that says you can't look. I do it but usually it's when I have to make a shift up or down the neck of a major third or more. Otherwise I can just "see" when my hands are.

[tobie]

Thanks for the replies, guys. I'll not worry too much about it for now, but also focus on not staring at the neck out of pure habbit.

[Munjibunga]

Look when you need to, and don't when you don't. Unlike you, I don't think I've ever watched a pro who didn't look at least some of the time. Many look most of the time.

[TheWalrus]

Funny this should come up. I was just noticing today that I actually play a lot smoother if I don't look. I guess when I'm looking I tend to over-analyze. If I don't look, or watch my right hand instead, I just settle in.

[easyvision]

Originally Posted by tobie

I have never seen a 'pro' look at the neck during play, but how do I get there?

Really? I see pros look all the time

I still look, but that's only because I like visual stimulation. Just sitting watching a wall while practising or looking out to a crowd and only seeing the lights gets boring. So I look at my hands cause I think they look cool when I'm playing

I have to look most of the time when playing my fretless though. Had it for a month or two now but I'm still getting used to fretting it.

I wouldn't worry about it. As others have said, look when you need to. There will be a time where you realise that you don't have to look to know where a fret is. It's all about muscle memory. Your fingers will be used to the spacing and your ear will be used to what sound should come out when your finger is in a certain place.

Best of luck man! You've only been playing for a month. You've got a long and amazing journey ahead of you.

Oh, personally, I think it's great you're thinking about such things now. I've seen way too many bassists where you are who just do their own thing and never think about tried and tested methods. This isn't always a bad thing but it can lead to horrible habits. So keep asking questions! We'll be more than happy to help you out

[NathanB7]

Are there any special techniques that I could do to avoid looking at my hand because since I just started three months ago I do look quite a lot at my left hand.

[Jeff Martinez]

Originally Posted by NathanB7

Are there any special techniques that I could do to avoid looking at my hand because since I just started three months ago I do look quite a lot at my left hand.

Turn off the lights.




Seriously... practice something repetitve, like your favorite scale or arpeggio, with the lights off. Your fingers already know the patterns, so you'll be able to build confidence after mastering scales without looking. Try playing a G-Major scale up and down, and then slide the pattern up one fret and do a G#-Major, etc... Work your way as far up the neck as you can. By sliding up one fret on the root, you'll be more likely to land exactly where you need to be for the next scale. By uising something as familiar as a major scale, your ear will know if you hit the right note or not.

Another thing I've told my students about this method, is to play through your mistakes. Don't get flustered when you hit a wrong note, just keep going. A big part of playing without looking is the confidence. If you panic and look at the fretboard whenever you make a mistake, you'll make more mistakes, because you'll then become self-concious about looking. If you hit a wrong note, just move on to the next one. Your ear will know where to go. Plus, if you're on stage and make a big deal about looking at your hand when you make a mistake, you'll draw attention to the mistake. Even the pros make mistakes, they just keep going like they meant to do it.

[tobie]

Originally Posted by easyvision

Really? I see pros look all the time

I don't know how I'm missing those - the one bassist in our church band never appears to be looking - but he has to concentrate so much that the expression on his face is priceless!

Originally Posted by easyvision

Best of luck man! You've only been playing for a month. You've got a long and amazing journey ahead of you.

Thanks - I quickly became aware of that as I got going!

Originally Posted by easyvision

I think it's great you're thinking about such things now. I've seen way too many bassists where you are who just do their own thing and never think about tried and tested methods. This isn't always a bad thing but it can lead to horrible habits. So keep asking questions! We'll be more than happy to help you out

Thanks again - forums like these with feedback from guys like yourself make it so much more achievable! Yes, it can't replace an instructor (which I can't get hold of, anyway), but one still knows which of the stacks and stacks of faulty techniques and misconceptions to focus on and eliminate - and how it's supposed to be done!

[outtolunch]

Originally Posted by NathanB7

Are there any special techniques that I could do to avoid looking at my hand because since I just started three months ago I do look quite a lot at my left hand.

Practice reading music. You'll win a lot of coordination. Start reading something easy that doesn't require position changes. Next step will be short position changes, and so on.

[dvh]

I spend a lot of time looking except on very repetetive or familiar lines.

I'm a very visually-oriented person. If I look away I often am distracted by what I'm looking at and my fingers "forget" where they are. If I watch what I am playing I am more into it. Doesn't look "rock". May not look "pro". That's just how it is.

Strange as it sounds this is especially true for fretted. On fretless I look away more. I think this is because if your finger lands on a fret you get a farty buzz. My intonation is pretty good and there's no need to worry about landing on a fret with the fretless (obviously). It's also because I'm more likely to have a chart in front of me when playing fretless.

[easyvision]

Originally Posted by tobie

Thanks again - forums like these with feedback from guys like yourself make it so much more achievable! Yes, it can't replace an instructor (which I can't get hold of, anyway), but one still knows which of the stacks and stacks of faulty techniques and misconceptions to focus on and eliminate - and how it's supposed to be done!

Happy to help! I definitely advise playing with no light. I had a power outage once during my early days. I just kept on playing unplugged haha. That helped a lot.

Oh and I'll leave you with a quote from Victor Wooten that's stuck with me since I heard it.

"You're only ever one half step away from the 'right note'."

Knock yourself out and enjoy yourself! If you don't think you're awesome, no-one else is going to!(my pre-stage mantra)

[NathanB7]

Thanks for the advice Jeff (I mean the one with the favourite song not the one with turning the lights off ) I'll try that right away.

[namraj]

I'm in a professional wedding band, and therefore a professional bass player (admittedly a young one but still..) I don't spend a gig looking at my hand, (how would you connect with the audience) however a glance is sometimes required just to check that when I'm moving from playing a riff on the 7th fret for the verse to a groove on the 1st for the chorus for example, I can hit it without looking, but the glance just adds a little confidence.

Moral of the story: Don't be afraid to look if you're not sure, but don't look because you can't be bothered to feel, connect with your audience and the groove will come naturally.

[Jake of Bass]

Originally Posted by onlyclave

Most "pro" musicians have to read charts on the fly and you can't see the chart if you're staring at your hand. Sometimes they only get one chance to play it so they don't have the luxury of playing it over and over.

It's not a skill that will just come with time; you have to force it to happen. Visualizing the fingerboard as you're practicing is the first step to doing this.

That's a great point and mental technique to use. Playing over unfamiliar charts your eyes are glued to the page so you haven't got time to look at your hands without risking losing your spot in the music entirely.

Added to this you should ALWAYS use correct technique whenever you practice. This involves the thumb being your pivot and assigning a finger to each fret (which is keeping in position), thus reducing hand movement and let your "fingers do the walking". With time and familiarity it becomes easier, and you'll know where you are at any given point of the fretboard all the more.

For example, if you're playing a part that involves 2nd-5th frets (like the C major scale starting on C, 3rd fret 'A' string) then your index to pinky fingers will play notes on only the fret that keeps you in position (index/2nd - middle/3rd - ring/4th - pinky/5th). Playing any notes within that position becomes easier to visualise and requires less thought, but perhaps more practice to get used to using correct technique. It's much more beneficial for your playing all round though, and a bit of extra practice never hurt anyone

[sonic assassin]

i cant offer "pro" experience, but ill say that in my 3 years of playing shows, ive practiced my look cues as much as i have my singing cues, my improv cues and my freakout cues.

there are certain times when i know im supposed to look. either hand. ill watch my picking (fingering?) hand too if needed. so i know which part of the songs i can get away with making eye contact and not missing anything. i know when ive got room to throw in extra stuff. i know when im supposed to be near my mic. and i most definitely know which parts of which songs are meant to be thrashing about.

i cant see anyone but a singer making constant eye contact. theres no reason. make your glances, scan the crowd, cool. after about 10 seconds.. whats there to look at?

im personally not bothered by musicians who concentrate. ive seen bands who stare at their instruments the entire time and give a flawless, soulful performance. but thats just me.. i get less into lights and theatrics, and more about accuracy. which is why every time i try a rock star move and miss a note because of it, im pretty mad at myself. im notorious for the "holding my bass straight up and playing at the moon" move.. which i can never seem to do right.

so the point is, it will come in time, and dont worry about it. and when you start playing stages, dont feel the need to NOT look at what you're doing. let the singer glare at people, you just worry about doing your job the best you can and having fun.

[Jake of Bass]

Well, as far as performance and worrying about how you'll look staring at your instrument, bands like The Cure, Velvet Underground and Sonic Youth have made illustrious careers from influencing the whole "shoegazing" thing.