Make the drummer funky???

Biddy · #1 05-02-2011, 05:59 PM

So I started jamming with a group of guys (3 guitars, 1 drummer). The drummer is pretty tense/tight, straight-up driving rock. I offered "Chameleon" (Herbie Hancock), and "Church" (Galactic), but he made them both anything but funky.

I can't change the man, but I'm wondering if y'all had any clever ideas for how to make him sound funkier (loaded question I'm sure).

Play behind him?? Play ahead of him?? Play only on the 1... that type stuff.

We're gonna meet up again sometime this weekend so I'll experiment myself, just thought I'd see what TB has to offer.

Oh, and there aren't a lot of other options around here that I can commit to right now (small kids, work, wife works 80 hrs/week!). I'm gonna keep jamming with them because it's better than nothing!

Thanks for your input.

BigOldHarry · #2 05-02-2011, 06:09 PM

Some dudes CAN NOT SWING.

One of the groups I work with has that problem... Drummer is a straight blues/rock guy - good meter, very restrained... but he thinks "Funk" is Disco. Sad. Makes playing funk tunes with him a bit of a bummer.

Biddy · #3 05-02-2011, 06:11 PM

You have no tricks to funk it up?? Or do you just grin and bear it?

BigOldHarry · #4 05-02-2011, 06:19 PM

At first, I tried to nudge him, poke & prod, try to get him to find the pocket... but he appears to be one of those "proud to be straight" kinda guys. Arrrrg. So I just suck it up and get my pay. Were this *my* band, I'd ax him but it isn't - I'm just the bassist getting paid. You'd think the rest of the band would notice, but I get the sense that they're all "old friends" and so they tolerate his groovelessness. Sad.

Biddy · #5 05-02-2011, 06:29 PM

Ha. The funny thing is these guys like me! They think we make a "tight rhythm section." His time is good, just straight as an arrow. I need a laid back feel, it's just more fun that way... I'm sure I'm preaching to the choir though.

Haven't known this fella long enough to make any suggestions.

My approach next meeting will be to hang back a bit... maybe only land on the 1... see if that makes it funky.

type C basses · #6 05-02-2011, 07:30 PM

I prescribe one song by The Meters.

Biddy · #7 05-03-2011, 07:41 AM

Tried Cissy Strut... awful. It seemed like he just kept speeding it up.

jkramer5 · #8 05-03-2011, 07:52 AM

square peg, round hole man. I play with a drummer with a similar but different "challenge" His idea of funk is the fast RHCP kind of thing. Not that that isn't funky but it's the only style he does. If we do start off anywhere in the 100bpm or below area, he eventually tries to double time. We've talked about it, I've shared hours of MP3 of classic stuff with him, but just about the time it starts to lock in and groove and sweat, up comes a fill and a double time. It's like his thermostat has no simmer setting, just off to boil.

prd004 · #9 05-03-2011, 07:57 AM

You can't fake the funk, either you have it or you don't. Every once in a blue moon you'll find a guy who had it but didn't know it, but that's like finding a unicorn.

Bulky Bass · #10 05-03-2011, 07:58 AM

Give him "Say It Loud-James Brown Live 1969", if he can't learn those drum parts, it's never gonna work.

Blake Bass · #11 05-03-2011, 08:02 AM

suggest some tunes / bands for him to listen to. Tower of Power and James Brown for starters!

joshmat · #12 05-03-2011, 08:09 AM

Sounds like your drummer needs a funky ball of teats... YouTube - A Funk's Life

jaywa · #13 05-03-2011, 08:18 AM

Yup. Time and feel (i.e., swing) are two completely different things.

The best drummers have both attributes... yours, apparently has only the first quality.

When I'm paired with a drummer who is painfully "straight" in the feel department (which usually coincides with a tendency to play right on top of the beat if not rush), I try to widen the pocket by intentionally playing behind him. Drag the beat slightly and if the rest of the band looks at you like, "pick it up, man" just stand there and smile and keep holding it back.

It's damn hard work and not a lot of fun... but it can help your band make something resembling music instead of everyone blindly following the drummer over a cliff of blinding white-ness.

Good luck, bro.

Biddy · #14 05-03-2011, 08:26 AM

Thanks jaywa, that's kinda what I was thinking... it will be painful though. It doesn't help that 2 of the guitarists can't swing either... very metal.

Again, my current situations prevents me from being too picky with who I can play with. Something is better than nothing! Maybe it'll give me a chance to experiment... or just nail my 16th note endurance!

jaywa · #15 05-03-2011, 08:27 AM

Oh and one other thing. These drummer types also tend to be "busy", playing more notes and fills than needed, so by no means try to "match" or "top" him in that respect. You'll just wind up with both halves of the rhythm section overplaying if that happens.

bigthor · #16 05-03-2011, 08:27 AM

Thor Say:
You can do many things to help your drum man but, playing with a bad drummer will eventually, if not sooner mess with your groove. The thing about the “Funk” is like dharma. You have to realize it on your own. Its kinda hard to show somebody the funk. A good place to start is with your self. Get your timing down, leave a good amount of space and relax. If you make your groovy funk all thick and syrupy the drum man as well as the rest of the band will have no choice but to fall in.

jaywa · #17 05-03-2011, 08:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Biddy

Thanks jaywa, that's kinda what I was thinking... it will be painful though. It doesn't help that 2 of the guitarists can't swing either... very metal.

This is a great point. A true "rhythm" guitarist who has great time and feel (think Nile Rogers) is essentially like having a second drummer and can be an invaluable ally in salvaging a situation where the actual drummer's not quite making it. But if the guitarists are following the questionable drummer... yikes.

It sounds like the deck is stacked against you... but hang in there and maybe over time things will start coming together.

Mushroo · #18 05-03-2011, 08:34 AM

Maybe he's just not familiar with the songs/style? Buy him a copy of Flood and see what happens...

Conversely, maybe you can do some listening of your own, to bands who have successfully merged the funk & rock genres?

Biddy · #19 05-03-2011, 08:35 AM

More good stuff... didn't really think about how the guitarists were "helping" the drummer. Like I said, I've only jammed with these guys once, but they've been playing together for a while... without a bassist. I'll give 'em a few more nights to see if they can groove!

Biddy · #20 05-03-2011, 08:36 AM

Mushroo... Funk/Rock bands such as...?