Not using pinky - I have a problem :(

[Konata]

Well, first thread for me on what appears to be a great forum!

Anyway, I'll get to the point.

I've been playing bass for about six years now (mainly complex lines/slapping/popping), but I've kinda hit a wall at the moment, and I'm placing the blame on my pinky finger.

I was in the middle of learning Super Computer by Atomic Bitchwax, and I realised how much easier it would be if I could use my pinky. The thing is, my pinky bends back at pretty much a right angle (see pictures, it's pretty gross..), which makes it pretty much impossible to use (without feeling some kind of pain..)





ewwww

My questions are:
Is it possible to be a "great" bass player only using three fingers?

Does anyone else exclude their pinky, and only use three fingers? If so, are there any exercizes for getting the ring finger to stretch freakishly far?

Also, if anyone else has this weird inverted pinky problem, please discuss your experiences! My index finger does the same thing, but that doesn't cause any problems at all.

Thanks.

[whysolow]

Welcome!
It looks to me that you are using too much the pad of the finger and applying too much pressure. Try curling your fingers a bit more and using more the tip of the finger. Also, your thumb is showing too much. Onto the questions: I think you lose a lot by using only 3 fingers when you have 4, imagine using 1 leg to walk instead of 2, you can get to the other side of the street but hell it's a lot harder. I use all my fingers when fretting. Hope my answer was useful

[project43]

Agreed! Also, speed & accuracy will be difficult if your index finger is also bending like that. Look at my finger position in this photo. You don't have to be a carbon copy, everyone is different. But, I think you need to address this now as it will create more problems down the road. Frank

[Mayers]

I really think your problem is your hand position. All your fingers are bend sideways and your thumb is almost on the top of the bass. I think all that can slow you down and make your hand collapse.

look at a classical guitar player or upright player to see very very good hand positionning.

[Gearhead17]

The other guys are on the right path. I suggest bringing your thumb towards the middle of the back of the neck. Try to keep some space between your thumb and palm of the hand.

When I learned how to use my pinkie, I started out really slowly and worked my way up and down the fretboard doing the "one finger per fret" rule. It took a while before my pinkie was strong enough, but I got there. Actually, I still struggle with getting the ring finger and pinkie to work together. In the last two weeks though, I have made huge strides. Work at it slowly and do not push too hard against the strings.

[Konata]

Ah sorry about the second photo, that was just showing the pinky on the string as an example. The three fingers I use, I do use the tips rather than the pad parts, although, my thumb does hang over the top quite a bit. In fact, now that I've noticed it, my thumb never leaves the top of the fretboard.. It even rests on the E string when I'm playing on ADG.

It's not too much pressure that's causing it to buckle - that's pressing it as lightly as possible, but not causing any buzzing, haha. D:

I'll try and play in a straighter position, and try not to let my fingers get so angled. I guess it's just going to be a case of breaking bad habits, and strengthening up the ol' pinky (I get quite a sharp pain across my palm when I try and use it curled, rather than buckled).

Thanks for the input!

[Liam Wald]

You really need to learn to use the tips of your fingers not the pad (where your finger print is) to push the strings down.
I just checked and my finger would bend just like yours if I used the pad to push the string down.
Also, it would be best not to wrap your hand around the neck.
Might be worth spending a few bucks and have a good teacher help you learn this.

[Marty Forrer]

The others are right, you have bad technique (no offense intended). Imagine holding a can of cola (or beer!) in your left hand. Take the can away and apply that hand shape to your neck, with the thumb in the middle of the back of the neck.

[Konata]

No offence taken at all - it's all good advice! The beer can advice was good. I'll use my thumb to support the fretboard, rather than my palm.

Using my pinky tip seems to be working so far, but I'm really gonna have to work on the accuracy. It's slipping all over the place at the moment..

If I can't get the hang of it, I might find a local bass teacher for some advice. Looks like I've been teaching myself in a bad way..

[WilliamSandoval]

Past teachers/ band mates have always told me to use my pinky. I don't know why... I mean, my ring finger stretches further than pinky can!

[henry2513]

YouTube - ‪JOHN PATITUCCI Bass Workshop 1 2 Hand Positioning‬‏ take a look, that might help.

[project43]

WilliamSandoval,
It is not so much the reach or stretch but the position playing that can be achieved with all four fingers. Granted, it won't apply equally to all players or all types of music. And when I say this, I am not knocking either one. But, if as Konata asks, can you be a great player with just three, of course it is possible, it will be, in general, easier to do so with four. There are many lines in the tunes that I perform that would be very difficult to play well without four finger positioning. That said, when I play something that can allow me to rest a bit, I will switch to three (although that usually involves the pinky supported by the ring finger). The bottom line is to not limit yourself if possible. When it comes down to it, whatever works for you in a given situation is fine as long as it is not doing physical damage that will catch up with you over the years. Frank

[MikeBC]

Many lead guitarists seem to rely mainly on 3 fingers. Some of the best seem to use all 4. So I think it is possible to be good with only 3. Don't recommend it. As hard as it may be at first, in the long run it is easy to use 4.

The picture aside, from your written description it seems your hand position is not correct. True there is that whatever works for you axiom but I wonder if the overall hand position has something to do with the pain you feel in your pinky when you try to position it correctly.

First it may be that you are gripping the neck too tightly.

Second is may be that your wrist is still more collapsed than not.

Third, unless you have giant hands like Hendrix, your hand is too far around if the thumb is always resting on the fingerboard. Of course you could learn to use your thumb to fret the bottom two strings. Nah, wait until you have the standard hand and position down.

When playing, you do not need to grip the neck tightly at all. (Assuming you are using a strap.)

If you know any violin (violin, not fiddle) or viola players ask them to demonstrate left hand position. Then ask them to help you. Your hand position will be a little different because you are not holding the instrument under your chin but they can help you as could a double bass player. The shape should be the same if not the actual orientation.

Good luck.

[Billnc]

for various reasons, you would need to be very careful if the three fingers you used were 1 2 and 3. Far safer to use 1 3 and 4.

[WilliamSandoval]

Originally Posted by Billnc

for various reasons, you would need to be very careful if the three fingers you used were 1 2 and 3. Far safer to use 1 3 and 4.

how so? I have yet to play a song where I would have to use my pinky.

[makkE]

Originally Posted by Konata

It's not too much pressure that's causing it to buckle - that's pressing it as lightly as possible, but not causing any buzzing, haha. D:

I think noone has mentioned yet, that you are fretting at the wrong point too. Always fret close to the fret, not just somewhere inbetween the frets. The closer you are to the fret, the less strengh you'll need to fret, even if your action is a bit on the higher side. If you fret where you do in that pic, of course you'll need a lot of power to avoid buzz.

[john grey]

Originally Posted by WilliamSandoval

how so? I have yet to play a song where I would have to use my pinky.

That's actually a very logical position (no pun intended). In the past there are many people who have discussed the action height of a stringed instrument and advantages to a higher or lower action.

From a personal perspective I try to setup my equipment as low as possible.
The video above had an interesting statement regarding "economy of movement" and I deeply agree with that. When a stringed instrument is set to a very low action the touch needed to fret a note become less and the movement from note to note also can be faster.

Perhaps your finger may develop problems in the future; perhaps not. If you work for economy of movement with exacting hand positioning you would accomplish two things. You would have the opportunity to work with 3 finger more efficiently and you would need less pressure to accomplish a fretted note. Consider lowering your action, lightening your strings, and determine if that allows a light enough touch to eliminate you over-extension. If not; then consider that you may want to alter your technique to 3 fingers. Even though it's not ideal - when do we get to call all the shots in this life?

[WilliamSandoval]

I'm saying that pretty much all the songs i can play are usually played by three frets in a row. For example, Black Dog. It uses frets 3,4, and 5. Not 3,4, and 6. So there would be no reason to use my pinky. I don't understand why I wouldn't be able to use my 2nd finger either. It's a finger that I can use, and it's in the perfect position. I have no problem with my action or my finger strength. I just don't need to use my pinky! I don't have to stretch across four frets-- EVER! Doing from C to D# doesn't even sound good!

[Billnc]

Originally Posted by WilliamSandoval

how so? I have yet to play a song where I would have to use my pinky.

It is possible to cause repetitive stress injuries to the hand on a large instrument such as the electric bass if the fingering 1 2 3 is used. It is far safer to use 1 2 4 fingerings in the lower positions of the bass. There are a few threads about this. Carol Kaye and Ed Friedland both recommend 1 2 4 fingering in the lower positions for this reason.

[project43]

WilliamSandoval, Are you saying that you never play in a minor key? Just asking.